• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Naughty Dog’s output has been abysmal so far this generation.

Status
Not open for further replies.
They released a game right at the end of last generation . . .
What was abysmal was all Xbox studios taking the last few years off last gen, and then none of them having anything for the launch of their new consoles.
 
Last edited:

Represent.

Represent(ative) of bad opinions
Enough of this crap

TLOU 2 came out 3 years ago. Do you expect them to just magically make and release a brand new IP in less than 3 years?

Does this forum have any idea how have development works?

They don’t make derivative and safe sequels like insomniac. They make generation defining titles that win GOTYs and get talked about for the whole generation.

That takes more than 3 years.

I’ll say it again. TLOU2 came out 3 years ago and they are making a new original game.

One more time for you in the back

TLOU2 came out 3 years ago and they are making a new original game.

Plus they have told us they aren’t announcing their new games until closer to release.

Meaning they will probably announce something next summer and we’ll be playing it next fall right around the PS5 PRO launch. A 6 month announce to release schedule would be amazing

Idk wtf you expect. Just magically make a new IP in less than 3 years.

SSM released one game last gen and never got this heat. Theyve made one IP in their whole existence and never get any heat.
 
Last edited:

Perrott

Gold Member
2 remasters and 1 remake in the third year of this console generation.

It’s so sad to see what Naughty Dog has become. They were the most prestigious PlayStation studio, releasing banger after banger on a timely basis, and now all they do is rehash and recycle what they’ve previously worked on.

No wonder people like Amy Hennig and Bruce Straley parted ways with the studio.

The Druckmann leadership is bearing fruit.
"Sad to see what Naughty Dog has become"?

I'm fucking sorry to tell you this, but neither Bend, nor Sucker Punch, nor MediaMolecule or London Studio have released anything since the PS4 generation ended.

Well, Sucker Punch did release something: a lackluster Tsushima remaster with a random-ass DLC. In what world is that worse than Naughty Dog's output?
 

Hugare

Member
Each one of their original games get +90MC scores and sell more than 10M copies

They are arguably one of the best studios in gaming right now, competing only with Rockstar in critical reception

Their last sub 90MC game was in 2007 with Uncharted 1 (I dont count Lost Legacy as an original game. More like a beefed up DLC developed by Team B that was still pretty good)

So obviously, they take a lot of time to cook something great

See how many sub 90 MC games FROM, regarded as one of the best studios right now, has made since 2007. One of them this year even, with the 86 MC Armored Core VI.

"I'll take AC VI over anything ND does", you may say, and that's fine, these things are subjective. But the overall critical reception means more than one singular opinion. I hated GOW Ragnarok, for example.
 
Last edited:
they could redeemed themselves if the next game is a NEW and mindblowing IP, not just in graphics but game design. If it's "more of the same" they are going to eat shit. (just like Bethesda is doing, maybe not as bad but the sentiment of the "sony game" as a pejorative is growing).
 

Flutta

Banned
Wasting a huge amount of resources and time scheming on how to nickel and dime their fans and clearly failing is a good outcome imo.

I mean why try to make a good ol fun game for your fans to enjoy without the politics and the MTX poison.
If it where not for these thread i would have forgotten about ND existence 😝
 
Last edited:

Lokaum D+

Member
PS3: 4 games and 1 DLC in 7 years
U1 - 2007
U2 - 2009
U3 - 2011
TLOU - 2013
TLOULB - 2014

PS4: 2 games and 1 DLC in 5 years
U4 - 2016
ULL - 2017
TLOU2 - 2020

PS5: 0 games since PS5 released.

it seens that NG has lost they creativity and they cant do nothing aside from TLOU anymore.
 
Last edited:

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
RE4 is not impressive to me at all. They're cranking out remakes with the B team. Naughty Dog is also literally doing that.
If you think an asset flip TLOU1 remake is in any way comparable to RE4 remake I cant help you.

And AW2 is literally the best looking game out there. Its an AAA game.
 

Markio128

Member
Bbc Uk GIF
 

Punished Miku

Gold Member
If you think an asset flip TLOU1 remake is in any way comparable to RE4 remake I cant help you.

