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[CrustyBritches]

It's kinda worrisome that they aren't allowed to speak on the battery. It doesn't instill confidence regarding how much juice this thing actually has.

Asus said it will have "around the same battery life at 15W as Steam Deck". At 30W, you're probably looking at roughly 1hr..

yes I’m aware that’s what the leak from that twitter user Snoopy Tech claims which then the Verge and others have since reported on but why are people acting like that’s confirmed and not just a rumor? what kind of history does this Snoopy Tech have for previous leaks being correct?

Allegedly somebody captured a screenshot of the listing on BestBuy that accidently went live. Still not technically official since it would be easy to photoshop.

---
$700 is a good price for this hardware. Before we knew about the Z1 lesser SKU, I was thinking the Z1 extreme would come in around $800-1000 depending on the storage option(i.e.-256GB or 1TB). This means the roughly Steam Deck level Z1(but with better CPU) should roll in at $500.

This is $100 less than the AOKZOE A1 Pro that will come with a similar chip, the 7840U. The advantage the Ally has over the Chinese competitors is that not only is it more affordable, but it's available via BestBuy from a reputable hardware company like Asus. This is means reliable warranty and support.

 

[Zathalus]

I like how most media think this 8.6 TF makes it close to PS5/XSX.

The TF counts for those machines is based on FP32 workloads. This is, without a doubt, FP16.

I'm pretty sure it's FP32, but using the RDNA3 metric of using dual issue capability. In comparison to RDNA2 you can basically half it and add 10% (roughly). So more or less equal to a Radeon 6400.

 

[rofif]

I don’t think this is right direction for handhelds.

 

[Zathalus]

I don’t think this is right direction for handhelds.

What's the problem? Battery life? If so, you can drop TDP (at the cost of performance of course) and get 3-4 hours.

 

[ToTTenTranz]

I like how most media think this 8.6 TF makes it close to PS5/XSX.

It should actually be pretty comparable to do at 1080p what the other consoles do at 4K.
Similar CPU (if not substantially better at single threading), 1/4th the real FP32 ALU throughput, 1/2 pixel fillrate, 1/4th the memory bandwidth, and same amount of unified memory.

At least on rasterization we're looking at something that should actually do the 2020 consoles' work at a quarter of the resolution. That's a whole lot more than what the Steam Deck could ever do.

 

[jshackles]

What's the problem? Battery life? If so, you can drop TDP (at the cost of performance of course) and get 3-4 hours.

You could also drop $150 on something like this that should extend the battery life an extra 5+ hours. It just wouldn't be as portable.

Amazon.com: Portable Power Station 350W, Portable AC Outlet Power Bank 80000mAh/296Wh External Lithium Battery Portable Laptop Charger, Wireless Charging, Pure Sine Wave Power Source for Outdoor Tent Camping : Cell Phones & Accessories

Amazon.com: Portable Power Station 350W, Portable AC Outlet Power Bank 80000mAh/296Wh External Lithium Battery Portable Laptop Charger, Wireless Charging, Pure Sine Wave Power Source for Outdoor Tent Camping : Cell Phones & Accessories

www.amazon.com

 

[StereoVsn]

Asus said it will have "around the same battery life at 15W as Steam Deck". At 30W, you're probably looking at roughly 1hr..

Allegedly somebody captured a screenshot of the listing on BestBuy that accidently went live. Still not technically official since it would be easy to photoshop.


---
$700 is a good price for this hardware. Before we knew about the Z1 lesser SKU, I was thinking the Z1 extreme would come in around $800-1000 depending on the storage option(i.e.-256GB or 1TB). This means the roughly Steam Deck level Z1(but with better CPU) should roll in at $500.

This is $100 less than the AOKZOE A1 Pro that will come with a similar chip, the 7840U. The advantage the Ally has over the Chinese competitors is that not only is it more affordable, but it's available via BestBuy from a reputable hardware company like Asus. This is means reliable warranty and support.

The issue is at 15w, we would get only a slight uplift from the deck. Say 20ish % (hopefully), which would be decent but not spectacular.

That said, yeah, really biggest advantage for folks in NA/Europe is that this will be carried by reputable shops, have decent warranty (Asus RMA is a bit meh, but still) and it's coming in at a reasonable price for good specs.

