TannerDemoz
Member
Nope, played through both on hard. Maybe I'm getting decent stat levels with conquest?
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Fire Emblem Fates |OT| Nohr does what Hoshidon't
- Thread starter Shun
- Start date
Nope, played through both on hard. Maybe I'm getting decent stat levels with conquest?
Velcro Fly
Member
I love when Rinkah has like a 60% chance to hit with a Killer Axe and then like a 52% chance to crit. And a crit is basically going to one shot something.
I love rolling the dice. It is why I play these games
I love rolling the dice. It is why I play these games
on casual
Lumination
'enry 'ollins
Her strength growth is... fair. Her defense however gets monstrous. And I quite like her passive to compensate for her lack of strength.
RocketDarkness
Member
Rinkah turned out interesting on my playthrough. Even through her strength was excessively mediocre, her defense was absurd, and when she became a Chieftain and gained access to scrolls, I got her up to D-rank and gave her a forged Horse Spirit (+3 DEF/RES). Combined with her ability to Seal Resistance, she actually became a pretty dangerous mage, and was nigh-unkillable to boot. Great for softening up a whole wave of enemies for the slaughter.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Then, as someone who thinks this random stuff is the one and only thing holding Fire Emblem back, please tell me: What is the value in this over a deterministic battle system where you just deal the damage that is being shown? Or if it has to be +-50%. Triple the damage / no damage at all is really infuriating.
Considering you can influence some of those stats with Weapons, buffs and debuffs I would say it adds gameplay depth. Because you try to play that you maximize your own hitrate and minimize the enemy hit rate. If you can't do that, some aspect of the gameplay simply gets lost.
Lumination
'enry 'ollins
Randomness has its place, to a certain extent. Let's say your hitrates float around the 80% range. Now, you need to come up with a plan B and a plan C. You need to not only prepare for the fixed scenario as if there was no rng, but a few more scenarios as well. How deep you go depends on how much you're willing to think and how much you're willing to hedge.
Games that have hitrates that hover around 50% throw this out of the window. At that point, you're flipping coins and gambling. Yes, I'm looking at you, Xcom.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Sölf;208136793 said:
Buffs / Debuffs and positive / negative effects of weapons could still easily be implemented without random elements (attack power, speed, defense, a lot of values that are completely deterministic in their effect could be influenced). The random elements are like a lose-lose situation. If you get a better result because of them, then it is an undeserved victory, because you were just lucky. If you lose a character due to it (and in situations like the boss of Conquest level 26, where a crit would have killed each and every single one of my characters, it definitely is not a matter of a good strategy, but just that one thing: Gambling), then it is just a forced restart by random. Of course, one should always have a look at probabilities and compute beforehand what chain of actions has the least probability of ending in a disaster, but since it cannot be avoided with absolute certainty, I feel it is really damaging the - otherwise outstanding - game.
ShadowSoldier89
Member
this is very much worth doing
Randomness is good to a degree. It forces you to have fallback plans for every action, requiring you to think ahead. Thats a lot of fun and I think some of the best turn based strategy games work that in very well. Valkyria Chronicles is my favorite example.
Fire Emblem in its long history has done better or worse at it. I think fates suffers because some of the maps are so long and the punishment is so severe.
Hmm. This chapter makes me... anxious.
Conquest 19
Conquest 19
Lots and lots of Kitsune and Ninetails. Which wouldn't be THAT bad, until I did a skill check. I expected Beastbane. I mean that's a Kitsune skill, so... yeah. Pass on the other hand is going to be ugly.
I'm just close to deselecting all but Effie and the avatar, pair them up, have Effie equip a Beast Slayer and end turn until it's over. I don't see any way they could beat that, but that's a pretty lame way to win.
I'm just close to deselecting all but Effie and the avatar, pair them up, have Effie equip a Beast Slayer and end turn until it's over. I don't see any way they could beat that, but that's a pretty lame way to win.
The master of arms rallybot from chapter 23 of conquest on lunatic is the best bro in the world. Also lol at the inevitable end ninjas in 25. Niles has shuriken breaker and Benny is rocking 55 defense and 51hp .
This crazy ride is almost over but it's been a hell of a lot of fun.
This crazy ride is almost over but it's been a hell of a lot of fun.
toastyToast
Member
The amount of units on chapter 15 birthright is completely nuts. It's not even a challenge (well it wasn't until I didn't pay attention near the end and Hana got one shot because the game refuses to give her any HP). With animations on I think it's like 90 minutes to kill everything.
edit: no animations and it took all of 20 minutes lol
this plot twist smh
edit: no animations and it took all of 20 minutes lol
this plot twist smh
Really enjoying the Vanguard Dawn DLC, good to see it even has the Radiant Dawn music!