And AW2 is literally the best looking game out there. Its an AAA game.
I didn't ask for help. They're literally both remakes of linear TPS games. Of course it's immediately, and easily comparable.

I said AW2 is a AAA game.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
This is a problem that hardly only affects ND.
I have not paid too much attention but was Sega announcing a bunch of remakes or were those sequels to those supposed to be classics, no one cared for when it mattered?
Konami, Persona, FF, Capcom... removing remakes and remasters the output isn't that great with many publishers.
Proper remakes for actually old stuff, okay, but remasters of games that got released and are still sold in their previous iteration is kinda laughable imho. But it gets bought so there is demand and my idea of what makes sense, must not be the same what other people's wallets speak. Of course they will sell and make the stuff that probably is quite risk free and does not require a gargantuan effort in finding the fun if the foundation is already there. And all that man power is then not used to make stuff I would want.
Comparing ND to a dying companies like SEGA and Konami is bizarre. This is Sonys premier studio that won 4 GOTYs in 2009, 2013, 2016 and 2020.

As for Capcom, their remakes are better than 99% of modern games. RE2 won just as many GOTY awards as Sekiro and Death Stranding in 2019 and RE4 was nominated for GOTY in a year with almost a dozen goty contenders. Since 2019, they have made RE2, RE3, RE Village and RE4. in 4 years.
 

Hugare

Member
PS3: 4 games and 1 DLC in 7 years
U1 - 2007
U2 - 2009
U3 - 2011
TLOU - 2013
TLOULB - 2014

PS4: 2 games and 1 DLC in 5 years
U4 - 2016
ULL - 2017
TLOU2 - 2020

PS5: 0 games since PS5 released.

it seens that NG has lost they creativity and they cant do nothing aside from TLOU anymore.
Or games are more expensive and ambitious than they were before

Let that sink in for a bit

Santa Monica made 2 games during the PS4 era (one was barely of that era, it was cross gen, and no DLC) of the same IP, and they are not getting this much heat
 
Last edited:

yurinka

Member
2 remasters and 1 remake in the third year of this console generation.

It’s so sad to see what Naughty Dog has become. They were the most prestigious PlayStation studio, releasing banger after banger on a timely basis, and now all they do is rehash and recycle what they’ve previously worked on.

No wonder people like Amy Hennig and Bruce Straley parted ways with the studio.

The Druckmann leadership is bearing fruit.

I don't understand why don't you use one of the many existing 'ND is lazy' or 'Sony is doomed' bullshit threads.

In the 3 years of generation they released:
  • Released TLOU2 a handful months before the generation started
  • Released Uncharted Legacy of Thieves remasters (PS5)
  • Released Uncharted Legacy of Thieves remsaters (PC)
  • Released TLOU Part 1 remake (PS5)
  • Released TLOU Part 1 remake (PC port)
  • Almost released TLOU Part 2 remaster (PS5)
And also released:
  • Released Uncharted movie
  • Released TLOU tv show
  • Released Uncharted TLOU theme park ride
  • Released TLOU theme park events
And they are also known to be working on:
  • After TLOU2 they also started to develop at least 3 games, being TLOU Online one of them. At least one of the other two is a new single player game
  • TLOU Online the biggest ND project ever according to ND
In an age where big AAA games take like 6-8+ years to be developed, someone must be dumb to expect ND to release new games in only around 3 years since their previous new game, when during TLOU2 they only had a single big team working on new games. After TLOU2, they now have -at least- 3 new games teams.

PS3: 4 games and 1 DLC in 7 years
U1 - 2007
U2 - 2009
U3 - 2011
TLOU - 2013
TLOULB - 2014

PS4: 2 games and 1 DLC in 5 years
U4 - 2016
ULL - 2017
TLOU2 - 2020

PS5: 0 games since PS5 released.

it seens that NG has lost they creativity and they cant do nothing aside from TLOU anymore.
Why do you act as if games take the same development time and amount of people back then than now?

In PS1 ND developed Crash Bandicoot with 9 devs plus 4 external folks for the sound. With a development budget of $1.7M and under 2 years of production.

