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Phil Spencer admits defeat in console space, and doesn't think great games would help Xbox's market share.

Everything will be cloud and a subscription, so I suppose they don't really need their own box.
But the brand itself is called Xbox so it would be weird if there was no box.
 

Tams

Member
Everything will be cloud and a subscription, so I suppose they don't really need their own box.
But the brand itself is called Xbox so it would be weird if there was no box.
That's why they called it

X No GIF by 1 Play Sports
Cougar Town Wink GIF


The foresight of Microsoft! It truly is astounding!
 
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Shh

Member
Not making great games is why they're in this situation to begin with. So yes ... making great games would help. It doesn't help that almost all of their games are also on PC instead of being exclusive to Xbox. They're more focused on selling subscriptions to Game Pass than they are on making quality games. I have no interest in Game Pass if all the games are mediocre. And the games that would seemingly be great that are promised either neither see the light of day or underdeliver on such a profound level that nobody believes the hype anymore.
 
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mitchman

Gold Member
He also said right before launching the Series X they planned to win this generation and outsell PS5 and Nintendo.
Yeah, but it's hard to say anything else. If you don't intent to win, why even compete? Same with sports really, every single coach in football (soccer for Americans) say they want to win in their pre-match press conferences.
 
Yeah, but it's hard to say anything else. If you don't intent to win, why even compete? Same with sports really, every single coach in football (soccer for Americans) say they want to win in their pre-match press conferences.
I agree. The problem is him now saying they aren't trying to win and third place is the best they can do.
 

diffusionx

Gold Member
This thread made me realize I was paying for game pass ultimate for no reason as I never use it anymore. That's some money I saved now by cancelling that subscription.
GamePass only makes sense if it's the only thing you play. Like, you spend the money, and every single game you play is on GamePass, and when it leaves GP you forget it ever existed, and you don't play any of the games too long. Because if, say, Flight Sim or Age of Empires or Forza or whatever becomes an obsession it makes more sense to just buy the game outright and cancel your sub and play that game.

It's locked in, in a way that other subscriptions are not, and I don't necessarily think that is a strength. When my subscription went full price I said "hell no", canceled it and bought the 2 or 3 games I really liked.
 
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mitchman

Gold Member
GamePass only makes sense if it's the only thing you play. Like, you spend the money, and every single game you play is on GamePass, and when it leaves GP you forget it ever existed, and you don't play any of the games too long. Because if, say, Flight Sim or Age of Empires or Forza or whatever becomes an obsession it makes more sense to just buy the game outright and cancel your sub and play that game.

It's locked in, in a way that other subscriptions are not, and I don't necessarily think that is a strength. When my subscription went full price I said "hell no", canceled it and bought the 2 or 3 games I really liked.
Exactly. My backlog on PS5 is long enough that it made no sense to keep game pass around just for flight sim.
 

tassletine

Member
Microsoft are like Disney. They appropriate talent but there's no instinct there. It's just suits playing at being game devs. Copying what came before.
You can always get lucky doing that sort of thing, or muscle your way through, but it's not a long term solution.

Kind of perplexed by his attitude though. Very unAmerican.
 

DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
Who, the reporters or Xbox?

Xbox. If they aren't in this seriously and don't have the passion and drive to deliver experiences the fans like myself expect from them then get it over with.

take myself, investing years into a platform with the trust that they will deliver and this last 2 years has been rough. They need to show us that they are serious

It sounds mad corny and weird and it's just an example but imagine being in a relationship with someone where you're investing your time, money and commitment and the other party is just like...I promise next year I'll be better....I'll be ready to deliver what you expect soon....then it doesn't come. You'd just want them to eventually break up with you, or you yourself will do it after numerous chances.

Either put up or shut up. It's time to deliver. Simple
 
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Shh

Member
Same.

I was so close to selling my Xbox but I’m gonna wait and see what Starfield is like. That is last chance saloon for me.
I'm waiting to see what Fable 4 is like as well. If it ever comes out at all. I mean seriously. I bought the Switch simply because of Zelda. There are many great games as well. But great games do sell consoles.
 
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Don't forget the we can't compete because sony is making deals with 3rd parties....While trying the biggest acquisition in gaming 10 times more than the previous one ....That they also made....But sony's bad they have timed exclusives, we buy publishers ....The hypocrisy there is incredible.