I'm trying it at chapter 25 on Revelations, hard/classic, and it's proving quite challenging- very few of my units can take more than one hit. Have resorted to starting with two falcon knights on the right hand path, then carrying the two other units over to the centre. Both fliers then become mobile healers as my heavy units make a push on the two main choke points. Great stuff.
I'm trying it at chapter 25 on Revelations, hard/classic, and it's proving quite challenging- very few of my units can take more than one hit. Have resorted to starting with two falcon knights on the right hand path, then carrying the two other units over to the centre. Both fliers then become mobile healers as my heavy units make a push on the two main choke points. Great stuff.
Bumbletron
Member
That's where I'm at on my save, I haven't gone back in a few months because every time I do, I have to ask myself if I'd rather just bump difficulty down to normal for the rest. I still have Rev to do too...
That's pretty much the most common way (that I have seen) to tackle that chapter on hard or lunatic unless you have
ninjas or dread fighters using hunters knives
illusion
TannerDemoz
Member
Right, I don't know if this is just me, but a lot of the units I'm getting in Conquest (classic/hard) seem to be stronger than my units, even by the time my declassed have sealed?
After playing on most Fire Emblem games, I usually discard units I acquire later on in the game (with the exception of Jaffar obvs because he is a king), but I'm starting to feel like some of the ones I'm getting early on aren't even worth levelling if I'm going to get an upgraded version of them that also out stats them at the same level?
After playing on most Fire Emblem games, I usually discard units I acquire later on in the game (with the exception of Jaffar obvs because he is a king), but I'm starting to feel like some of the ones I'm getting early on aren't even worth levelling if I'm going to get an upgraded version of them that also out stats them at the same level?
NeonZ
Member
I don't know about "a lot". There's obviously Xander. Camilla also is competitive and even superior to Beruka in some ways. Shura is competitive, but not that good (although Niles' str might be inconsistent sometimes). I guess Izana doesn't suffer from the crippling weaknesses of Odin Dark Mage (low mag) and Nyx (low skl) either, but his offensive power doesn't exactly stand out either. Unless you're counting some of the children with offspring seals? Although, yeah, in general, Conquest's pre-promoted units are good.
Velcro Fly
Member
After paralogue 14 I am going to have a lot of statues to build.
I feel like I could have stayed there forever grinding weapon proficiency and adds would have kept coming.
I feel like I could have stayed there forever grinding weapon proficiency and adds would have kept coming.
TheChocoboCadet
Banned
So I'm playing Conquest Lunatic and I'm at Chapter 25. I was really looking forward to tanking the ninja hallway with Benny (I had already played on Hard), but now I see this bullshit ability Inevitable End on all of the ninjas and I just want to throw the game out the window.
So here's the rub. My level 16 Corrin has received the most insane growths I've ever experienced in a Fire Emblem game. She can literally tank the 1v1 boss here taking 0 damage while having the strength to wipe him out to boot, ninja hallways be damned. My question is, is it worth the hassle of trying to do this chapter correct for a bit more experience, or is Inevitable End going to make this so mind-bogglingly stupid to put up with that I might as well have Corrin solo the chapter?
So here's the rub. My level 16 Corrin has received the most insane growths I've ever experienced in a Fire Emblem game. She can literally tank the 1v1 boss here taking 0 damage while having the strength to wipe him out to boot, ninja hallways be damned. My question is, is it worth the hassle of trying to do this chapter correct for a bit more experience, or is Inevitable End going to make this so mind-bogglingly stupid to put up with that I might as well have Corrin solo the chapter?
At the very least you want to go up the left side until you get the chest with the silence staff. Right side chest has 10k which you may or may not care about.
Either way both hallways and mini bosses are doable with varying degrees of difficulty depending on your team and what skills they have plus what staves you have available.
WhenItsLate
Banned
Finally finished Birthright yesterday and just started Conquest.
Man that last chapter in Birthright was
Gameplay is top notch I have to say and impressive they stepped up on the presentation front even more after Awakening.
Man that last chapter in Birthright was
anticlimactic... Overall I feel really disappointed in the story. Conquest is supposedly worse? Sigh...