This doesn't mean that they can now make a brand new AAA IP nowadays in the same amount of time and money/people. Every generation AAA development requires more way people, time and money than in the previous one.
 
Last edited:

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
So what would you say about Bend, Sucker Punch....etc.
I would say the same thing. Sucker Punch has gone 3.5 years without a single teaser trailer for their next game. Bend has released a logo. A logo in the last 4.5 years since releasing Days Gone in 2019. Other studios that released games in 2019 have already come out with sequels. See FromSoft, Remedy, Massive, Capcom's RE2 team, Netherrelam. The ones who havent are indeed slacking in comparison. Only problem is that they arent first party and thus dont have fanbases who give a shit about their output.
 

Punished Miku

Gold Member
Comparing ND to a dying companies like SEGA and Konami is bizarre. This is Sonys premier studio that won 4 GOTYs in 2009, 2013, 2016 and 2020.

As for Capcom, their remakes are better than 99% of modern games. RE2 won just as many GOTY awards as Sekiro and Death Stranding in 2019 and RE4 was nominated for GOTY in a year with almost a dozen goty contenders. Since 2019, they have made RE2, RE3, RE Village and RE4. in 4 years.
RE2 is an impressive reinvention of an old game. RE3 is literally just taking the same game code from 2, making new character models and new environments in a small linear game. They even had a semi-Nemesis already done in 2. RE4 is probably doing the same thing, but they added a knife counter.

RE Village is building off of RE7 as well.

You don't make 4 games in 4 years that are comparable to an original Naughty Dog title. You reuse what already was done to get stuff out that fast. The reviews for RE4 were a period of mass psychosis in the industry. The game is worse than the original.
 

TheInfamousKira

Reseterror Resettler
My issue is that ND seems to be getting rearranged internally as "The Last of Us studio," with all of their titles (multiplayer, remaster, Remakes, sequels, stage productions, television shows, etc) being in support of one franchise. Furthermore, ND also seems like the first studio to really seriously put resources into the multimedia thing. I like good movies. I like good series. I like good adaptations. But you won't be able to sell me on the same story too many more times. I can't be the only one who sees Druckman at the start of his transformation into a Western Kojima facsimile.
 

tmlDan

Member
their last game was 2020, why does every other studio in the world get to take their time but ND has to make a new game ASAP.
 

DForce

NaughtyDog Defense Force
Santa Monica Studio - God of War > God of War Ragnarok = 4 years, 6 months
Guerrilla Games - Horizon Zero Dawn > Horizon Forbidden West = 4 years, 11 months
Bend Studio- 4 years, 7 months
Sucker Punch - 3 years, 4 months
Naughty Dog - 3 years, 5 months

Where's Bend Studio? Sucker Punch?

Santa Monica Studio and Guerrilla Games took 4 and half years to almost 5 years to release a new game.

Why do people think Naughty Dog can develop their games faster than anyone else?
 

Msamy

Member
2 remasters and 1 remake in the third year of this console generation.

It’s so sad to see what Naughty Dog has become. They were the most prestigious PlayStation studio, releasing banger after banger on a timely basis, and now all they do is rehash and recycle what they’ve previously worked on.

No wonder people like Amy Hennig and Bruce Straley parted ways with the studio.

The Druckmann leadership is bearing fruit.
Druckmann actually care about the last of us hbo series way more than naughty dog games he is currently love to be movie director rather than being video game developer
 
Last edited:

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
A lot of these graphics focused devs take forever to release their games. Most of you guys keep whining about graphics and production values all the time, this is what it leads to.
I keep seeing this, but I dont know how true this is. AW2 from Control is a massive leap in visuals. Avatar from Division 2 is a massive leap in visuals. Both games took 4 years. ND is 3.5 years in and cant even show a teaser at the VGAs? A teaser? We arent asking for a game release in 3.5 years. We arent even asking for a fucking gameplay demo. We are simply asking for a 1 minute teaser. If they arent even at that point then yes, we get to whine a bit about their output.

