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[Feffe]

I don't think the quote really says much of anything in that regard.
I'll be shocked if it's actually an external developer that's been around making games. "A Talented New Development Team" doesn't sound like an independent external dev to me. Like, it might not be internal in Nintendo proper, but a new first party studio

It will be a partnership between some (existing) studios, internal and external.

Other M was technically developed by "Project M" and Brawl by "The Studio", but most of the staff was respectively from Team Ninja and Game Arts.

It will be the same for Prime 4, it will be developed by an ad-hoc development team with a heavy involvement of Nintendo (in contrast with totally outsourced games games like Hey! Pikmin) and most of staff from an existing software house like, for example, Namco.

 

[Datschge]

Oh fuck it's going to suck, isn't it?
Level design was one of the worst aspect of Other M.

Did you also hate Metroid Zero Mission? Takehiko Hosokawa did level design on that. Did you also hate Mario Land 2 or Wario Land 1-3? He was director on those. Actually he was also involved as designer on the original Metroid 2 while Sakamoto had no hands in that.

The Other M hate is so overblown, out of the 100 development staffs 3 were from Nintendo: Sakamoto, Hosokawa and art director Takayasu Morisawa. Tecmo/Team Ninja just wasn't a good fit.

 

[Eolz]

I really don't think that Nintendo trusts any japanese studio to do an FPS, and Tanabe is used to work with western development studios at this point.
If it's an external studio doing most of the work. I still think that it'll be a mix of first party devs, NLG for a bit of a support (probably multiplayer or something like that), usual partners for assets, and either another studio doing most of the work if that's the case, or just nobody else.
Don't really see anything else happening.

 

[Kilrogg]

The Other M hate is so overblown, out of the 100 development staffs 3 were from Nintendo: Sakamoto, Hosokawa and art director Takayasu Morisawa. Tecmo/Team Ninja just wasn't a good fit.

All the aspects of Other M that generated this 'overblown hate' are almost all attributable to Sakamoto or Nintendo's direction of the project. The story (and the emphasis on story), the choice of having a non-professional actress voice Samus, the ridiculous justification for Samus's power restrictions, the auto-aiming in 2D sections and the Wiimote-only 3D sections are all ideas that come from Sakamoto and friends. And even if they didn't came from Sakamoto, he still helmed the project and greenlit all these decisions. That's why people shit on Sakamoto and Nintendo for Other M's questionable design, deservedly so.

Team Ninja's involvement was mostly limited to the technical aspects of the game, and I guess maybe the feel of the combat (namely the QTEs).

 

[Timeaisis]

I wonder who the developer of MP4 is...and I wonder if they are Japanese.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

It's very different. Sakamoto has never outsourced a game entirely. He always brings in lead members of his team to work with the cooperating studio. Hosokawa is the Director, an a designer who worked on all the traditional Metroids (and Wario Lands) since the Game Boy..

Even though Tanabe is creatively attached to the Prime series, he doesn't have an actual dedicated design team that he adds to his projects (which are all outsourced). He adds some support staff from Japan, but it feels very different from the consistent core Metroid team that Sakamoto still houses.

 

[Mael]

Did you also hate Metroid Zero Mission? Takehiko Hosokawa did level design on that. Did you also hate Mario Land 2 or Wario Land 1-3? He was director on those. Actually he was also involved as designer on the original Metroid 2 while Sakamoto had no hands in that.

The Other M hate is so overblown, out of the 100 development staffs 3 were from Nintendo: Sakamoto, Hosokawa and art director Takayasu Morisawa. Tecmo/Team Ninja just wasn't a good fit.

No offense but to begin with there's loads of issues with Zero Mission that if they're reiterated in M:SR I'd prefer to skip the game personally.
Also Mario Land 2 and Wario Land 1-3 are older than a good number of posters here.
If the last time he did anything related to level design was in Other M there's reason to be concerned as its own of this game's bigger faults.
Hosokawa was happy enough with what ended up in Other M tells me that his standards aren't exactly high for this.
That of the 3 people from Nintendo one was dedicated to level design and we ended with the disaster pressed on disc is pretty telling.
If we end up with something worth shit it's probably going to be down to Mercury Steam.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

No offense but to begin with there's loads of issues with Zero Mission that if they're reiterated in M:SR I'd prefer to skip the game personally.
Also Mario Land 2 and Wario Land 1-3 are older than a good number of posters here.
If the last time he did anything related to level design was in Other M there's reason to be concerned as its own of this game's bigger faults.
Hosokawa was happy enough with what ended up in Other M tells me that his standards aren't exactly high for this.
That of the 3 people from Nintendo one was dedicated to level design and we ended with the disaster pressed on disc is pretty telling.
If we end up with something worth shit it's probably going to be down to Mercury Steam.

Hosokawa personally arranged the map design in Metroid: Samus Returns according to Sakamoto. He was the lead designer of the original game, and he's a traditional 2D map designer. For Other M, he was the game director, but according to Iwata Asks - most of this input was through e-mails (10,000 of them). I'm not actually sure if he hands-on designed any levels in Other M; If he did, maybe he's just not an experienced 3D designer or had enough expertise to arrange it any particular way.

 

[Mael]

Hosokawa personally arranged the map design in Metroid: Samus Returns according to Sakamoto. He was the lead designer of the original game, and he's a traditional 2D map designer. For Other M, he was the game director, but according to Iwata Asks - most of this inpurt was through e-mails (10,000 of them). I'm not actually sure if he hands-on designed any levels in Other M; If he did, maybe he's just not an experienced 3D designer or had enough expertise to arrange it any particular way.

That could explain how and why Other M ended up the way it did.
I guess since it's a 3DS game and a remake to boot they didn't get the tentation to make the game 3D beyond the graphics.
He originally worked on Metroid II with any luck he actually understand what made the game special so it could turn out more than ok.
He's listed as a director for Other M so maybe he let that to Team Ninja who were more experienced in 3D game design (and boy was that a bad idea if so).
Cautiously optimistic if he has a more hands-on approach (then again MS should be a better fit than TN for this kind of project).

As always in this industry, you're only as good as your last game. I'm more than ready to find excuses for Other M if M:SR delivers.

 

[TheDinoman]

For the record, Shikamaru Ninja's website says that Other M's level design was actually handeled by a Team Ninja employee.

Level Design
■ Kazuteru Shibasaki

 

[Mael]

Need a proper post after all.
Shikamaru Ninja, you're doing fantastic work with the website here.
plenty of info to look up to and everything.
Seriously good job on that !

e: Some names in there are from a while ago, like the people at 1-up I never forgot about!

For the record, Shikamaru Ninja's website says that Other M's level design was actually handeled by a Team Ninja employee.

The fact that they're communicating that Hosokawa himself is working on level design should be reason enough to show that they're aware that they kind of fucked up in letting that slip with Other M in that regard.
As always when there's a hierarchy, you can blame the employees but the buck stop at the leads for letting that go into the finished product.

 

[Refreshment.01]

I honestly dont believe that Sakamoto hired them based on their previous work when all theyve done is clive barker's jericho and 3 castlevania games. All of which got middling reception except the 1st lords of shadow.

And the 2D entry on 3DS is painfully mediocre.

With all due respect Yukinari, that's a very naive take on game development.

There are lots of super talented developers that make mediocre titles mostly. Making a good game isn't just dependent on talent but on multiple other factors.

i honestly think Mercury Steam has it, it's just a matter if they can catch their golden opportunity. Maybe they won't... who knows.

That could explain how and why Other M ended up the way it did.
I guess since it's a 3DS game and a remake to boot they didn't get the tentation to make the game 3D beyond the graphics

Is Other M considered 3D? To me it's like a hybrid and it mostly works as a 2D game.

It also explains alot about Other M level design that it was handled by a Team Ninja designer. Level desing is probably the most significant problem with Other M.

Grab the same exact engine and mechanics from Other M and throw some solid Metroid level design and the game would have been actually really good. At least in terms of what matters for a Metroid game.

 

[Alex_Mexico]

It's MercurySteam on MP4, guys. You heard it here first.

It's not a wish. It's a prediction.

 

[Instro]

It's MercurySteam on MP4, guys. You heard it here first.

It's not a wish. It's a prediction.

Seems unlikely considering they are also working on Raiders of the Broken Planet right now.

 

[Mael]

With all due respect Yukinari, that's a very naive take on game development.

There are lots of super talented developers that make mediocre titles mostly. Making a good game isn't just dependent on talent but on multiple other factors.

i honestly think Mercury Steam has it, it's just a matter if they can catch their golden opportunity. Maybe they won't... who knows.

If Mercury Steam is able to pass milestones and competent enough to make stuffs run on 3DS I'm not too worried.
Their work on Castlevania at least showed that they had talented artists and had a grasp at game design.
With a good supervisor they should be able to do fantastic things.

Is Other M considered 3D? To me it's like a hybrid and it mostly works as a 2D game.

It also explains alot about Other M level design that it was handled by a Team Ninja designer. Level desing is probably the most significant problem with Other M.

Grab the same exact engine and mechanics from Other M and throw some solid Metroid level design and the game would have been actually really good. At least in terms of what matters for a Metroid game.

Other M is absolutely a 3D game.
It's a shitty one but it's still one.
For Other M to be competent, you would need to remove most of what gave the game its identity.
Basically just keep the engine running (as in what makes stuffs appear on screen and handling of music and other basic stuffs) and maybe the event engine.
You'd need to drop the controls, the progression, the map, the events in themselves, the levels, the encounter system as well as the encounters, the music and that off the top of my head.
It's a nearly as fascinating as Sonic 06 to analyse what went wrong.
and boy the story was the biggest distraction for Other M to have people talk about how crappy the level design ended up being!
e: even the gameplay loop is broken in that game!

 

[Oddish1]

Will do.

I'm surprised by how many people are treating NLG like some sort of slam-dunk call for Prime 4 because they just finished working on another Prime title. Except...are folks overlooking that it was a title that utterly bombed and was almost unilaterally panned by the community from moment one up to its release? I'm not really sure there's been any major Nintendo release with such a hostile reception from beginning to end like that, and I wouldn't be viewing that as a project that Nintendo would want to put them right back onto (nor one that NLG would necessarily want to run right back to). I don't think they should be done with Metroid altogether because of Federation Force, but they could really use a "palate cleanser" game first.

Plus, I may not recall the exact wording, but didn't the info trickle out from E3 term Prime 4 being built by "an exciting new team?" At least the implication then was that it was some internal team, perhaps EPD. Maybe it's actually a new external team but if that were the case I'm not sure why they wouldn't have just said so already.

The reasons to suspect NLG is because 1) Tanabe has worked with them often 2) They're western and Metroid Prime was created to appeal to the west and was initially given to a western studio to develop 3) NLG has expressed interest in developing Metroid games in the past 4) They've done Federation Force which could be seen as a trial run for a full fledged Metroid game.

It's not guaranteed it's NLG, but there are far more reasons to think it's them than any other developer.

 

[Mael]

The reasons to suspect NLG is because 1) Tanabe has worked with them often 2) They're western and Metroid Prime was created to appeal to the west and was initially given to a western studio to develop 3) NLG has expressed interest in developing Metroid games in the past 4) They've done Federation Force which could be seen as a trial run for a full fledged Metroid game.

It's not guaranteed it's NLG, but there are far more reasons to think it's them than any other developer.

Considering how well that went for NLG last time I can see why they withold NLG's name before having anything more concrete to announce.
I mean you don't want headlines like "Guys who made HATED Metroid game are gonna do Prime 4!"
Then again Nintendo wouldn't care about that before...

 

[yuoke]

I seriously don't think it's NLG. From what is known, they have one main team, and then a small side team. It was officially said like two years ago around e3 that they were making a wii u game that ended up getting moved to the NX. Unless they have been making prime 4 for close to 2 years now, then it has to be a different game. I definitely don't see that side team making prime 4 either since it's a major game.

 

[Toxi]

Is Other M considered 3D? To me it's like a hybrid and it mostly works as a 2D game.

Other M is 100% a 3D game. Things like auto-aim and the first-person view only exist because it's a 3D game.

It also explains alot about Other M level design that it was handled by a Team Ninja designer. Level desing is probably the most significant problem with Other M.

Grab the same exact engine and mechanics from Other M and throw some solid Metroid level design and the game would have been actually really good. At least in terms of what matters for a Metroid game.

The control scheme would still be complete ass. Using the Wii D-pad for moving in a 3D space is awful. Having a semi-fixed camera in a game with backtracking and enemies surrounding you in combat is awful. Turning the Wiimote towards the screen to aim is awful. Having a first-person lock-on system that's worse than the Prime games' is awful. Auto-aim against large groups of enemies is awful (and something the game has to compensate with the Diffusion Beam).

 

[ThisIsMyDogKyle]

I really hope it's not NLG, Prime 4 just seems a bit out of their league. of course there are very few teams that I'd consider good enough, good 3D metroidvanias are not very common. I thought Tanabe was putting together a new team to make it?

 

[KingBroly]

Considering how well that went for NLG last time I can see why they withold NLG's name before having anything more concrete to announce.
I mean you don't want headlines like "Guys who made HATED Metroid game are gonna do Prime 4!"
Then again Nintendo wouldn't care about that before...

If Prime 4 looks anything remotely like Federation Force because NLG is making it, they might as well cancel it right now. Not saying NLG is making it, nor am I saying it will look like barfed up chibi shit, but that's really the standard that Nintendo set for Prime 4 by making Federation Force.

 

[Brandon F]

Sorry for being out of the loop but do we know what Retro is working on?

Splatoon map packs.

 

[Mael]

If Prime 4 looks anything remotely like Federation Force because NLG is making it, they might as well cancel it right now. Not saying NLG is making it, nor am I saying it will look like barfed up chibi shit, but that's really the standard that Nintendo set for Prime 4 by making Federation Force.

I didn't touch Federation Forces at all, I don't know its failing or successes at all.
But seriously they need to reassure people that Prime 4 will be nothing like that...in the same way that they're showing us that M:SR is nothing like Other M.

 

[Refreshment.01]

Other M is absolutely a 3D game.
It's a shitty one but it's still one.
For Other M to be competent, you would need to remove most of what gave the game its identity.
Basically just keep the engine running (as in what makes stuffs appear on screen and handling of music and other basic stuffs) and maybe the event engine.
You'd need to drop the controls, the progression, the map, the events in themselves, the levels, the encounter system as well as the encounters, the music and that off the top of my head.
It's a nearly as fascinating as Sonic 06 to analyse what went wrong.
and boy the story was the biggest distraction for Other M to have people talk about how crappy the level design ended up being!
e: even the gameplay loop is broken in that game!

In what sense is a "3D" game? In terms of how the visuals are calculated and displayed? In terms of full 3D navigation? Can you be more specific? Basically we had the 2D series and the 3D Prime series. Movement and navigation doesn't exactly work like Prime.

Progression, map and encounters i would group under "level design". The same engine and controls could pull of a pretty good game with a higher quality work in this area.

The manual aiming system and melee actions were interesting enough aspects to make a return in Samus Returns. Manual aiming for in terms of a non 3D not Prime game just to be clear since Prime did have that.

im not sure if discussing the other aspects are worth it since you and the person below are too pationed about hating the game.

The control scheme would still be complete ass. Using the Wii D-pad for moving in a 3D space is awful. Having a semi-fixed camera in a game with backtracking and enemies surrounding you in combat is awful. Turning the Wiimote towards the screen to aim is awful. Having a first-person lock-on system that's worse than the Prime games' is awful. Auto-aim against large groups of enemies is awful (and something the game has to compensate with the Diffusion Beam).

Objectively speaking the controls are not awful. That's just an opinion. The game is made to work using the Dpad and once the user is adjusted to the way movement works it can get consistent results.

To be perfectly clear, i do prefer the analog style movement we got in Mario 64 using a thumbstick as it feels less rigid (instead of a grid like movement). But to say the controls are "awful" is an exageration that steems from them not being what you like or prefer.

Having to change the way you hold the controller just to get another perspective is not good control. The controls are also so simplified as a result that most of the added complexity they tried to add ended up being automated useless fluffs that should have stayed on the cutting room floor.

There's something missing from the reply: "Why?"

Why is not good? Besides that, what do you think couldn't be implemented just with the Wii Remote alone in comparison to past traditional games like the 2D ones? The simplification of aspects of the game can be a developer choice and does not necessairily are a consequence of the more simplified Wii Remote input system.

Also im not sure about your take on manual aiming. Manual aiming serves the same goal in both Other M and Samus return: Pin point accuracy in either a 3D or 2D environement respectivly.

Manual aiming in Other M serves it's purpose, to allow the player full control of where to aim the missiles in a very natural way. Why do you feel it was useless?

Also most of the list of complains you put there are what im traying to say. If you use the exact same engine with a more traditional Metroid mold you would get a competent game. Even with the elements Other M introduced like Melee attacks, controls and manual aiming. Other things are adjustments that are easy to make and would not be incompatible with the main elements introuced in Other M.

 

[essenn]

Isn't it the new team in Kyoto doing Metroid Prime 4?

Nintendo's Bill Trinen revealed at a group interview that the game is being built by a ”talented new development team."

NLG isn't "new"

 

[Mael]

In what sense is a "3D" game? In terms of how the visuals are calculated and displayed? In terms of full 3D navigation? Can you be more specific? Basically we had the 2D series and the 3D Prime series. Movement and navigation doesn't exactly work like Prime.

Other M is a 3D game.
I mean the gameworld is a 3D space and you navigate a 3D space as well.
I mean it's not a 3D game like 3DS games are or other VR products but it's as much a 3D game as Mario 64 ever was.
M:SR is a 2D game using 3D graphics, you navigate the gameworld in a 2D space.

Progression, map and encounters i would group under level design. The same engine and controls could pull of a pretty good game.

Depends on what you put in the engine.
the camera angle could work after all but the way they're used in the game is really bad (the game isn't made to count on backtracking after all).
The controls are absolutely atrocious.
they're a shitty compromise, they needed to absolutely drop anything to do with 1st person.
That shit is pointless, useless and detract from the game.
The auto aim needs to go as well as the auto dodge shit that makes the game a cakewalk.
Powerups need a revamp as well as it's pretty clear there's nothing interesting in that game.
They managed to make space jump boring due to all the invisible walls around.
They would have been better served with just using the nunchuk as it would allow manual aiming as well as not force the level design in the grid layout they had to fit the game into.
Resulting in more natural environments that are more conducing to better level design.
Seriously that decision to only use the wiimote doomed the project and made the game so much worse than it could have been. It's part of the problem.

The manual aiming system and melee actions were interesting enough aspects to make a return in Samus Returns. Manual aiming for in terms of a non 3D not Prime game just to be clear since Prime did have that.

im not sure if discussing the other aspects are worth it since you and the person below are too pationed about hating the game.

The manual aiming in Other M is nothing like in M:SR. It doesn't work the same way and actually enhance the game in a way.
The melee actions are more SSB than Other M as well.
They're not limited to finisher moves with camera angles to begin with and are more reactive in nature. The only reactive move in Other M is charging your shot if you even do that.
Other M brought so little to the table we can barely find stuffs that are in M:SR that were also uniquely in Other M and we have to stretch to even make the jump.
If M:SR have forced walking sections and find waldo sections it would be clearer...

Also do not mistake my arguments as blind hatred for the game, I can lay out pages upon pages why it failed at nearly everything it tried....without touching the story, VA or other common complaints.

Objectively speaking the controls are not awful. That's just an opinion. The game is made to work using the Dpad and once the user is adjusted to the way movement works it can get consistent results.

To be perfectly clear, i do prefer the analog style movement we got in Mario 64 using a thumbstick as it feels less rigid (instead of a grid like movement). But to say the controls are "awful" is an exageration that steems from them not being what you like or prefer.

Having to change the way you hold the controller just to get another perspective is not good control. The controls are also so simplified as a result that most of the added complexity they tried to add ended up being automated useless fluffs that should have stayed on the cutting room floor.

 

[KingBroly]

Isn't it the new team in Kyoto doing Metroid Prime 4?

NLG isn't "new"

It depends on Nintendo's definition of "new."

New to the series? Built from the ground up? Or an already existing team?


If it had to be an external team, the best team TO ME, would be Rocksteady.

 

[Mael]

It depends on Nintendo's definition of "new."

New to the series? Built from the ground up? Or an already existing team?


If it had to be an external team, the best team TO ME, would be Rocksteady.

NLG fit no category for new.
FF was a Metroid Prime game after all.
If you ask me the best team aside Retro Studios (of course) would probably be Guerrilla Games if they were available, because really their artists are incredible.
From Software would be a good fit for obvious reasons, although a part of their people wouldn't be doing anything at all in such a project.
Otherwise take anyone you want but have artists that are at least as capable as the ones that worked on the previous Prime games.

 

[Oddish1]

NLG fit no category for new.
FF was a Metroid Prime game after all.
If you ask me the best team aside Retro Studios (of course) would probably be Guerrilla Games if they were available, because really their artists are incredible.
From Software would be a good fit for obvious reasons, although a part of their people wouldn't be doing anything at all in such a project.
Otherwise take anyone you want but have artists that are at least as capable as the ones that worked on the previous Prime games.

Can't say I understand what From Software brings, I've always put suggestions for them on the same level as Platinum suggestions. Dark Souls 1 had Metroidvania like level structure but none of their other souls games did. Their games are focused on stamina based combat and RPG mechanics while Metroid never has. Even the atmosphere they're invoking is different as Souls games are more bleak and oppressive while Metroid is meant to be isolating and alien.

 

[Mael]

Can't say I understand what From Software brings, I've always put suggestions for them on the same level as Platinum suggestions. Dark Souls 1 had Metroidvania like level structure but none of their other souls games did. Their games are focused on stamina based combat and RPG mechanics while Metroid never has. Even the atmosphere they're invoking is different as Souls games are more bleak and oppressive while Metroid is meant to be isolating and alien.

Look up their art design.
It's literally why I want them to do it.
They're competent enough to be able to make a game with compelling gameplay and their level design is usually conducive to exploration so they understand that part too.
Gameplay loop and nearly everything else is different but they understand the important of exploration and art in their games.

 

[BRSxIgnition]

Look up their art design.
It's literally why I want them to do it.
They're competent enough to be able to make a game with compelling gameplay and their level design is usually conducive to exploration so they understand that part too.
Gameplay loop and nearly everything else is different but they understand the important of exploration and art in their games.

Yep, pretty much.

On a scale, FROM as a developer would be much closer to matching the core tenants of 3D Metroid games than someone like Team Ninja, at the very least.

 

[VDenter]

Federation Force was somehow worse than Other M. So if NLG turns out to be the team developing Prime 4 along with Tanabe pushing crappy characters like Sylux then this game has a really steep mountain to climb if it wants any chance to live up to the previous Prime games.

I am really more than ever interested to see what exactly Retro has been working on for nearly four years now.

 

[yuoke]

Federation Force was somehow worse than Other M. So if NLG turns out to be the team developing Prime 4 along with Tanabe pushing crappy characters like Sylux then this game has a really steep mountain to climb if it wants any chance to live up to the previous Prime games.

I am really more than ever interested to see what exactly Retro has been working on for nearly four years now.

Retro probably either has been making a 3d Dk, or a new IP.

 

[foxuzamaki]

I didn't touch Federation Forces at all, I don't know its failing or successes at all.
But seriously they need to reassure people that Prime 4 will be nothing like that...in the same way that they're showing us that M:SR is nothing like Other M.

They don't have to reassure people at all, people should be smart enough to know what Metroid prime 4, a nom spinoff game should entail, FF Was a spinoff with a Artstyle that usually accommodates small handheld titles

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

NLG should be doing Luigi's Mansion 3, not MP4.

They should have been making that instead of FF. It should be out by now already.

Look up their art design.
It's literally why I want them to do it.
They're competent enough to be able to make a game with compelling gameplay and their level design is usually conducive to exploration so they understand that part too.
Gameplay loop and nearly everything else is different but they understand the important of exploration and art in their games.

And WORLD BUILDING. They are tops in the industry when it comes to that. And that is part of why the Prime games and Retro are so revered, and they would be the perfect ones to have the torch be handed to them.

 

[Eolz]

Can't say I understand what From Software brings, I've always put suggestions for them on the same level as Platinum suggestions. Dark Souls 1 had Metroidvania like level structure but none of their other souls games did. Their games are focused on stamina based combat and RPG mechanics while Metroid never has. Even the atmosphere they're invoking is different as Souls games are more bleak and oppressive while Metroid is meant to be isolating and alien.

On top of that, From always had issues with cameras and never shown any potential at making an FPS.
People are just throwing names of their favorite developers at this point...

 

[KingBroly]

They don't have to reassure people at all, people should be smart enough to know what Metroid prime 4, a nom spinoff game should entail, FF Was a spinoff with a Artstyle that usually accommodates small handheld titles

When Nintendo revealed Metroid Prime Federation Force, thinking it was a great idea, got destroyed, then later said fans were "confused by it" when they 100% weren't, assurances need to be made that Prime 4 won't follow the same trappings.

Remember, Prime 4 is being made for a handheld SKU (unless they make it Docked Only, which may not even be possible), so it technically IS a handheld game.

 

[13ruce]

I seriously don't think it's NLG. From what is known, they have one main team, and then a small side team. It was officially said like two years ago around e3 that they were making a wii u game that ended up getting moved to the NX. Unless they have been making prime 4 for close to 2 years now, then it has to be a different game. I definitely don't see that side team making prime 4 either since it's a major game.

Next Level probably is making Luigi's Mansion 3 for Switch, 2 sold around 4.7m copies. So it kinda is a no brainer if i was Nintendo i would let em do LM3 for Switch.

 

[Oddish1]

Look up their art design.
It's literally why I want them to do it.
They're competent enough to be able to make a game with compelling gameplay and their level design is usually conducive to exploration so they understand that part too.
Gameplay loop and nearly everything else is different but they understand the important of exploration and art in their games.

I mean, their art is really good but it's typically dark fantasy and not sci-fi. Bloodborne might be closer but it's also much grosser and unpleasant than what Metroid goes for. I don't really see it. If you're just saying they have good artists then Platinum has good artists. Heck, Bayonetta also encourages exploration so you can find collectibles and challenge rooms. AND Platinum already has an existing relationship with Nintendo.

So I guess what I'm saying is that Platinum is almost certainly making Metroid Prime 4.

 

[iamaustrian]

Is it confirmed that Prime will be developed by a 3rd party developer?

I can imagine that an important game of such a caliber and with such great predecessors would be developed indoors.

 

[DecoReturns]

Should be Hal

The sadistic nature of the Kirby games fits well with Metroid.

Plus I'm not sure you've noticed this but Kirby and Samus both have 5 characters in their name. It's destiny.

 

[Eolz]

Is it confirmed that Prime will be developed by a 3rd party developer?

Not at all no.
Only thing they've said is "a talented new dev team" (which could mean anything, and not Retro/NST/TN/NLG, even if any could help as support) and Tanabe at the helm.

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

On top of that, From always had issues with cameras and never shown any potential at making an FPS.
People are just throwing names of their favorite developers at this point...

No, that's what is happening when people say Platinum. Metroid has nothing in common with any that Platinum has ever done. FROM has shown the kind of atmosphere, world building, sound/environmental/enemy design, minimalistic storytelling, etc that would carry over well to Metroid. Just because they haven't made a FPS doesn't mean they couldn't. Remember that Retro never made a FPS before Prime and never a 2D Platformer before DK, and they knocked them both out of the park.

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

Next Level probably is making Luigi's Mansion 3 for Switch, 2 sold around 4.7m copies. So it kinda is a no brainer if i was Nintendo i would let em do LM3 for Switch.