Gameplay is top notch I have to say and impressive they stepped up on the presentation front even more after Awakening.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I'm currently in mission 20 on Birthright and what is happening here? I am completely taken aback by how extremely easy this is. I have played Conquest on Hard / Classic before and am playing Birthright right now in the same setting and I reaally want to up the difficulty. There was only one map I had to play twice so far (on the ship, where the flying units
) and I haven't even grinded any, outside of the first few missions to get my support with Kaze up to A... You know why. It's a shame that you cannot up the difficulty. The difference in quality between Conquest and Birthright definitely is huge. The improved mechanics are of course well present in Birthright as well, but the tight mission design, the carefully planned difficulty progression and yes, even the characters, are considerably weaker. Since Conquest is, as I see it, the best Fire Emblem (and by extension, SRPG) I have ever played, this certainly does not mean Birthright is bad, but it is a huge let-down after Conquest.
How is Revelations by comparison, should I go for Lunatic there? Conquest was perfect, at the higher ceiling of what I want difficulty wise, in hard / classic, Birthright is too easy. I don't want to furstrate myself to no end with Lunatic, but I don't want to just walk through it either.
suddenly go after you
How is Revelations by comparison, should I go for Lunatic there? Conquest was perfect, at the higher ceiling of what I want difficulty wise, in hard / classic, Birthright is too easy. I don't want to furstrate myself to no end with Lunatic, but I don't want to just walk through it either.
toastyToast
Member
what kind of sick fuck designed paralogue 7? die in quick sand shiro
I just finished Conquest. Overall I think I prefer Birthright, but that might be because I played it first. I'll take a break before I start Revelation. Either way, I liked the characters in Birthright more. Story-wise, I liked both despite hearing some mixed things beforehand. Nothing really stood out to me as weird or dumb. I enjoyed both stories for what they were.
I'm interested in seeing what questions Revelation will answer.
I'm interested in seeing what questions Revelation will answer.
ShadowSoldier89
Member
I havent finished revelations, but it has been my favorite. Im at like 82 hours on it though, dont be like me.
Definitely take a break though, burnout is definitely going to happen if you jump right in
I stopped playing altogether. I really can't stand the story. It is a serious "I don't care what happens to these people." situation. Gameplay is good, but really, the bad story doesn't make me want to continue. Which is a shame, really: I like the Fire Emblem franchise, but that story is a new low.
Xenoflare
Member
Again, being spoiled inside out is one big plus for this game.
Not on topic but where is your avatar from, I've tried googling various things and can't find the source.
DeployThatPizza
Member
You can always use a rescue staff.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Today I did mission 20 and 21 of Hoshido, but I really don't get the point of mission 20. The enmies couldn't hurt most of my characters at all, so I could just walk through it. Even though there were many enemies coming, what's the point of this chapter? Am I missing something? Is it just to test if someone is so irresponsible to let the healers and Azurra stand in the open? Did I finish the map too early to see what the intended difficulty is? Map 21 was a bit better, due to the lava and the rock throwers, though.
Revelation is just as easy considering you have an OP Corrin that's 10 levels above everyone right from the start and what little difficulty the game had completely disappears once you get both Ryoma and Xander which both laugh at everything the enemies throw their way.
Phantom Flapjack
Member
Slogging my way through Lunatic Conquest. On the Iago chapter, right side cleared and only a couple of stragglers left in the bottom room right before Iago. Decide to send Corrin in to weaken a General using a Dragonstone so Xander can come in and finish it off. General has Counter Magic and a Dragonstone apparently counts as a magic attack for some stupid reason. Corrin dies and I have to restart this crap from the beginning. So, so dumb.
I know that feel.
I actually had to restart 3 times after making it near the end. One time I took on Iago with Corrin and he clipped me with a crit. Ah well, I had it coming since I easily could have killed him with another character and not risk death.
theprodigy
Member
You made it that far in Lunatic Conquest and you didn't know Dragonstone runs off magic?
I'm impressed.
toastyToast
Member
I got it done but it was by pure chance. To use the rescue staff you need to seen a flier deep into the map to even pull him in and another flier so that Ryoma can talk to him and then someone else to pair him up with because he's way too weak if you do the paralogue later in the game. For me he could only survive 1 or 2 turns if I was lucky (a very likely attack missed) and he'd move even further out of range of Rescue on his attacking phase. Don't think it'd be nearly as nightmarish if you did it right after you unlock Ryoma.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Really strange, did they only ever really work on Conquest and then made the other two campaigns as an afterthought? The difference in gameplay quality between Conquest and Birthright is astounding, if Revelations is similar in that regard to Birthright, I really hope that for their next Fire Emblem, they really adhere closely to Conquest.