Great studios find a way. ND simply hasnt. They used to be very productive. 2 years between U1>U2>U3>TLOU1. 3 years later they released U4. 1 year after that Lost Legacy. 3 years after that TLOU2. They were never a studio that took 5+ years to release anything.

Lets face it, we know why other studios like Respawn, RE team, Remedy, Massive, FromSoft have been far more productive. Their director didnt abandon their team for 2 years while we palled around with hollywood leaving his team to fuck around with remakes being done at other studios, fuck around with multiplayer gaas trash, fuck around with Sony Bend's Uncharted IP causing it to get cancelled. They probably started dev on their new game this year. Thats why its not ready for a reveal.
 

yurinka

Member
I would say the same thing. Sucker Punch has gone 3.5 years without a single teaser trailer for their next game. Bend has released a logo. A logo in the last 4.5 years since releasing Days Gone in 2019. Other studios that released games in 2019 have already come out with sequels. See FromSoft, Remedy, Massive, Capcom's RE2 team, Netherrelam. The ones who havent are indeed slacking in comparison. Only problem is that they arent first party and thus dont have fanbases who give a shit about their output.
Bend released game updates with new content and fixes and later released the Days Gone PC port in May 2021, around 2 years and a half ago.

After GoT, Sucker Punch released GoT Legends, GoT Ikki Island DLC + GoT DC in August 202, around 2 years and a few months ago.

There's absolutely no AAA dev team in the world who around 2 years and a half after their previous released a trailer of their next game outside MS (who releases CG teasers of games that still aren't in production and will be released in 5-7 years in the future).

Bend and GoT, at least when developed Days Gone and GoT, had a single gamedev team. They didn't have enough people to work in multiple AAA games at the same time. People like Insomniac, FromSoft, Remedy, Massive/Ubisoft or Capcom have multiple teams working on multiple AAA games at the same time. That's why they can release games more frequently than studios who only have a single AAA gamedev team. On top of that, games like the ones from Capcom or Massive have like a dozen or two of support studios working in the game in addition to the lead studio.

There's no magic tricks or lazy devs.
 
Last edited:
I keep seeing this, but I dont know how true this is. AW2 from Control is a massive leap in visuals. Avatar from Division 2 is a massive leap in visuals. Both games took 4 years. ND is 3.5 years in and cant even show a teaser at the VGAs? A teaser? We arent asking for a game release in 3.5 years. We arent even asking for a fucking gameplay demo. We are simply asking for a 1 minute teaser. If they arent even at that point then yes, we get to whine a bit about their output.

Great studios find a way. ND simply hasnt. They used to be very productive. 2 years between U1>U2>U3>TLOU1. 3 years later they released U4. 1 year after that Lost Legacy. 3 years after that TLOU2. They were never a studio that took 5+ years to release anything.

Lets face it, we know why other studios like Respawn, RE team, Remedy, Massive, FromSoft have been far more productive. Their director didnt abandon their team for 2 years while we palled around with hollywood leaving his team to fuck around with remakes being done at other studios, fuck around with multiplayer gaas trash, fuck around with Sony Bend's Uncharted IP causing it to get cancelled. They probably started dev on their new game this year. Thats why its not ready for a reveal.
You know damn well they had a game ready to be announced this year, and that was Factions.
You also know it's out of their control that they didn't do so and that game is quite possibly canceled, which means it's possible we won't see another Naughty Dog game for at least 2 or 3 years.

edit: also...those studios you just mentioned simply don't release games with the same level of polish Naughty Dog does. Imagine putting FromSotfware or Resident Evil remakes on the same level lmao. Horizon needed 5 (!!) years to have a sequel out. God of War 4 and half years.
 
Last edited:

Tsaki

Member
Re2 team released their game in 2019, then 4 years later had re4 ready.
Remedy released control in 2019, had aw2 win multiple awards 4 years later.
Sekiro was released in 2019, elden ring won every award for from software under the Sun 3 years later.
Massive released division in 2019, and just launched a brand new avatar game 4 years later.