Edit: I forgot but with minecraft they also have the 3rd biggest deal in the history of gaming....But it is sony that buys everything...
Exactly. I’ve been saying the same thing forever yet no one seems to comprehend it. Sony are purely diabolical when they acquire “temporary” third party exclusives of games and franchises that normally sell really well and best on PlayStation, but it’s perfectly fine when Microsoft purchases entire publishers meaning they will own those games forever if they please. The hypocrisy is definitely outstanding.
 
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Stop with the fake shortages. Folks just aren’t willing to pay $559 for the Series X when you can get a PS5 for $499. If you’ll look at the 2nd photo, it appears that ms has stopped shipping the non bundles to retailers.
Selective anecdotes aren't proof as much as your bias wants you t believe so. People can, and have done the same thing in reverse posting screens of it out of stock.

Only one of the two has people outside of Microsoft continually bringing up the stock issue in reports. At this time it may be better suited for discussion if you were to admit you're wrong. When you have a stream of companies having representatives pointing out X supply out the blue and Microsoft themselves aren't involved, the logical conclusion would be that there's a reason behind it.

But I also understand you can't have a 44 page thread pushing unsupported anecdotes if you were to admit that there are stock problems at some level, so I understand why you aren't interested in exploring those facts.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Selective anecdotes aren't proof as much as your bias wants you t believe so. People can, and have done the same thing in reverse posting screens of it out of stock.

Only one of the two has people outside of Microsoft continually bringing up the stock issue in reports. At this time it may be better suited for discussion if you were to admit you're wrong. When you have a stream of companies having representatives pointing out X supply out the blue and Microsoft themselves aren't involved, the logical conclusion would be that there's a reason behind it.

But I also understand you can't have a 44 page thread pushing unsupported anecdotes if you were to admit that there are stock problems at some level, so I understand why you aren't interested in exploring those facts.
Supply and demand is the reason. More so on the latter which does impact what you supply.

There have been non stop fire sales on the S for well over a year, still did not move the needle. The X was readily available in the FH5 bundle for a while now, still did not move the needle. Scalpers not even seeking out the machine anymore since they don't make a dime on them, is another sign that the needle isn't moving.

There is no unprecedented demand that is exceeding supply.
 
There have been non stop fire sales on the S for well over a year, still did not move the needle.
That's not how logistics works. The S is moving what it needs to, the whole Series set of consoles is designed to sell together targeting audiences that in many cases don't join together, so it is unreasonable to see the S not making up for all potential X sales and then claiming that's fire sales aren't moving the needle.
The X was readily available in the FH5 bundle for a while now, still did not move the needle.
Again, this isn't how logistics works but my question which I raised previously is, why are you guys continuing to falsely entertain the idea that the consoles are readily available, meaning that the console X is available broadly, yet several companies with insight keep saying the opposite?

At some point you have to ask the question that if everyone keeps saying the opposite of what you keep trying to present as objective, maybe it's not objective after all. If it's really a problem with demand and that there's widespread availability of X Xbox consoles, then why are people continuing to say that's not the case? We just got another report from the UK bringing up the stock issues again for out of the blue without it being asked, at some point you gotta stop and ask questions. There clearly have to be holes where supply is going to keep receiving mentions of Xbox stock unprompted by several credible sources.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
That's not how logistics works. The S is moving what it needs to, the whole Series set of consoles is designed to sell together targeting audiences that in many cases don't join together, so it is unreasonable to see the S not making up for all potential X sales and then claiming that's fire sales aren't moving the needle.

Again, this isn't how logistics works but my question which I raised previously is, why are you guys continuing to falsely entertain the idea that the consoles are readily available, meaning that the console X is available broadly, yet several companies with insight keep saying the opposite?

At some point you have to ask the question that if everyone keeps saying the opposite of what you keep trying to present as objective, maybe it's not objective after all. If it's really a problem with demand and that there's widespread availability of X Xbox consoles, then why are people continuing to say that's not the case? We just got another report from the UK bringing up the stock issues again for out of the blue without it being asked, at some point you gotta stop and ask questions. There clearly have to be holes where supply is going to keep receiving mentions of Xbox stock unprompted by several credible sources.
You don't fire sale a product that exceeds demand. You fire sale a product when you have more supply than demand and need to desperately move units. Especially when you are supposedly losing up to $200 per unit.

That is exactly how logistics works. Always has.
 
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Jinzo Prime

Member
Microsoft are like Disney. They appropriate talent but there's no instinct there. It's just suits playing at being game devs. Copying what came before.
You can always get lucky doing that sort of thing, or muscle your way through, but it's not a long term solution.