To be honest, I'm not really feeling Conquest. I'm not done, but so far, I prefer Birthright by a far margin. I will happily admit that Conquest so far has some of the best maps individually, and I think I prefer the Nohr cast of characters, but... would it kill it to just stop piling gimmick after gimmick on top of the game and be Fire Emblem for just ONE map?
Fire Emblem has a pretty solid core gameplay. If you want to play that, play Birthright. It's honest straight up Fire Emblem. Conquest seems too clever for its own good. Some of the maps would be great among a set of normal maps, like that optional stealth mission in Path of Radiance, but when all the maps are special... none of them are. And I just end up wishing I could just cut the gimmicks and play Fire Emblem. When several maps start off with a popup describing what the gimmick is THIS time... it just gets enough. It gets tiring.
Fire Emblem has a pretty solid core gameplay. If you want to play that, play Birthright. It's honest straight up Fire Emblem. Conquest seems too clever for its own good. Some of the maps would be great among a set of normal maps, like that optional stealth mission in Path of Radiance, but when all the maps are special... none of them are. And I just end up wishing I could just cut the gimmicks and play Fire Emblem. When several maps start off with a popup describing what the gimmick is THIS time... it just gets enough. It gets tiring.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I think even with the map specific gimmicks (and a lot of the maps have none), it is still "just playing Fire Emblem", because these gimmicks just prohibit certain strategies and therefore demand to vary the strategy. Birthright certainly is more traditional in its map design, but it also has a ton of maps that are just... work.
Yeah, Birthright has a lot of busywork maps where it's just you and a lot of enemies. But I'm a sucker for war maps. Like Piram's map in Awakening. There's 50 enemies and the objective is Rout. And they're all coming for you from the start. Good luck!
I'd say a optimum blend of Fire Emblem maps for me would be 2/3s as an offshoot of Rout/Defeat Boss/Seize Throne and the rest being one-off special maps, like a stealth mission or defend or escape missions or something really unique. Make the special maps stand out more. No need to feel obliged to do a gimmick on every map. Boring transitional maps are okay to have too. Like storming a castle or something.
I'd say a optimum blend of Fire Emblem maps for me would be 2/3s as an offshoot of Rout/Defeat Boss/Seize Throne and the rest being one-off special maps, like a stealth mission or defend or escape missions or something really unique. Make the special maps stand out more. No need to feel obliged to do a gimmick on every map. Boring transitional maps are okay to have too. Like storming a castle or something.
ShadowSoldier89
Member
so I just finished revelations last night. That final mission is my favorite final mission in the history of fire emblem. Super hype and super fun.
Also mission 27 I walked my avatar forward, killed 1 guy to trigger Galeforce, then walked up and 1 shotted the boss. Galeforce is still incredibly broken, especially when I have 5 characters with it.
Now I just need to play hidden truths and the kid DLCs and I can put Fates aside and move on
TannerDemoz
Member
Need some advice, guys.
Currently on Chapter 17 (Conquest / Classic / Hard) and I've still got units at level 10 I want to level (I've just turned Odin into a Samurai and his stats look hilarious but I want him levelling)
Obvs pairing all my high def units on my lowered ones but due to the speed of the enemies on this map they're still getting battered.
Is there any easy way to train low level units on Conquest? I know on awakening you could download the teams from wireless to parley against, or have I left it too late now for these units?
Any advice would be appreciated!
Cheers
Currently on Chapter 17 (Conquest / Classic / Hard) and I've still got units at level 10 I want to level (I've just turned Odin into a Samurai and his stats look hilarious but I want him levelling)
Obvs pairing all my high def units on my lowered ones but due to the speed of the enemies on this map they're still getting battered.
Is there any easy way to train low level units on Conquest? I know on awakening you could download the teams from wireless to parley against, or have I left it too late now for these units?
Any advice would be appreciated!
Cheers
TheGamingBox
Banned
there is a dlc you can buy that allows exp gain
Dark_castle
Junior Member
Can't say I agree with you. I'm one of those who find rout mission to be stale and uninteresting, which is why I really didn't liked Awakening all that much. Coming from Tellius FE, it's like I'm back at home again with Conquest as it had more interesting missions than Birthright, which is a continuation of Awakening in that regards.
Now I am only at chapter 17 of Conquest (taking it real slow), but so far it feels like it had a good mix of different mission types I thought.