Nd released tlou2 3.5 years ago. And we haven’t even seen their next game.
I'm disappointed with ND's output but your examples don't make much sense.
Capcom does literally what ND did: remakes.
Control is AA, released one year before TLOU2.
Massive released Division 2 one year before TLOU2 and a shit game this month.
I'll only give you FromSoft on efficiency and quality.
 

Flutta

Banned
Santa Monica Studio - God of War > God of War Ragnarok = 4 years, 6 months
Guerrilla Games - Horizon Zero Dawn > Horizon Forbidden West = 4 years, 11 months
Bend Studio- 4 years, 7 months
Sucker Punch - 3 years, 4 months
Naughty Dog - 3 years, 5 months

Where's Bend Studio? Sucker Punch?

Santa Monica Studio and Guerrilla Games took 4 and half years to almost 5 years to release a new game.

Why do people think Naughty Dog can develop their games faster than anyone else?

ND usually has an announcement or two during this time. So far nothing from them and no i’m not talking about games we’ve already played. Remakes/remasters shouldn’t be handled by the main dev team. Factions a MP game made from a last gen game has still not been released. 4 years now has gone by without a release date in sight.

Some say it’s canceled others say it’s not. If that’s not a red flag i don’t know what is.

This has nothing to do with developing games faster then anyone else this seems more to be about mismanagement at ND, you can’t deny that its so apparent.

Regarding Bend and SP. Yeah good question lol. SP is prob working on Ghost 2 and Bend i’m not sure we should hear something from then next year i hope.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Enough of this crap

TLOU 2 came out 3 years ago. Do you expect them to just magically make and release a brand new IP in less than 3 years?
Sure. They pumped out U4 3 years after TLOU1. And TLOU3 less than 3 years after lost legacy. now they cant even release a teaser trailer 3.5 years later?
Does this forum have any idea how have development works?

They don’t make derivative and safe sequels like insomniac.
Ever heard of Lost legacy and uncharted 3?

That takes more than 3 years.
Sure. if its a new IP, fine 5 year dev time. But still no teaser after 3.5 years in dev time?
Plus they have told us they aren’t announcing their new games until closer to release.
Dont fall for this PR especially from ND.
Meaning they will probably announce something next summer and we’ll be playing it next fall right around the PS5 PRO launch. A 6 month announce to release schedule would be amazing
Avatar bet that this will never happen. If you lose you have to wear a Jim Ryan avatar for a month.
 
It's already a lot more than many others that have had a teaser since 2019-2020 and no one seems to care much but ND releases a game with more than 300 gotys in 2020 and in 2023 it already has to have a new IP xDDD, hopefully the same standard for everyone .
 

JaksGhost

Member
ND usually has an announcement or two during this time. So far nothing from them and no i’m not talking about games we’ve already played. Remakes/remasters shouldn’t be handled by the main dev team. Factions a MP game made from a last gen game has still not been released. 4 years now has gone by without a release date in sight.

Some say it’s canceled others say it’s not. If that’s not a red flag i don’t know what is.

This has nothing to do with developing games faster then anyone else this seems more to be about mismanagement at ND, you can’t deny that its so apparent.

Regarding Bend and SP. Yeah good question lol. SP is prob working on Ghost 2 and Bend i’m not sure we should hear something from then next year i hope.
It’s funny you saying remakes/remasters shouldn’t be don’t by the main team because SURPRISE, neither was done by the main team.
 
Enough of this crap

TLOU 2 came out 3 years ago. Do you expect them to just magically make and release a brand new IP in less than 3 years?

Does this forum have any idea how have development works?

They don’t make derivative and safe sequels like insomniac. They make generation defining titles that win GOTYs and get talked about for the whole generation.

That takes more than 3 years.

I’ll say it again. TLOU2 came out 3 years ago and they are making a new original game.

One more time for you in the back

TLOU2 came out 3 years ago and they are making a new original game.

Plus they have told us they aren’t announcing their new games until closer to release.

Meaning they will probably announce something next summer and we’ll be playing it next fall right around the PS5 PRO launch. A 6 month announce to release schedule would be amazing

Idk wtf you expect. Just magically make a new IP in less than 3 years.