Kind of perplexed by his attitude though. Very unAmerican.
Xbox used to be American as fuck, though. Giant console, giant controller called the DUKE, loud, ear-splitting sound when you turn it on. It was garish, fat, loud, expensive, and quintessentially American. Xbox was were you and your bros go on Live to yell slurs at strangers while driving around and shooting aliens together.

Xbox of today has no identity. It's a black and green box that's for "everybody." In reality, it doesn't mean anything to anyone anymore.
 

demigod

Member
Selective anecdotes aren't proof as much as your bias wants you t believe so. People can, and have done the same thing in reverse posting screens of it out of stock.

Only one of the two has people outside of Microsoft continually bringing up the stock issue in reports. At this time it may be better suited for discussion if you were to admit you're wrong. When you have a stream of companies having representatives pointing out X supply out the blue and Microsoft themselves aren't involved, the logical conclusion would be that there's a reason behind it.

But I also understand you can't have a 44 page thread pushing unsupported anecdotes if you were to admit that there are stock problems at some level, so I understand why you aren't interested in exploring those facts.
Keep dreaming pal, there is no demand for the series. It’s not anecdotal when i or anyone can find it in stock on any given day for the past 5 months. If you can’t find it in stock you’re either lying or not trying.
 

BlackTron

Member
This deserves it's own thread. 104K views in less than a day. Based on Gaf's presentation of Phil Spencer's receipts and gas lighting of the XBOX community.



"When Microsoft purchased Bethesda, many were under the impression that Spencer would transform and enhance the studios. That has not happened"

Um obviously. When MS stops tainting their studios it will be news. Until then, it's just business as usual since the 90s. Not trying to dogpile on Xbox, I use mine almost every day. But this is not some secret, and I don't understand why you would assume a studio would do better owned by MS. I mean it CAN, but that's called praying.
 
You don't fire sale a product that exceeds demand.
I never said this, you are avoiding the points I made and ignoring them in favor of creating a different argument. The X is the subject of the conversation, X is not on fire sale. Your reply is barely on the same topic.
Keep dreaming pal, there is no demand for the series It’s not anecdotal when i or anyone can find it in stock on any given day for the past 5 months. If you can’t find it in stock you’re either lying or not trying.
This isn't a rebuttal, it's not discussion, it's a half-insult that doesn't address anything.

When you have multiple people continuously saying out of the blue that X has stock issues repeatedly, then this push to claim that there's no stock issues and broad availability doesn't make sense. You don't seem to have an answer for this conflict so you tried to bury the issue instead, but it doesn't change anything. At some point you have to ask why these companies keep bringing up stock issues even in other countries like the UK just recently, if there's truly broad availability everywhere and units are just sitting unbrought.

I haven't heard an honest answer yet discussing this fact. I think it's clear there's gaps in the stock in some form if we keep getting reports about stock shortages. You can't say numerous companies with staff who have insight related to to the topic are all liars or not trying compared to an armchair forum poster.

The truth would logically be that all of these reports are seeing obvious holes in stock quantity and distribution to where they feel the need without Microsofts involvement, to give mention to stock issues again and again. I'm fairly certain the people who are writing these reports are honest and trying.
 

demigod

Member
I never said this, you are avoiding the points I made and ignoring them in favor of creating a different argument. The X is the subject of the conversation, X is not on fire sale. Your reply is barely on the same topic.

This isn't a rebuttal, it's not discussion, it's a half-insult that doesn't address anything.

When you have multiple people continuously saying out of the blue that X has stock issues repeatedly, then this push to claim that there's no stock issues and broad availability doesn't make sense. You don't seem to have an answer for this conflict so you tried to bury the issue instead, but it doesn't change anything. At some point you have to ask why these companies keep bringing up stock issues even in other countries like the UK just recently, if there's truly broad availability everywhere and units are just sitting unbrought.

I haven't heard an honest answer yet discussing this fact. I think it's clear there's gaps in the stock in some form if we keep getting reports about stock shortages. You can't say numerous companies with staff who have insight related to to the topic are all liars or not trying compared to an armchair forum poster.

The truth would logically be that all of these reports are seeing obvious holes in stock quantity and distribution to where they feel the need without Microsofts involvement, to give mention to stock issues again and again. I'm fairly certain the people who are writing these reports are honest and trying.
Multiple people saying out of stock? Can you name those people?
 

Begleiter

Member
Xbox used to be American as fuck, though. Giant console, giant controller called the DUKE, loud, ear-splitting sound when you turn it on. It was garish, fat, loud, expensive, and quintessentially American. Xbox was were you and your bros go on Live to yell slurs at strangers while driving around and shooting aliens together.

Xbox of today has no identity. It's a black and green box that's for "everybody." In reality, it doesn't mean anything to anyone anymore.
They didn't just have an identity before, they were hungry as well. OG Xbox through mid 360 you could feel it. Spencer might have just been positioning the company to best navigate the regulators, but it comes off as real loser talk, like they and others haven't turned things around before. Part of me feels they need Peter Moore back.
 
I said this. The rest is just noise.
Which wasn't what the discussion was about. You are still providing no answers and changing the topic. If you don't have an answer say you don't. You're trying to trick people into forgetting what we were talking about, which wasn't the S. Nor did anyone claim the S had demand exceeding supply, it's something you completely made up.
Multiple people saying out of stock? Can you name those people?
Are you being disingenuous? I even mentioned a recent example, the recent UK thread on this very forum.

I see actual discourse isn't here. Disappointing.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Which wasn't what the discussion was about. You are still providing no answers and changing the topic. If you don't have an answer say you don't. You're trying to trick people into forgetting what we were talking about, which wasn't the S. Nor did anyone claim the S had demand exceeding supply, it's something you completely made up.

Are you being disingenuous? I even mentioned a recent example, the recent UK thread on this very forum.

I see actual discourse isn't here. Disappointing.
No, I am just calling out where you claim availability every time it's looked into, is anecdotal. The demand just isn't there.
 
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Crayon

Member
Lol you guys just made me check Amazon and I was really wondering if they'd be available lol. Had me going there.
 
No, I am just calling out where you claim availability every time it's looked into.
Everything you're saying is distorted.
I just got into the thread recently, how can I be making a claim "every time" something is looked into? I was also talking about the X, not the S which is something you added to your story after I made two posts referring to the X multiple times.

Here it is the question again for your convenience:
When you have multiple people continuously saying out of the blue that X has stock issues repeatedly, then this push to claim that there's no stock issues and broad availability doesn't make sense. You don't seem to have an answer for this conflict so you tried to bury the issue instead, but it doesn't change anything. At some point you have to ask why these companies keep bringing up stock issues even in other countries like the UK just recently, if there's truly broad availability everywhere and units are just sitting unbrought.

I haven't heard an honest answer yet discussing this fact. I think it's clear there's gaps in the stock in some form if we keep getting reports about stock shortages. You can't say numerous companies with staff who have insight related to to the topic are all liars or not trying compared to an armchair forum poster.

The truth would logically be that all of these reports are seeing obvious holes in stock quantity and distribution to where they feel the need without Microsofts involvement, to give mention to stock issues again and again. I'm fairly certain the people who are writing these reports are honest and trying.
why are you guys continuing to falsely entertain the idea that the consoles are readily available, meaning that the console X is available broadly, yet several companies with insight keep saying the opposite?

At some point you have to ask the question that if everyone keeps saying the opposite of what you keep trying to present as objective, maybe it's not objective after all. If it's really a problem with demand and that there's widespread availability of X Xbox consoles, then why are people continuing to say that's not the case? We just got another report from the UK bringing up the stock issues again for out of the blue without it being asked, at some point you gotta stop and ask questions. There clearly have to be holes where supply is going to keep receiving mentions of Xbox stock unprompted by several credible sources.
You went off about the S and a false claim that I said that the S had unprecedented demand because you can't actually answer the underlying question, so you had to act like I said something else. There's nothing difficult about this, if the X is broadly available and stock isn't the problem why are reports still mentioning the shortages out of the blue without any involvement from Microsoft? Is every company reporting this lying? No.

What's the only answer left? You guys are wrong, how much so is the only mystery. It's clear these people are seeing something that gives them clear information that stock issues exist in some form if they keep bringing it up. Now you can ignore this fact and that's fine, but I don't think it's productive to keep acting as if the X no longer has stock issues when people who aren't Microsoft at these companies keep bringing it up. Including in the recent UK thread. When the next report brings it up what then? Still going to claim there's no shortages and it's a demand issue? June? July? August?

it would be nice to have a real back and forth looking into these facts, but if people don't want to fine.
 

Topher

Gold Member
Again, this isn't how logistics works but my question which I raised previously is, why are you guys continuing to falsely entertain the idea that the consoles are readily available, meaning that the console X is available broadly, yet several companies with insight keep saying the opposite?

What "companies with insight" are you referring to?
 
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