The no brainer would have been to start work on a sequel immediately following 2. I still think they're making Prime 4.

Edit: Sorry for the double.

 

[Eolz]

No, that's what is happening when people say Platinum. Metroid has nothing in common with any that Platinum has ever done. FROM has shown the kind of atmosphere, world building, sound/environmental/enemy design, minimalistic storytelling, etc that would carry over well to Metroid. Just because they haven't made a FPS doesn't mean they couldn't. Remember that Retro never made a FPS before Prime and never a 2D Platformer before DK, and they knocked them both out of the park.

They've made first person games before. The guys that were part of OG Retro did first person games before.
Compare both, both Platinum and From have specific gameplay mindsets that don't fit with MP. Knowing how to make something isn't useful if you can't make it the proper way.

 

[Easy_D]

It will be a partnership between some (existing) studios, internal and external.

Other M was technically developed by "Project M" and Brawl by "The Studio", but most of the staff was respectively from Team Ninja and Game Arts.

It will be the same for Prime 4, it will be developed by an ad-hoc development team with a heavy involvement of Nintendo (in contrast with totally outsourced games games like Hey! Pikmin) and most of staff from an existing software house like, for example, Namco.

It not being a strictly Retro Studios affair also means they could bring some old Prime devs on-board as well. I heard there's been a ton of staff changes at Retro anyway, so doubt there's a lot of Prime staffers left since 2008.

I hope they bring the same concept artist on board, his stuff is on point.

They've made first person games before. The guys that were part of OG Retro did first person games before.
Compare both, both Platinum and From have specific gameplay mindsets that don't fit with MP. Knowing how to make something isn't useful if you can't make it the proper way.

The Prime dudes were old Turok devs weren't they?

 

[Toxi]

In what sense is a "3D" game? In terms of how the visuals are calculated and displayed? In terms of full 3D navigation? Can you be more specific? Basically we had the 2D series and the 3D Prime series. Movement and navigation doesn't exactly work like Prime.

It's a 3D game in the sense that you navigate 3D environments with 3D movement. That's usually what defines a 3D game, not "plays exactly like Metroid Prime".

There's something missing from the reply: "Why?"

Why is not good?

The switch to first person involves turning the Wiimote, so the game has to literally slow the action down to allow you to actually center your aiming reticule.

This is a system that's so clunky the game has to give you a second to adjust. That's not "immediate" or "responsive" or "natural". That's a crappy system with a bandaid thrown on. It doesn't feel good, and it could have easily been fixed by just using the nunchuck so that you could constantly hold the Wiimote in the same position for both third and first person.

Other M's combat system is a fucking mess. For example, the Overblast doesn't work half the time. You jump at an enemy with a charge built up and... You just fall down next to the enemy. You try jumping again and again and still no animation plays. Then you do the same thing again and this time it works even though there's no indication of why. It's not like there are specific consistent rules for when you can do an Overblast; you can overblast enemies mid-attack or when they're strafing or when they're prone. It just doesn't work consistently.

 

[NintendosBooger]

Cautiously optimistic about MP4.

Tanabe's batting average outside of his Retro Studios collaborations is underwhelming to say the least. Next Level Games is a good team if managed and steered appropriately which is why I put the FF fiasco all on Tanabe and now I'm hesitant to see him lead this unknown team to produce Nintendo's most complicated IP.

 

[Easy_D]

I still don't understand the rationale of not using nunchuk controls in a 3D game. It was to make controls simpler?

You had to physically aim your controller in specific directions to do shit, that's complicated

Next Level probably is making Luigi's Mansion 3 for Switch, 2 sold around 4.7m copies. So it kinda is a no brainer if i was Nintendo i would let em do LM3 for Switch.

Damn, it sold that well? Nintendo must've been very pleased to see a sequel to a pretty niche Gamecube launch title sell that much :O

 

[Astral Dog]

They should have been making that instead of FF. It should be out by now already.



And WORLD BUILDING. They are tops in the industry when it comes to that. And that is part of why the Prime games and Retro are so revered, and they would be the perfect ones to have the torch be handed to them.

They aren't known for their fps though, i can see them working on anaction adventure game