SSM released one game last gen and never got this heat. Theyve made one IP in their whole existence and never get any heat.

Hilarious to see so many children posting on this. I bet none of them have worked a day in their lives.

There is a reason why Spider-Man 2 went home with no awards at TGA. The game did absolutely nothing to leave an impact on the industry. It was like an Assassin's Creed sequel and not an especially good one.

People think Naughty Dog has multiple teams, but the reality is that they had like 1.5 teams trying to run multiple projects, but the projects grow in size faster than teh studio.

The "theory" was you had the uncharted team and the last of us team, but most of the company works on putting out one product at a time.

GameRelease DateTime
Uncharted 2Oct 2009N/A
Uncharted 3Nov 2011N/A
Last of UsJun 20133.5 Years
Uncharted 4May 20164.5 Years
Last of Us 2Jun 20207 Years

Naughty Dog says it’s still struggling with multi-project development

“We tried our first major multi-project development with The Last of Us,” Wells said. “At the end of Uncharted 2, Bruce Straley and Neil Druckmann went off to start designing [that], although they did spend a good, solid three or four months working on Jak and Daxter before they decided to shelve it and focus on something new.

“They embarked on that and the idea was we would build a team around it and have two teams going at once, and we just did not achieve that at all.

He added: “The amount of effort that was required to finish Uncharted 3 at the time was stealing resources away from The Last of Us, and we never got to the point where we had two full productions going.

“I would say even today we’re just short of that. We definitely have multiple projects, but only one that is getting the lion’s share of focus at any time. - Evan Wells, 2021

So people expecting them to turn out another game 3.5 years after TLOU2 are seriously delusional and bordering on trolling at this point.

If Naughty Dog is going to do an iterative game like Spider-Man 2, sure maybe they could have pumped something out sooner. And for those complaining about the remakes and remasters, they're good business decisions.

  • Keeps revenue coming in, which is important when you aren't shipping a major game for 6+ years
  • Upskills the talent at your studio giving opportunities for leadership and advancement, it takes a lot to ship a game, even a remaster
  • Introduces new customers to IP
  • Gives gamers the opportunity to play the games they like the most in the best way
Also people complaining about things like the TV shows and the movies, don't realize that these outlets bring in more revenue that can be used to hire more people and get games out faster and create more games.

No one at Sony makes bigger and more successful games than Naughty Dog. Every single studio that released a PS4 game in 2018 or later that has released a PS5 game has released one that was cross-gen or one that has felt cross-gen.
 

SmokedMeat

Gamer™
And here my backlog is getting out of hand, and my wishlist is around 315 games.

How can anyone get so upset about one studio’s output, when there’s so much out there from the last few years? There’s no way anyone’s played everything.

Unless AAA blockbuster graphics are the only reason you play, in which case you’ll continue to starve.
 
Last edited:

HawarMiran

Banned
i don't mind them taking their time. On the other hand it makes me mad that they don't communicate their next fucking game!!!!!! SHOW IT TO MEEEEE!!!! I am certain they have some new IP in the works.
 
A lot of these graphics focused devs take forever to release their games. Most of you guys keep whining about graphics and production values all the time, this is what it leads to.
Imagine ND released a new game in 3 years but it was only 15 hours long and "only" looked as good as TLOU2, the meltdowns would last for months.



I think it's mostly the re-releases and Factions which have people upset.
Most of their fanbase just wants a new single player game from them but for the past 3 years every time we hear from ND it's either about a re-release or their GAAS, there seems to be this sense of "why are you working on this stuff and not what we want?".

Ironically I think people would be less upset with them if they had just been radio silent and didn't release anything for the past few years.
Ding, ding, ding. Truth on all accounts.

You guys want 4k 120fps with nanite and lumen and ray tracing and path tracing and every other miniscule bell and whistle? This is the cost. I would have been happy if this gen was only a marginal improvement in image quality with a substantial improvement in framerates.

And honestly, the rereleases and remasters would have been fine with me, if it had meant Factions came out as well, but from all accounts, development turned into another GAAS powered nightmare, resulting in 5 or 6 years of effort being shit canned.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom