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[Rikkun]

Brief change-of-topic: apparently Marble Zone's music was hiding in Sonic [1] for the Master System's soundtrack this entire time, and we've only just noticed it.

The guy who found it's checked; there aren't any other hidden songs, although there appears to be evidence that some other songs were hastily overwritten.

First thing I thought: "Wow it's even faster than the Megadrive version!"

Then I realised and remembered why I never plug my PAL console to play.

EDIT: Wait it's faster than the 60hz version. And wow, I prefer the SMS version.

50hz MD version, for comparison..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fi0mFh7Y1ro

 

[TheOGB]

Brief change-of-topic: apparently Marble Zone's music was hiding in Sonic [1] for the Master System's soundtrack this entire time, and we've only just noticed it.

The guy who found it's checked; there aren't any other hidden songs, although there appears to be evidence that some other songs were hastily overwritten.

Strange, that song sounds like a natural fit for the Master System version.

 

[Noi]

Ealier in the year, I decided to volunteer to make the monthly Vita threads to replace Megathread that had built up for the system. I was fine with doing so and put quite a bit of effort into looking up the info for each new thread, as well as putting up little descriptors for the games coming out to stimulate discussion about said games. I enjoyed my time in the first few threads and had some good discussion take place, but at the same time noticed that there were some posters that posted there that essentially had the ability to drastically redirect the flow of discussion to draw attention to themselves. It was easy to ignore at first and even turned a bit into a running joke for a while (the title for the latest Vita game OT is even named after one of them).

What did make me lose a lot of my motivation happened one month where I had a lot more schoolwork to do than usual, so I had to pass on doing the game descriptions I usually did and posted a note saying I'd do them later in the week. Not one person seemed to notice the lack of descriptors or comment about them, so the following month I did the same thing on purpose abd got the same result. It really did make me feel like a lot of the effort I put into the threads was irrelevant (and fed into the awful "no one reads the OP" mentality).

To add to it, the aforementioned posters got more aggressive. Not a page would go by without one of them posting one of their controversial opinions, which someone else would reply to and completely derail whatever discussion was happening at the time. I could have dealt with that alone, but that coupled together with the OP thing was enough to get me to give it all up. It's rough when you feel compelled to unsubscribe to a thread you yourself created.

I'd also echo Schala's feelings of feeling like OTs can be a little too "group-huggy" at times. I can be fairly critical about games, so I've had more than one occasion where someone would go out of their way to tell me that I'm being too negative and looking for any reason to dislike the game, to the point where I'd rather talk about other things here than in their OTs (plus I almost always get a response from someone here whereas OT posts can often go entirely ignored, especially if it's a subject a lot of people are posting about at once/aren't talking at all about).

 

[Razzer]

Brief change-of-topic: apparently Marble Zone's music was hiding in Sonic [1] for the Master System's soundtrack this entire time, and we've only just noticed it.

The guy who found it's checked; there aren't any other hidden songs, although there appears to be evidence that some other songs were hastily overwritten.

Now, to address the subject that brought all the mods in:

I was gonna suggest that, too. If the issue is that people would rather flock to news articles instead of discussion threads, drowning the latter out, perhaps splitting them up would make that a bit easier.

However, I'm also not sure further breaking the forums up is the correct way to go... It might just make everyone flock to the "Gaming News" forum and leave "Gaming Discussion" completely behind. And even then, there's no guarantees that "Gaming Discussion" would magically have more intelligent discussion after the fact; it'd still probably be filled with "first post wins" or "NINTENDOOMED" or "damn this Sony bias on GAF" or AntonioBanderasInReverse.GIF or similar things detrimental to the conversation.

It does seem like topics about older games, provided people notice them, tend to attract the more civilized discussions, I've noticed. Most of RetroGAF (the Genesis/Mega Drive thread, the SNES thread, the Upscaler/RGB thread, etc) are similarly just there to express their love of games - no tawdry take thats to be seen, usually. They do tend to stay more on topic than SonicGAF does, admittedly...

This might be because there is no political side to link into as Schala mentioned. The Sega Nintendo wars etc are long gone so people don't argue over it like they do about Microsoft and Sony etc these days.

 

[Shadow Hog]

This might be because there is no political side to link into as Schala mentioned. The Sega Nintendo wars etc are long gone so people don't argue over it like they do about Microsoft and Sony etc these days.

Well, unless you attach a poll to it. At which point, all the close-minded opinions and trolls come crawling out of the woodwork.

Admittedly, I didn't pay much attention to that thread, but from what I've heard from people on both sides of RetroGAF, it was kind of awkward to read.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Someone pointed my attention to this thread and asked me my thoughts, considering the current discussion, so keep in mind i don't speak as a regular to this one specific thread, but as someone that finds myself less and less interested in discussion on GAF as a whole.

I think one of the reasons people discuss in community threads (I myself have moved most of my gaming-related conversation to Twitter and IRC) is because they can cultivate who they talk to. They don't have to worry that, if they post an opinion that dissents from the designated opinion of a thread (i.e., an OT is only for love, a hate thread is only for hate), it will get dismissed or yelled at. I'm gonna be honest: there's nothing you can do about that. People most excited and invested in a product will post in the OT, people who are really angry and hateful of something will want that opinion reinforced in a thread with that tone. You could police every single post, but it won't move the needle.

Change in GAF has to come from within. People who respond aggressively to being disagreed with or go to illogical extremes for reactions should be ignored. But, since they're not, since discussion has become what it has, people like to move their discussion where they feel they can avoid that.

If it ends up being that all the good discussion is hiding from world outside in their own communities, well, at least the good discussion is there instead of nowhere. Schala felt comfortable posting her Tearaway review here, but she (probably?) would not have in the Tearaway thread. Here, with people who know her, and people who want to know what she thinks about a platformer, it won't be ignored or attacked, people will be genuinely interested.

It's not a problem that can be fixed with moderation, short of closing every community thread and forcing discussion in to On-Topic (which would just drive people in to IRC more, in all likelihood). The tone has changed too much without intervention for intervention to really matter now. If people feel alienated in on-topic GAF and couldn't post their thoughts here, they would just take them somewhere else.

Plus there's not a lot you can do to "fix" GAF to make a place for legitimate discussion that other people would not find to be "sucking the soul" out of GAF. For example, I was rolling my eyes on twitter yesterday about how shinobi602 creates sensationalist threads and I couldn't for the life of me figure out what he's getting out of it. GAF would probably be a better place for adult discussion without that stuff, but there are no doubt people that enjoy GAF as that kind of place. And, perhaps this is the problem, they appear to be the majority.

I think the question needs to be asked of everyone at some point, but what does GAF offer you that other social places on the internet don't? For the people in the community threads, it is like-minded individuals and a convenient place to talk to all of them. I feel like that should be celebrated rather than shaped, since that's the best that can be done with this situation.

 

[BlackJace]

Also, people on Gaming side are fully aware of a sort of stigma that Community side is. I've seem far too many posts saying "Aw damn, we're going to be banished to the Community outback", or "this thread will die in the Communtiy wastelands".

It's become a sort of a bad thing for threads to be moved here, and I can't really figure out why. One would think that it would actually bolster the thread and make it more streamlined, but it seems like the opposite happens. So many threads die in community that would definetely be alive if it were on Gaming. I've also seen someone state that they don't even check Community because "all they do is talk about X series, or Y games". I can't for the life of me imagine why that would be an off putting thing.

 

[Sciz]

*refresh*

oh god that's a lot of red text

.


So, uh... hm. SonicGAF is a slightly unusual case, I think. The thread got started solely because there was a set of users who really did want to talk about the series in depth and couldn't help spiraling off on tangents in every related thread in Gaming. The catch you run into when discussing Sonic games is that they've run the full spectrum of quality in every regard, which prompts an awful lot of talk about game design. By the time we'd finally burned through the pent-up energy about a year later, we found ourselves in the company of a small crowd of like-minded enthusiasts who really knew how to talk about video games, and topicality dwindled from there.

It's also interesting that SonicGAF serves as something of a nexus for the fan community across the internet as a whole. There's staff from something like three different fansites who post here, and we've had RubyEclipse and one of the comic's staff drop by in the past as well.

For my part, I don't actively avoid Gaming, but it's terribly difficult to get any close-knit discussion over there. There's a lovely sense of genuine community here, to the degree that there's quite a lot of birthday well-wishing without any prompting from the person in question. Most of the more compelling off-topic discussion takes the form of blog-style musings that don't really warrant a full thread, but which wouldn't garner much notice in an appropriately related topic (if any happen to exist) in Gaming because the front page moves bloody fast. And I like how that discussion can flow from one subject to another without being guided by an overarching topic (see the R&C -> DOOM talk from a couple pages back).

I suppose the problem is primarily one of nomenclature. A "community" thread suggests a much different thing to me than a "discussion" thread, and I don't envy moderation's position in having to distinguish between the two. Having these threads segregated from the rest of the site doesn't help matters, although I understand why that policy was established in the first place and have absolutely no idea how to reconcile the conflict there.

edit: Also, I suspect that having a degree of off-topic discussion actually generates more Sonic discussion than would otherwise exist, as the steady stream of material gets more eyes on Sonic talk more quickly when it does come up. The Mega Man thread, to give an example, has some interesting stuff posted in it periodically, but I just don't check in all that often because it can go for days without posts. It's the inverse problem of Gaming being too big and too generalized.

And even then, there's no guarantees that "Gaming Discussion" would magically have more intelligent discussion after the fact; it'd still probably be filled with "first post wins" or "NINTENDOOMED" or "damn this Sony bias on GAF" or AntonioBanderasInReverse.GIF or similar things detrimental to the conversation.

Also, while I'm sure this isn't news to anyone in moderation, all of this needs to be reined back in, badly. First posting and gifs are part of GAF's DNA, but memetic posting is starting to overrun the board.

Brief change-of-topic: apparently Marble Zone's music was hiding in Sonic [1] for the Master System's soundtrack this entire time, and we've only just noticed it.

The guy who found it's checked; there aren't any other hidden songs, although there appears to be evidence that some other songs were hastily overwritten.

The obvious question this brings to mind is whether or not Marble Zone was meant to be in the game, then. Perhaps 8-bit Sonic 1 was meant to be a straight downport originally?

 

[ViewtifulJC]

Similarly, I've lost count of how many "GAMING/OFF-TOPIC SIDE, AMIRITE FELLAS" post I've read in community threads over the years. It really does seem like two different worlds that happen to share servers sometimes and occasionally intermingle.

 

[PKrockin]

Honestly when so many threads move like chatrooms a lazy guy like me often just ends up going with that group mentality and posting something I'd look back a few minutes later and call pretty pointless and unnecessary. I'm not proud of it. Hell, even with as many times as I've done it, on twice as many occassions I've hit Preview Post, realized what I've written adds pretty much nothing to the thread, and closed the tab.

Why is it exactly that nobody ever talks about Master System Sonic anymore? I've only ever seen it mentioned by you guys and when it was on Awesome Games Done Quick one year. Is it because the Master System didn't sell well in the US?

 

[Sciz]

Why is it exactly that nobody ever talks about Master System Sonic anymore? I've only ever seen it mentioned by you guys and when it was on Awesome Games Done Quick one year. Is it because the Master System didn't sell well in the US?

They were all on the Game Gear as well, which did alright.

They're just not all that good.

 

[Seven Force]

Brief change-of-topic: apparently Marble Zone's music was hiding in Sonic [1] for the Master System's soundtrack this entire time, and we've only just noticed it.

The guy who found it's checked; there aren't any other hidden songs, although there appears to be evidence that some other songs were hastily overwritten.

Wow, this is pretty awesome. I love little discoveries like this.

Honestly surprised this wasn't found sooner, though.

 

[TheOGB]

I was going to say that I liked having "two sides" to GAF, but I suppose in reality I've just gotten used to it. When I go to Gaming side I expect a lot of people to post without thinking, and then I go in and do the same. It ends up being just a dumb, good time, a quick laugh at a dumb post. I've gotten used to going into Gaming side (and hell, Off-Topic too) just looking for a "good time", and I'd bet a lot of other posters do too.

But I see what all the mods are saying, and the moment you turn on your brain you realize what a terrible idea that is. We shouldn't be turning off our brains, this is a forum for discussion. But I also agree with ShockingAlberto, in that this culture should come from the posters (and mods are posters too). That's something I've indirectly been realizing with the whole PS4 Playroom fiasco; we need to hold ourselves to higher standards, and we need to encourage each other to have high standards for ourselves, because yelling and scolding only go so far.

 

[AniHawk]

Someone pointed my attention to this thread and asked me my thoughts, considering the current discussion, so keep in mind i don't speak as a regular to this one specific thread, but as someone that finds myself less and less interested in discussion on GAF as a whole.

I think one of the reasons people discuss in community threads (I myself have moved most of my gaming-related conversation to Twitter and IRC) is because they can cultivate who they talk to. They don't have to worry that, if they post an opinion that dissents from the designated opinion of a thread (i.e., an OT is only for love, a hate thread is only for hate), it will get dismissed or yelled at. I'm gonna be honest: there's nothing you can do about that. People most excited and invested in a product will post in the OT, people who are really angry and hateful of something will want that opinion reinforced in a thread with that tone. You could police every single post, but it won't move the needle.

Change in GAF has to come from within. People who respond aggressively to being disagreed with or go to illogical extremes for reactions should be ignored. But, since they're not, since discussion has become what it has, people like to move their discussion where they feel they can avoid that.

If it ends up being that all the good discussion is hiding from world outside in their own communities, well, at least the good discussion is there instead of nowhere. Schala felt comfortable posting her Tearaway review here, but she (probably?) would not have in the Tearaway thread. Here, with people who know her, and people who want to know what she thinks about a platformer, it won't be ignored or attacked, people will be genuinely interested.

It's not a problem that can be fixed with moderation, short of closing every community thread and forcing discussion in to On-Topic (which would just drive people in to IRC more, in all likelihood). The tone has changed too much without intervention for intervention to really matter now. If people feel alienated in on-topic GAF and couldn't post their thoughts here, they would just take them somewhere else.

Plus there's not a lot you can do to "fix" GAF to make a place for legitimate discussion that other people would not find to be "sucking the soul" out of GAF. For example, I was rolling my eyes on twitter yesterday about how shinobi602 creates sensationalist threads and I couldn't for the life of me figure out what he's getting out of it. GAF would probably be a better place for adult discussion without that stuff, but there are no doubt people that enjoy GAF as that kind of place. And, perhaps this is the problem, they appear to be the majority.

I think the question needs to be asked of everyone at some point, but what does GAF offer you that other social places on the internet don't? For the people in the community threads, it is like-minded individuals and a convenient place to talk to all of them. I feel like that should be celebrated rather than shaped, since that's the best that can be done with this situation.

i agree with you on this. i feel that people wouldn't suddenly be encouraged to post in main threads more seriously- they'd just sooner stop posting. i feel that segata sanshiro would be with us today if a thread like this was in existence at the time of his leaving. it's a real shame that he left and never looked back.

 

[PKrockin]

I was going to say that I liked having "two sides" to GAF, but I suppose in reality I've just gotten used to it. When I go to Gaming side I expect a lot of people to post without thinking, and then I go in and do the same. It ends up being just a dumb, good time, a quick laugh at a dumb post. I've gotten used to going into Gaming side (and hell, Off-Topic too) just looking for a "good time", and I'd bet a lot of other posters do too.

But I see what all the mods are saying, and the moment you turn on your brain you realize what a terrible idea that is. We shouldn't be turning off our brains, this is a forum for discussion. But I also agree with ShockingAlberto, in that this culture should come from the posters (and mods are posters too). That's something I've indirectly been realizing with the whole PS4 Playroom fiasco; we need to hold ourselves to higher standards, and we need to encourage each other to have high standards for ourselves, because yelling and scolding only go so far.

Yeah, it can be fun, but sites like GameFAQs, /v/, etc. exist for this too. GAF has the potential to be more, I think.

Speaking of which, it's funny, GameFAQs is experiencing something similar. Go to the console boards or any popular game board, and it's trolling, drive-by posting, etc. But go to the smaller boards and you'll find the regulars actually do have good discussion.

 

[TheOGB]

Yeah, it can be fun, but sites like GameFAQs, /v/, etc. exist for this too. GAF has the potential to be more, I think.

Speaking of which, it's funny, GameFAQs is experiencing something similar. Go to the console boards or any popular game board, and it's trolling, drive-by posting, etc. But go to the smaller boards and you'll find the regulars actually do have good discussion.

Definitely, this isn't GAF-exclusive. This is what gaming forum culture has become. It's what's expected of us, and what many expect of themselves. That's why we gotta remind each other that, just like you said, we have the potential to be better than we are and what we're expected to be.

 

[Razzer]

If the mods want to really make a concerted effort, then I think you should firstly draw up some tactics that you could use to encourage better posting and get rid of the aggressiveness discussed. After this, make an announcement for all to see saying all the things discussed here, and mentioning that you want to try and change the atmosphere that has developed. Talk about what kind of posting you would like to see, and then invite all the people who have stopped posting as much in Gaming side to come back with one big effort to make things better. But it would be important that you have a well thought out plan before making such an announcement as it will take a concerted effort to change an entire culture. Even if it is a forum culture rather than an IRL society, the principles are the same.

 

[tiggerkiddo]

I'm not very good with meaningful discussion because i got bashed far too often when i was younger so now i just don't have the patience.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Apropos of nothing, I was endlessly amused when the Vita megathread got shut down because all megathreads got shut down and then they just recreated it as a monthly thread a day later.

 

[Shouta]

I was going to say that I liked having "two sides" to GAF, but I suppose in reality I've just gotten used to it. When I go to Gaming side I expect a lot of people to post without thinking, and then I go in and do the same. It ends up being just a dumb, good time, a quick laugh at a dumb post. But then I come here and I can be critical about something

I see what all the mods are saying, and the moment you turn on your brain you realize what a terrible idea that is. We shouldn't be turning off our brains, this is a forum for discussion. But I also agree with ShockedAlberto, in that this culture should come from the posters (and mods are posters too). That's something I've indirectly been realizing with the whole PS4 Playroom fiasco; we need to hold ourselves to higher standards, and we need to encourage each other to have high standards for ourselves, because yelling and scolding only go so far.

There are folks over the years that continued to pursue discussion in spite of all the foolishness around. Those people brought others that are willing to talk and things change. As I said in my previous post, good discussion begets good discussion that further brings people in.

I feel that these people didn't have others to hold them to a higher standard but held themselves to one. As a result, others responded to it and we got great posters over the years. But to do so requires an incredible amount of fortitude and patience which is hard to do with insanity going on all around. It's possible though and it really adds to making this place better. Things do get better as well. Many attitudes have changed towards certain groups on this forum over the years thanks in part to both the mods and the posters that were willing to dig their heels in. It's not the same thing as trying to promote discussion but I think it's an example of how this place can change if folks are willing to stick to it.

We as mods, don't want to destroy the smaller atmosphere found in specific threads but we do want the forum as a whole to be better. To do that, we need good posters and the good content they bring to be shown to everyone. In our roles, we can only direct it not generate it ourselves. This is kind of why we jumped in this thread. We'd like this good stuff to be shown to other folks, even if it only gets 25 replies instead of 250. This is one of the reasons why the forum has kept from creating sub-forums over the years until absolutely necessary. There are other reasons, of course, but that unified identity is part of what makes this place different from other forums.

Apropos of nothing, I was endlessly amused when the Vita megathread got shut down because all megathreads got shut down and then they just recreated it as a monthly thread a day later.

Personally, I think that that format for a thread is actually a decent middle ground over one single megathread as it keeps new folks coming in and doesn't necessarily get stuck in a rut as often. However, it's only really applicable to general topics, especially ones that gain new information routinely like Vita games or comic books, etc. In fact, comic books and manga each use a separate format for their threads and both seem to work really well, heh.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

There are folks over the years that continued to pursue discussion in spite of all the foolishness around. Those people brought others that are willing to talk and things change. As I said in my previous post, good discussion begets good discussion that further brings people in.

I think what people, including me, are trying to say is that this is no longer true in a realistic capacity.

You're probably right that eventually things would change if everyone tried their best and just grinned and bared it, but no one really wants to volunteer to be the first bodies on the pikes so everyone else can crawl over them. It's especially an unappetizing proposition when they can just as easily enjoy their free time not doing that.

I dunno, between the two hypothetical options of "Post more and make GAF better by working toward it" and "Just talk about video games with people unlikely to defend sexual assault on video," it's hard for me to want to dedicate my leisure time to the first one.

 

[Shouta]

I think what people, including me, are trying to say is that this is no longer true in a realistic capacity.

You're probably right that eventually things would change if everyone tried their best and just grinned and bared it, but no one really wants to volunteer to be the first bodies on the pikes so everyone else can crawl over them. It's especially an unappetizing proposition when they can just as easily enjoy their free time not doing that.

I dunno, between the two hypothetical options of "Post more and make GAF better by working toward it" and "Just talk about video games with people unlikely to defend sexual assault on video," it's hard for me to want to dedicate my leisure time to the first one.

I disagree, I think it's realistically possible.

However, I do understand that folks don't have the time or energy to do so. I am much the same nowadays. I don't have as much time to talk about games or stuff I enjoy as I used (which is why my in-depth game posts have dwindled) to but when I do, I post it up. If I can get someone to respond well, I'm quite happy.

To me that's the entire appeal of posting on a forum. Getting to find different people to discuss stuff with and to get different perspectives. If I wanted to banter about the latest thing in X game or Y show, I can do that with folks on facebook or twitter or in person. But that's just my reasons for going to forums.

 

[Dark Schala]

On-thread topic:

Why is it exactly that nobody ever talks about Master System Sonic anymore? I've only ever seen it mentioned by you guys and when it was on Awesome Games Done Quick one year. Is it because the Master System didn't sell well in the US?

Like Sciz said, they were put on the Game Gear and they weren't very good games to begin with. Sonic 2 8-bit, for example, is like the bane of my existence along with Sonic Blast GG (which did get ported to the SMS, and that version is remarkably worse than the GG version).

We had a bit of a quibble in here when we discussed the merits of Sonic 1 GG/SMS once because some of us really liked the special stages in it, and some of us didn't care much for it. Overall, though, if you had a Genesis and a Game Gear, you probably weren't going to play the SMS version of something you either have another version of, or something you've already played.

I'd also like to add that there is a fan-made version of Sonic Triple Trouble for the SMS by Glitch. It has some bugs, but if you were ever curious, it exists.

Brief change-of-topic: apparently Marble Zone's music was hiding in Sonic [1] for the Master System's soundtrack this entire time, and we've only just noticed it.

The guy who found it's checked; there aren't any other hidden songs, although there appears to be evidence that some other songs were hastily overwritten.

Wow. That's actually really good. It sounds better like that, really, and I'm surprised it's faster.

I don't think it necessarily indicates that Sonic 1 8-bit was supposed to be a downport, but maybe it was supposed to share more stages in common with the 16-bit version along with GHZ, LZ and SBZ. It's certainly plausible the Marble Zone was to be included going by the general pace of Sonic 1 16-bit. Maybe Marble Zone was supposed to be another slower stage between two faster-paced stages. Edit: Or maybe it's because they might've been afraid of this guy finding out that his cues might have been taken for a Sonic game.


Off-thread topic:

Similarly, I've lost count of how many "GAMING/OFF-TOPIC SIDE, AMIRITE FELLAS" post I've read in community threads over the years. It really does seem like two different worlds that happen to share servers sometimes and occasionally intermingle.

This is why I've clamped down on this sort of thing in this thread recently. It doesn't add anything, and it's irrelevant to discussion in this thread because things are generally crossposted.

But I also agree with ShockingAlberto, in that this culture should come from the posters (and mods are posters too). That's something I've indirectly been realizing with the whole PS4 Playroom fiasco; we need to hold ourselves to higher standards, and we need to encourage each other to have high standards for ourselves, because yelling and scolding only go so far.

This is why I'd subtly encouraged you guys to make more posts beyond list posts (of course, we've had the few times where I've outright said, "can you elaborate on that?" or "stop merely posting a list and explain why you chose those things"). A lot of you may not have noticed it, but throughout the two years that the community threads have existed, a lot of you have refined your posting styles a little bit little-by-little. Many people here have just gotten better at posting and with their prose in general, and that impresses me a lot. I'm pretty happy that a lot of you took the initiative to change it up a little bit when the time called for it, whether we're talking about music, level design, games, etc. Those times when we were talking about Sonic sprites or level design/aesthetic for various games were good because you wanted to discuss it instead of drive-by post with a small point to add.

That's why I said a few pages back to Shadow Hog that he should think of posting his post in the Essential RPG thread this year because it was actually good. When you guys were writing your GotY/SotY posts last year and were pretty proud of what you accomplished, I was pretty happy to see that. It's probably the teacher in me, but I like seeing people take the initiative like that and learn from others to contribute to their posting style to modify it.

But at the same time, you have to feel encouraged to change your posting style and put more effort into cultivating a discussion. Some people just... don't, and they continuously go with output that isn't necessarily in-depth, or consists of drive-by posts because they either don't really care, they don't have time, or they don't have the patience for it. And that, in turn, doesn't make the forum feel as unified as it did four to six years ago. You have a lot of people coming in from different corners with different posting styles and different reasons for posting on the site. Some people like coming to GAF for the laughs and the gifs. Some people like coming to GAF for the discussion (game-specific). Some people like coming to GAF for sales talk. And some people like coming to GAF as it's a news aggregate for them.

And that seems to be the guise that the Gaming Forum truly seems to have taken: a news aggregate. As I said before, I felt like putting OTs in the Community Forum after a month contributed to this somewhat. But a lot the focus obviously shifted with the advent of new consoles and company politics, and thus a snarky atmosphere where a lot of the focus seems to be on memetic culture as opposed to promoting any sense of in-depth discussion. It seems like a fairly large chunk of active members on the Gaming Side would prefer to throw in their two cents and leave as opposed to sticking around and learning from other members via discussion. If no one is willing to discuss with someone who would like to discuss something, then the desire for good discourse begins to disintegrate more and more.

I do have to wonder if the people who would like to cultivate discussion with depth might be in the minority as opposed to the majority. As Alberto said, the change does have to come from within--the users. There's only so much you can do to encourage people to post with more rationality and insight, but it's ultimately up to them to decide to do that. It only just happened in here because it's a smaller concentrated area with users who are more familiar with each other, and users who aren't very quick to judge.

It wouldn't hurt to try, but ultimately it falls upon the users--and there's a lot of users to convince now than there was several years ago--to engage in discussion as opposed to being dismissive of any sort of positive or negative discourse in various threads. Especially at this juncture.

 

[Shouta]

That's actually a good point I forgot, the new console gen. I recall this happening back during the last two era launches too where the focus was on the system wars. But I seem to remember it falling off eventually and the discussion being mostly about the games. It may just be a cycle until the consoles have stabilized and games are coming out regularly.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

That's actually a good point I forgot, the new console gen. I recall this happening back during the last two era launches too where the focus was on the system wars. But I seem to remember it falling off eventually and the discussion being mostly about the games. It may just be a cycle until the consoles have stabilized and games are coming out regularly.

It might be short-term and cyclical, sure. But it has been pretty bad for at least two years (and I am not the only one who thinks so), so I would be surprised if it fades away quickly.

That's actually one of the reasons I am baffled by what appears to be a sudden desire from people to stem or reverse the tide here. It's like the fire department coming to my burned down house the next day with a hose and an axe. No offense, guys, but if we were noticing problems in 2010, why couldn't you?

 

[CrimsonCrescendo]

I have to agree with Schala and Anihawk. I’ll post in OTs and the gaming forum once in a while, but things are either lost too easily or are just so vitriolic any more (I swear to god, If I read one more post about this stupid goddamn console war&#8230 that I tend to stick to the community forums more often than not. Now, granted, I haven’t spent anywhere near as much time as the others as I’ve only been posting the past 6 months and life has made it so where I’m having to be selective about the games I play, thus limiting my discussion, but my observation is that I honestly want little to do in the way of Gaming Side.

For example: Final Fantasy threads over the past 6 months. I’ve gotten to the point where I just actively avoid them if at all possible. Looking back at my post history, I admit I got swept up in all the negativity. And that’s why I avoid them whenever possible. And I know it isn’t as simple as “Monkey see, Monkey do”, but when you are on you 10th thread of “lol, Lightning sucks” or posting yet another weird fanfiction about how much Toriyama loves Lightning, it’s hard not to get negative. Hell, XIII and Lightning don’t even need to be mentioned and over half the posts will be negative posts about them. And it’s not a constructive “negativity” either. It’s either ad hominems against Toriyama or Kitase; drive by posts; or just plain hyperbole that makes you sick. And if it’s not that, it’s the same old “FF is dead since [insert number here]”, “Square Enix is dead/a joke/laughing stock”, etc. So when I’m reading my 500th negative post, reading yet another personal insult, and going on yet another thread of all of this… I literally lose the will to post anything, and if I do, it ends up being cynical and/or more negative than I intend.

But I don’t know if there is a fix for this. The entire posting community on the gaming side is like this. It’s the same for Devil May Cry. It’s the same for a lot of things. And again, it’s not so simple. Devil May Cry’s community tore itself to shreds after the last few years because of DmC; Final Fantasy hasn’t been in favor for almost a decade; etc. So it’s not GAFs fault. But it’s what happened.

And this is where Stump and Aenea are right: We are all fleeing the Gaming Side and are congregating here. But honestly, if I can’t come here for discussion (I honestly prefer smaller groups to larger ones for various reasons anyway), I’ll just stop posting as often. I don’t like saying that, but it’s the truth. You can’t post in a Capcom or Square thread without it turning into a pissing fest. You can’t go into something about an IoS announcement without 90% of the posts treating the news like the foreshadowing to the gosh darn apocalypse. And I’m sorry, but I don’t want to have those kinds of discussions.

So Stump and Aenea are completely right about at least me: I’ve fled the Gaming discussion in favor for the Community side. I just wish I had an answer for them about what would make me and others return.

And this isn’t a reflection on the mods. There are less than 30 of them and over 120,000 of us. They do a damn good job considering. And you know, I know damn well I’m not the best poster around. I tend to let myself get caught up in the negativity and haven’t been make as in depth posts as I want to (something I intend on changing). I’m not gonna call myself a good poster or anything, this is just the perspective of someone relatively new around here.

 

[Anth0ny]

I loved the Game Gear Sonics. That unused Marble Zone music sounds fantastic.


As for the topic at hand... it's tough. The Sonic community on GAF is chill, intelligent, and not gigantic. I recognize pretty much everyone who posts in here. So sometimes I post my impressions in this thread rather than the OT for a particular game because I care more what the people in this thread think, rather than GAF as a whole. If that makes any sense >_>

Honestly, I try to cross post too, but as some have mentioned already, posts tend to get lost in some of the more active threads on Gaming side. Not so in this thread, or community in general.

 

[Rikkun]

I have to agree with Schala and Anihawk. I’ll post in OTs and the gaming forum once in a while, but things are either lost too easily or are just so vitriolic any more (I swear to god, If I read one more post about this stupid goddamn console war…) that I tend to stick to the community forums more often than not. Now, granted, I haven’t spent anywhere near as much time as the others as I’ve only been posting the past 6 months and life has made it so where I’m having to be selective about the games I play, thus limiting my discussion, but my observation is that I honestly want little to do in the way of Gaming Side.

For example: Final Fantasy threads over the past 6 months. I’ve gotten to the point where I just actively avoid them if at all possible. Looking back at my post history, I admit I got swept up in all the negativity. And that’s why I avoid them whenever possible. And I know it isn’t as simple as “Monkey see, Monkey do”, but when you are on you 10th thread of “lol, Lightning sucks” or posting yet another weird fanfiction about how much Toriyama loves Lightning, it’s hard not to get negative. Hell, XIII and Lightning don’t even need to be mentioned and over half the posts will be negative posts about them. And it’s not a constructive “negativity” either. It’s either ad hominems against Toriyama or Kitase; drive by posts; or just plain hyperbole that makes you sick. And if it’s not that, it’s the same old “FF is dead since [insert number here]”, “Square Enix is dead/a joke/laughing stock”, etc. So when I’m reading my 500th negative post, reading yet another personal insult, and going on yet another thread of all of this… I literally lose the will to post anything, and if I do, it ends up being cynical and/or more negative than I intend.

But I don’t know if there is a fix for this. The entire posting community on the gaming side is like this. It’s the same for Devil May Cry. It’s the same for a lot of things. And again, it’s not so simple. Devil May Cry’s community tore itself to shreds after the last few years because of DmC; Final Fantasy hasn’t been in favor for almost a decade; etc. So it’s not GAFs fault. But it’s what happened.

And this is where Stump and Aenea are right: We are all fleeing the Gaming Side and are congregating here. But honestly, if I can’t come here for discussion (I honestly prefer smaller groups to larger ones for various reasons anyway), I’ll just stop posting as often. I don’t like saying that, but it’s the truth. You can’t post in a Capcom or Square thread without it turning into a pissing fest. You can’t go into something about an IoS announcement without 90% of the posts treating the news like the foreshadowing to the gosh darn apocalypse. And I’m sorry, but I don’t want to have those kinds of discussions.

So Stump and Aenea are completely right about at least me: I’ve fled the Gaming discussion in favor for the Community side. I just wish I had an answer for them about what would make me and others return.

And this isn’t a reflection on the mods. There are less than 30 of them and over 120,000 of us. They do a damn good job considering. And you know, I know damn well I’m not the best poster around. I tend to let myself get caught up in the negativity and haven’t been make as in depth posts as I want to (something I intend on changing). I’m not gonna call myself a good poster or anything, this is just the perspective of someone relatively new around here.

"Sonic has been dead since Sonic 3"

I usually don't even read threads about Sonic in the Gaming Discussions because it always ends like this.
Mario too, it took a perfect score to let some people say that yeah, maybe Mario is good after all, and not only "lol milking the cow old assets party games". It still takes away all the joy of discussion when 95 posts out of 100 are just people laughing, just because.

 

[Shouta]

It might be short-term and cyclical, sure. But it has been pretty bad for at least two years (and I am not the only one who thinks so), so I would be surprised if it fades away quickly.

That's actually one of the reasons I am baffled by what appears to be a sudden desire from people to stem or reverse the tide here. It's like the fire department coming to my burned down house the next day with a hose and an axe. No offense, guys, but if we were noticing problems in 2010, why couldn't you?

Because we are a fire department? We red names and all. =P

The vitriol and not wanting discussion to be carried off into the corner are related but not the same issue. Even if the vitriol was gone, we'd still want discussion to be taken to the main forum.

To more directly connect it with this thread, we'd like the in-depth, non-Sonic discussion to be taken to the appropriate place in the main forum or the community thread if it's there. It's not about making the thread only about the topic 100% of the time but about A) making sure a thread doesn't turn into a free for all and B) to guide good discussion to the best places for it to grow. There's nothing wrong with focusing your time in community but it's not a free pass to discuss whatever in unrelated threads. 5 pages of JRPG talk in a Political thread makes no sense, right? Go off on a tangent for a few posts because of a thought relating to the topic? Sure.

No offense taken but you shouldn't take my comment as "We don't know what's going on or were not aware of it" but more as "Oh hey, I just remembered we had this issue many times. Sorry, I work a crazy job and come to this forum to help moderate it as well. So It slipped my mind, teehee"

For example: Final Fantasy threads over the past 6 months. I’ve gotten to the point where I just actively avoid them if at all possible. Looking back at my post history, I admit I got swept up in all the negativity. And that’s why I avoid them whenever possible. And I know it isn’t as simple as “Monkey see, Monkey do”, but when you are on you 10th thread of “lol, Lightning sucks” or posting yet another weird fanfiction about how much Toriyama loves Lightning, it’s hard not to get negative. Hell, XIII and Lightning don’t even need to be mentioned and over half the posts will be negative posts about them. And it’s not a constructive “negativity” either. It’s either ad hominems against Toriyama or Kitase; drive by posts; or just plain hyperbole that makes you sick. And if it’s not that, it’s the same old “FF is dead since [insert number here]”, “Square Enix is dead/a joke/laughing stock”, etc. So when I’m reading my 500th negative post, reading yet another personal insult, and going on yet another thread of all of this… I literally lose the will to post anything, and if I do, it ends up being cynical and/or more negative than I intend.

So do you disagree with the negativity towards Lightning? If you don't, then why does the negativity bother you? If you actually like her, why not address complaints a little bit at a time? If you're getting personally insulted for stating your opinion, then why not report it to an active mod? No need to get swept away by it.

For reference, XIV has had incredibly substantial discussion. So it's not all FF getting negativity. Just uh, Lightning and FF13.

And this is where Stump and Aenea are right: We are all fleeing the Gaming Side and are congregating here. But honestly, if I can’t come here for discussion (I honestly prefer smaller groups to larger ones for various reasons anyway), I’ll just stop posting as often. I don’t like saying that, but it’s the truth. You can’t post in a Capcom or Square thread without it turning into a pissing fest. You can’t go into something about an IoS announcement without 90% of the posts treating the news like the foreshadowing to the gosh darn apocalypse. And I’m sorry, but I don’t want to have those kinds of discussions.

As I said above, no one is squelching discussion in general. It just needs to stay on topic.. If there's substantial talk on another topic, then that should be taken to the appropriate location in Gaming or other Community threads.

 

[PKrockin]

The Square Enix stuff has kind of been bothering me lately too. Don't get me wrong, not being a fan of theirs I do enjoy hearing the tortured screams over some game going mobile or Toriyama talking about Lightning again, but it seems to have really consumed the discussion.

On the bright side I feel like the Sonic threads have improved a lot.

 

[Shadow Hog]

Really off-topic but this warrants posting:

Room Break, the game slowbeef featured in his latest stream, is... well, look at it.

(I know this probably isn't helping the "staying on-topic" cause, though.)

"Sonic has been dead since Sonic 3"

I usually don't even read threads about Sonic in the Gaming Discussions because it always ends like this.
Mario too, it took a perfect score to let some people say that yeah, maybe Mario is good after all, and not only "lol milking the cow old assets party games". It still takes away all the joy of discussion when 95 posts out of 100 are just people laughing, just because.

I frequently see people who chime in that the old games were never good and that we were all fooling ourselves because we were young and foolish ("That's why you're still kids! Because you're stupid!").

I really can't see the merit in that. Yeah, the Sonic games are simplistic to a fault - you frequently enter a state where standard enemies can't hurt you, either through rolling (which requires mastering some pinball physics to get the most mileage out of) or jumping (much more frequent), unless they have spikes on them somewhere. You can get away from almost anything if you have only one ring on hand, and you'll usually have tens to hundreds. Bosses can be killed in a matter of seconds if you can get into a position where you can just wail on them, some being rendered completely unable to counterattack.

And yet, in spite of all that, Sonic [1], while janky, is a very solid game that puts up a solid challenge in spots. Sonic 2 tightened up various things that needed it and remains the favorite of the gaming public at large. Sonic 3&K tightened things up even more, varied up the shields in a rather inventive manner, had larger stages, multiple paths depending on what character you were playing as, in-game cutscenes that somehow tell a story of deceit and betrayal without uttering a single word (not that it's a great story by any stretch of the imagination, but it's told very well considering). Sonic CD, for all the misgivings it has with its seemingly-random level design, experimented the hell out of the first game's formula, and I'm pretty solidly in the camp that it did more right than it did wrong (especially when it comes to boss design).

What, exactly, is it that these people (if relatively few in number) have against the series to say it was never good?

The people who say the series hasn't been good since Sonic 3&K, on the other hand? I can empathize. I won't agree - I genuinely like Sonic 3D Blast/Flickies' Island (particularly the versions that got Richard Jacques's soundtrack), Sonic R, and the two Adventure games (I draw the line at Shuffle and Heroes, though), warts and all - but Sega's since done things so differently merely for the sake of doing things differently that I can't blame people for being put off by it. The fact the most recent time they tried to go back to what everyone (the group I ranted about above aside) agreed worked backfiring spectacularly (ie: Sonic 4: Episode 1) isn't helping matters.

 

[tiggerkiddo]

Community is such a haven from the madness of gaming side. Hopefully the forum will improve when the system wars die down.

 

[Dark Schala]

So do you disagree with the negativity towards Lightning? If you don't, then why does the negativity bother you? .

That isn't the point he's trying to make.

The point that every single thread is about her or the XIII subseries, despite the fact that the thread isn't even about FF13 in the first place. This isn't even addressing the negative posts, but also the positive, ardent defender posts/perverted posts in those threads. Why would you want to talk in these threads when the same garbage happens in every single thread to the point where some people are essentially either copy/pasting the stuff they'd previously written because the topic has been covered ad nauseam, or the same discussion repeats from a previous thread?

Fighting against a sea of stupidity is something that some people don't necessarily want to deal with constantly. I, myself, have had enough of trying to redirect those threads towards positive discussion as opposed to constantly turning into a pissing contest, but it seems absolutely positively unavoidable. Trying to deflect this sort of discussion to the FF community thread doesn't seem to work, and hasn't seemed to work in the last year of moderators trying to do it or splitting the thread to put the conversation in there.

And that is why a lot of the people who used to post in FF threads don't post as much anymore or they've left the board entirely. They're completely sick and tired of posting in those threads despite the fact that there tends to be mod presence in those threads often.

5 pages of JRPG talk in a Political thread makes no sense, right? Go off on a tangent for a few posts because of a thought relating to the topic? Sure.

The latter tends to happen more often than the former in this thread, really. It's just that, and as you've probably discerned from discussion in the past few pages here, people are incredibly verbose and like to discuss matters further for a few more posts and then discussion about that topic dies down until we're on-topic again.

 

[OMG Aero]

If it's an insult, literally just send a PM that says "insults" and then the URL of the post. If it's a tldr, literally just send a PM that says "tldr" and then the URL of the post. You can, I believe, send to three recipients at once, so send to three mods at once. That's the fastest way to triage stuff to us.

brb reporting all of schala's posts

Why is it exactly that nobody ever talks about Master System Sonic anymore? I've only ever seen it mentioned by you guys and when it was on Awesome Games Done Quick one year. Is it because the Master System didn't sell well in the US?

Probably because those games aren't really that good. The only positive things I can think of to say about the whole Master System series is that the bridge music and that jet boot power up were pretty cool.

 

[qq more]

I thought Sonic 1 and Triple Trouble were really good SMS/GG Sonic titles. Sonic 2 GG was awful due to poor resolution in boss fights but the SMS version is probably alright due to bigger resolution, so I'll check that out sometime. Chaos is alright, just too short (30 second levels lol)

Blast... erghh everything about it is just a huge step down and then there's that evil pipe maze from Blue Marine Zone... Never forget



EDIT: On the subject of FF threads, one thing I want to also address is the other side of the threads. There has been posters from the other side (that loves FFXIII/Lightning) that gets overly defensive over any kind of criticism in the relevant threads. It has gotten to the point they're starting name calling and assuming everything about them (for one example, a poster called everyone hypocrites for disliking the ending of LR and then assumed they all played and praised Xenoblade's ending). It's rather tiring seeing people getting overly defensive over criticism, this just doesn't happen in FF threads, I've noticed this happening in Nintendo threads too.

This was probably already addressed, I just kind of want to chime in.

 

[Dark Schala]

After a little more thought on it. I don't think this is a problem that can be easily fixed. At all.

The forum is too large. There's more and more noise on this forum, and it constantly drowns out any semblance of discussion or attempts to begin discussion on this site at large. An attempt to diminish discussion--despite it being off-topic in community threads--is not going to do anyone any favours because it will inevitably make people leave because they aren't getting the thread direction they want. Not getting it on gaming side? Can't post it in a community thread for apt discussion to take place? Why even bother posting on this site in the first place, then?

And Sciz is right. A lot of the off-topic discussion, despite it being games/game design discussion, fuels our point to discuss Sonic-related things in there and makes us pay attention to stuff going on in the fandom, fangames, and other aspects of the series. It's not like we get Sonic-related stuff every day or every month outside of the comics, so to prevent this thread from dropping like a rock, of course we'll talk about other things while retreading old ground with respect to the series.

Either way, I will fully admit that I have contemplated taking Alberto's approach to merely discussing things on Twitter and IRC because I legitimately can't take the mentality/atmosphere on this forum sometimes. It drives me crazy and it puts me in a mood that I would otherwise not have. I don't have time to deal with that sometimes because I have other things to deal with in my personal life that adds to the stress I already have.

Try as you might, but I firmly doubt that anything can be done to ultimately fix this forum quickly. It could be fixed, but not as quickly as some people would like.

No offense, guys, but if we were noticing problems in 2010, why couldn't you?

As an extension to that, and I'm sorry if I sound a little more ticked off than I normally do, but this is not a problem that's going to magically disappear after a few months of stability. The Wii U garbage is still around after the system's been out for a year and seems to have gotten a little worse despite the system actually getting games now.

These problems started becoming apparent in even 2010. The board started feeling toxic around 2011. It was incredibly obvious in 2012. And in 2013, it's become exacerbated by frequent member registration, and console wars.

This is not a problem that you can easily remedy by merely telling people to try to post in other areas of the forum where they are more than likely going to get ignored. Alas, look at those Tearaway impressions I crossposted to its OT, and look at how the thread progressed with one person who wanted to talk about the design of the game but the rest of the thread discussing one or two pictures.

 

[Professor Beef]

...the fuck did I just come home to?

I think the thing about this thread that the mods may or may not have come to realize is that the thread was created as a sort of safe haven from Gaming-side regarding their toxic opinions on Sonic as a whole. Before the whole shift to Community, it was pretty much only new topics where we could get together and discuss the games. And those threads were often rare because for every one of those threads, there were a whole lot more "HEY CHECK OUT HOW DUMB THIS SONIC GAME IS, BOY THE SERIES SURE IS SHIT RIGHT GUYS" threads floating around. It was one of the main reasons why all of us wanted to have a Sonic OT to begin with; not so much to have an echo chamber of "yeah sonic rules aw yeah", but to legitimately discuss the series and all the media that surrounds him. It gets tiresome - EXTREMELY tiresome - trying to have a good discussion in other threads in Gaming side because it often seems like nobody actually wants to discuss the topic or expand their minds, and would rather just shit on it. Even with the option to report those posts (and I have in the past), it rarely changes anything. It's a gigantic pain in the ass to go to a Sonic thread in Gaming side and see a bunch of people (often the same people) going "lol sonic was never good" or making some form of veiled furry insult.

It's easier to discuss things in here because most of us are all tired of the same shit, so we all know how to make intelligent posts in order to capture each other's attention and not insult each other's intelligence. I'm not trying to sound too bitter here, and I'm fully aware of how difficult it is to moderate a site even a tenth the size of GAF due to experience. But...I think that the "problem" of having good posts and posters squirreled away in Community, much like Schala and the others have said, isn't something that you can solve so easily. I have more Community threads in my Subscriptions than I do regular threads about certain games. And the reason for that is because in those threads, you're surrounded by people who actually give a shit about the topic at hand. Sometimes we'll talk about off-topic subjects, but sometimes that's expected when there's no news at hand.

As far as keeping things on-topic, I think it's safe to say that we all understand the moderation team's wishes and will make an honest attempt to do so. Sciz, one of the MVPs of the thread (and I truly mean that, even if I don't say it ever) already gives us talking points every day with the Song of the Day. All I'm saying is that it's hard to give a shit in other threads when it's been made ever-so-clear that so many others don't.

 

[Tizoc]

Waiting for a sale on EU 3DS on the Sonic games, I'm still gonna get Sonic 1 3DS when it's out though.

EDIT: I loled whenever GAF crashed during the Persona announcements.

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

I'm a bit late to the discussion (and admittedly at some point I just started skimming posts, so maybe I am missing the point), but coming at it from the perspective of somebody who is employed (technically professionally!) by a site that primarily focuses on Sega and Sonic news, I see it like this:

Sonic the Hedgehog is but one franchise. One way or another, there are going to be lulls in information. I get this a lot when I post reviews of non-Sonic games on TSSZ; people are always giving me the, "Aren't you a Sonic site? Why are you posting reviews for Ducktales Remastered and GTA5?" line.

Because we only get one Sonic game every two years. At best, we have a Sonic "thing" once every year (off years are usually for spinoffs and port collections).

But what about the other 46 weeks in the year? There will always be a place here to talk about Sonic the Hedgehog; and Sonic discussion will undoubtedly always come first. But when there's no Sonic to talk about, why should the thread shrivel up and die? We obviously enjoy each other's company. We're united by similar tastes. That's at the heart of the term "community".

There's great discussion happening everywhere on the internet; a thousand million websites you never want to venture in to because their subject matter is not to your taste. But maybe somebody there is talking about something you're interested in, and you're going to miss it. That's just how it goes.

Even if there was a general "thread for platformers", I would expect the community here would still get the discussion it does (more than once I've seen Schala link and reference posts she's made in other threads in here, so I'd assume that trend would continue regardless). Unless, of course, that general thread meant the closure of this one, which does not entirely sit well with me (because the Sonic franchise extends far beyond simply platformers at this point).

 

[Supaidaman]

Brief change-of-topic: apparently Marble Zone's music was hiding in Sonic [1] for the Master System's soundtrack this entire time, and we've only just noticed it.

The guy who found it's checked; there aren't any other hidden songs, although there appears to be evidence that some other songs were hastily overwritten.

Kinda late on this, but, WOW. It sounds awesome! I don't like Marble Zone on the MD version but this music kind makes me wish to see the stage on the 8-bit game.

About the board itself, I don't really have an opinion. I'm new here and for me, things have always been like they are :/

 

[Sciz]

Sciz, one of the MVPs of the thread (and I truly mean that, even if I don't say it ever)

Well gosh.



SonicGAF's Song of the Day - #60

Song: Emerald Hill Zone
Game: Sonic the Hedgehog 2
Composer: Masato Nakamura

It's Sonic Twos-uh, Sunday. That pun doesn't work most years. Nevertheless, Sonic 2 is 21 today by any metric that ignores Japan, and I'm going to side with the cheat code on this one.

EHZ is probably in the series' top five most recognizable themes by virtue of being from stage 1 in its most popular game, yet it doesn't get nearly the recognition that GHZ does. There's nothing wrong with it - it's catchy, well arranged, trades off instruments pleasantly - yet it can't escape the shadow of its older counterpart any more than the zone itself can. Is the brass too abrasive? The bass too intrusive? The pacing too flat? Whatever the case, it simply can't compete.

 

[qq more]

In speaking of Sonic 2, I'm dyin' to get the new rerelease!

 

[Tizoc]

I AM HUMMING EMERALD HILL ZONE THEME!

In speaking of Sonic 2, I'm dyin' to get the new rerelease!

That reminds, does the NVidia Shield run iOS games?

*Continues to hum EH Zone theme*

 

[qq more]

I AM HUMMING EMERALD HILL ZONE THEME!



That reminds, does the NVidia Shield run iOS games?

*Continues to hum EH Zone theme*

It runs entirely on Android OS, so no iOS. The Taxman Sonic games runs PERFECTLY on the Shield. Like... flawless, wow.

 

[Razzer]

Well gosh.



SonicGAF's Song of the Day - #60

Song: Emerald Hill Zone
Game: Sonic the Hedgehog 2
Composer: Masato Nakamura

It's Sonic Twos-uh, Sunday. That pun doesn't work most years. Nevertheless, Sonic 2 is 21 today by any metric that ignores Japan, and I'm going to side with the cheat code on this one.

EHZ is probably in the series' top five most recognizable themes by virtue of being from stage 1 in its most popular game, yet it doesn't get nearly the recognition that GHZ does. There's nothing wrong with it - it's catchy, well arranged, trades off instruments pleasantly - yet it can't escape the shadow of its older counterpart any more than the zone itself can. Is the brass too abrasive? The bass too intrusive? The pacing too flat? Whatever the case, it simply can't compete.

That's what you think, I believe that Emerald is better than Green, so screw the masses (what a hipster). And no that obviously has nothing to do with the fact that I got Sonic 2 first as a child, nothing whatsoever, stop looking at me like that, hmph. It pretty much does the same as it's counterpart, but more vibrant and energetic in my opinion, fitting the fact that Emerald Hill is more colourful and saturated than the actually rather brown Green Hill. Oh well I guess.

 

[Quackula]

For some reason I want to say that Emerald Hill was supposed to originally have lyrics and vocals or something?

I seem to seriously recall hearing something to that effect. Not sure why... anyone have any clue there?

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

Schala how could you help the bad guys

 

[qq more]

Emerald Hill Zone Backwards is like a whole new song and it's amazing.

Schala how could you help the bad guys

Schala, how could you?!

 

[Meccanical]

Team dark iz da best mane.

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

She kicked Sonic's ass!