 

[rnlval]

Just remembering
RDNA3 tf ≠ RDNA2 tf

They are equal except half of RDNA 3's stream processors weren't scaled with texture unit increase and missing wave64 GCN instruction set compatibility.

3D games use texture units along with stream processors.

 

[rnlval]

The iGPU will never behave anywhere close to a 8TF desktop RDNA2.

First, because that GPU is starving on memory bandwidth with only 120GB/s shared with no less than 8 CPU Zen4 cores.
Second, because those 8TFLOPs result from the new double-pumped RDNA3 ALUs whose functionality hasn't been enabled in the compiler.

As it is, it'll be lucky to perform like a RX 6400 (sans the 4GB VRAM limitation, as it'll probably be able to access up to 12GB or so). Which is still mighty fine for a low-settings 1080p / high settings 720p scenario.

120 GB/s system memory is better than spilling over PCIe 4.0 16 lanes' 32 GB/s.

 

[Ozriel]

What's the problem? Battery life? If so, you can drop TDP (at the cost of performance of course) and get 3-4 hours.

I’ll bet he’s talking about Windows.

And if so, bollocks.

 

[digdug2]

I don’t think this is right direction for handhelds.

Why is that? I feel that having more options as a consumer is always the right direction.

 

[CrustyBritches]

The issue is at 15w, we would get only a slight uplift from the deck. Say 20ish % (hopefully), which would be decent but not spectacular.

That said, yeah, really biggest advantage for folks in NA/Europe is that this will be carried by reputable shops, have decent warranty (Asus RMA is a bit meh, but still) and it's coming in at a reasonable price for good specs.

I believe the Deck and Ally both have a 40Whr battery, so Asus' comment about the similar battery life at 15W TDP would make sense in that regard. It's not the same chip, but comparing the GPD Win 4's 6800U SoC at 25W to 15W sees a decrease in performance from anywhere to 5-44% depending on the game. The Ally benchmarks were done at 30W, so depending on the behavior of the "Z1 Extreme", it could see similar results.

For pure handheld usage, I think there's a strong argument to make that 15W TDP is the current sweet spot for handheld PCs. There are circumstances where having more horsepower even at the cost of battery life is a good thing. One would be in so-called "docked" play(charging+TV-out). Another is in more recent "next-gen" games(PS5/XSX) that are borderline playable on Deck like TLOU1 and Returnal, that might run just fine on the Ally. In that case, maybe the drop in battery life is worth having a more playable experience.

I am looking forward to the inevitable comparison at max TDP and 15W that guys like The Phawx will do. Also looking forward to the Z1 being tested in the same manner. At 30W it looks pretty close, or even slightly better than the Deck depending on the game. We'll see where it lands in price. I'm guessing $500 at this point. I still think the Deck is a good value at $360-530 depending on if it's on sale. At the $585-650 512GB tier is where the Ally Z1 Extreme starts looking really good. At this point I'm not inclined to dump the Deck and upgrade to the Ally just for a few games. I'm hoping Valve releases a Deck 2 around holiday 2024.

At max TDP, 720p, Low Preset. Assuming they used the benchmarks and not some handpicked area...
RDR2:
Z1 = 41.8fps
Deck = 43.4fps(41.6fps@800p)
Z1 Extreme = 72.3fps

FH4:
Z1 = 119fps
Deck = 94fps(93fps@800p)
Z1 Extreme = 143fps

Shadow of the Tomb Raider:
Z1 = 62fps
Deck = 52fps(52fps@800p)
Z1 Extreme = 98.3fps

 

[Silver Wattle]

I think the people calling for lower power limit or lower res screen really miss the point of having the option to play at higher res or power limits.
You can always lower the res and the power limit to increase battery life.

There are many games that are not demanding that will see a large benefit from higher res or framerate.

 

[Tams]

I think the people calling for lower power limit or lower res screen really miss the point of having the option to play at higher res or power limits.
You can always lower the res and the power limit to increase battery life.

There are many games that are not demanding that will see a large benefit from higher res or framerate.

It mostly seems like cope from people who got a Steam Deck and are now having some buyer's remorse.

 

[Topher]

It mostly seems like cope from people who got a Stream Deck and are now having some buyer's remorse.

I don't see any of my fellow Steam Deck owners upset about this at all.

 

[ToTTenTranz]

I think the people calling for lower power limit or lower res screen really miss the point of having the option to play at higher res or power limits.
You can always lower the res and the power limit to increase battery life.

Exactly this.
Before we had decent upscalers one could argue that 720p rendered at a native 720p screen would look better than 720p on a 1080p panel because the scaling wouldn't be linear and we could get some additional aliasing.
But with today's upscaling techniques, higher pixel density is almost always a better thing.

The Ally even has RSR in its custom driver / UI settings like the Steam Deck. It means we can just set the game's resolution to 720p and then the FSR/RSR's upscaler + sharpening filter kicks off for a pretty decent 1080p presentation.
If a game has a temporal reconstruction like TAAU, TSR or FSR2 then it's even better.
I'll even risk arguing that, on a 7" screen, 1080p on FSR2 Performance (540p native) might look and perform better than rendering 720p native on a 720p screen. Just imagine how far this thing could fly with 540p native rendering.

I don't see any of my fellow Steam Deck owners upset about this at all.

Neither me or my other Deck-owning friends are upset about the Ally. In fact we all kind of just agree about the Deck's shortcomings (many of which the Ally solves) but still love the Deck as the best thing there is out there regardless. Some of us are probably going to upgrade and others are going to wait a bit for other offers.

What I did see are a bunch of Linux nutjobs over at r/linux_gaming and r/SteamDeck angry that a Windows handheld might prove a better option for gaming than SteamOS.

 

[NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt]

I was wondering if this would be compatible with a Steamdock? Or if it's portable only?

 

[Ozriel]

What I did see are a bunch of Linux nutjobs over at r/linux_gaming and r/SteamDeck angry that a Windows handheld might prove a better option for gaming than SteamOS.

This is precisely what I’m seeing. Mainly on Reddit, not really here, Topher

I can understand Linux_gaming, but I really dislike some of the Linux zealotry on the Steamdeck subreddit. It’s supposed to be a cool handheld gaming PC and not the next OS battleground.

 

[Ozriel]

I was wondering if this would be compatible with a Steamdock? Or if it's portable only?

It’ll work with any generic Anker/Chinese usb-c dock from Amazon

 

[NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt]

It’ll work with any generic Anker/Chinese usb-c dock from Amazon

That's good to hear

I'll get this one than

Since I want to play both portable and on the tv

 

[Topher]

This is precisely what I’m seeing. Mainly on Reddit, not really here, Topher

I can understand Linux_gaming, but I really dislike some of the Linux zealotry on the Steamdeck subreddit. It’s supposed to be a cool handheld gaming PC and not the next OS battleground.

Lots of Linux folks are bit fanatical, no doubt about it. I work with a few so....yeah. I do think it is great that Linux has become a viable platform for gaming, but I really hope the zealotry you talk about remains in the fringe. We don't need more warz in gaming.

 

[StereoVsn]

I still wish it had a USB4 or a combo USB4 port vs their proprietary one.

GPD, Aya Neo, and OneXPlayer all have at least 2 ports.

 

[ToTTenTranz]

I still wish it had a USB4 or a combo USB4 port vs their proprietary one.

GPD, Aya Neo, and OneXPlayer all have at least 2 ports.

I'm still hoping someone will make an OCULink adapter for the Ally, though.
Disable the iGPU and the 8-core Zen4 CPU should fly at 35W when docked with an eGPU.

With an OCUlink case I could just take off my main desktop's dGPU and bring it with me on car trip weekends/holidays.

 

[Tams]

I still wish it had a USB4 or a combo USB4 port vs their proprietary one.

GPD, Aya Neo, and OneXPlayer all have at least 2 ports.

I'm not entirely sure what's going on there. Physically it's an OCuLink connector (that GPD are speculated to be using in the Win Mini), which is not proprietry, but apparently ASUS did some fiddling about with it.

Though maybe the only proprietary thing about it is the combined USB C - OCuLink connector.

Let's be clear here, neither USB 4 nor Thunderbolt 3 are great for using eGPUs.

 

[Topher]

I'm not entirely sure what's going on there. Physically it's an OCuLink connector (that GPD are speculated to be using in the Win Mini), which is not proprietry, but apparently ASUS did some fiddling about with it.

Though maybe the only proprietary thing about it is the combined USB C - OCuLink connector.

Let's be clear here, neither USB 4 not Thunderbolt 3 are great for using eGPUs.

Yeah, I have a Flow z13 laptop which has that port and I read somewhere that the pin mapping isn't the same. Sucks something like that isn't standard because you are right about USB/thunderbolt. Way too much overhead. At the same time, the official Asus eGPUs are laptop GPUs so even then you are taking a hit in performance vs. desktop GPU and paying a premium for it.

 

[ToTTenTranz]

I'm not entirely sure what's going on there. Physically it's an OCuLink connector (that GPD are speculated to be using in the Win Mini), which is not proprietry, but apparently ASUS did some fiddling about with it.

Though maybe the only proprietary thing about it is the combined USB C - OCuLink connector.

Let's be clear here, neither USB 4 not Thunderbolt 3 are great for using eGPUs.

The people over at egpu.io seem to think the XG Mobile is actually just OCuLink with a couple of switched wires. To avoid full compliance.

The GPD Win4, on the other hand, will bring an actual OCuLink external connector to the handheld, which is very cool.

 

[rofif]

Why is that? I feel that having more options as a consumer is always the right direction.

Big, power hungry, hot, heavy. Nothing that is handheld friendly.
I've had a steam deck and it's tiring to play at home, let alone get around with it.
Stuff psp sized or even miyoo mini is more suitable. Switch is also flat and much lighter.
I've also noticed that the more detailed the game is, it kinda is harder to look at on the smaller screen

 

[Topher]

The people over at egpu.io seem to think the XG Mobile is actually just OCuLink with a couple of switched wires. To avoid full compliance.

The GPD Win4, on the other hand, will bring an actual OCuLink external connector to the handheld, which is very cool.

Are there any eGPU enclosures that use that though?

 

[Kenpachii]

As a deck owner, the more competition to push specs forwards the better. i will wait for the steam deck 2 with even better specs, 2x performance over current deck seems to be reachable i think next year.

 

[demigod]

For comparison’s sake, the Steam Deck can play Doom 3 BFG Edition for 5 hours at 1280x800, 60fps before running out of juice. Given the Ally's specs it's reasonable to assume that it could do 1080p / 60fps for at least the same amount of playtime, maybe longer (depending on a TON of different factors, like how much battery life this thing actually has in practice, how it is configured to perform when unplugged, etc...)

So - while it may be capable of 8TF (lol) and could probably play something like Elden Ring at 1080p/60fps, it may only be able to do so for about 30-40 minutes tops. Cutting the framerate in half to 30 would theoretically double that time (though in reality, not really) so you might be able to get an hour and a half, maybe two hours out of it? Steam Deck can play it for about 2 hours, but that's at 30fps and 800p.

Anyway, this is all very crystal ball at this point until we have confirmed specs and the hands on reviews out there now all say that the battery hardware they received isn't final and that they're not allowed to comment on it. Again lol.

What 5 hours? Are you playing it at 5% brightness or something? I can barely get 2 hours with monster hunter rise.

 

[Kenpachii]

no capping hardware, i use deck always with a connector its basically my away PC. I rather be able to play games then not play them. Unlocked these things have to be for maximum output, u want more battery life, cut the shit to 25% and have more battery life.

 

[Ozriel]

Big, power hungry, hot, heavy. Nothing that is handheld friendly.
I've had a steam deck and it's tiring to play at home, let alone get around with it.
Stuff psp sized or even miyoo mini is more suitable. Switch is also flat and much lighter.
I've also noticed that the more detailed the game is, it kinda is harder to look at on the smaller screen

Then why would you call the Ally a step in the wrong direction when it’s visibly smaller than the Deck, lighter, runs cool and has silent fans?

Sure, Valve and Asus can make stuff that’s PSP sized. But you’d end up with a significantly underpowered product. Or with an ARM chipset for streaming only.

 

[Ozriel]

What 5 hours? Are you playing it at 5% brightness or something? I can barely get 2 hours with monster hunter rise.

He’s talking about old ass Doom 3, not 2016 Doom. You can squeeze decent battery life from games that aren’t demanding.

 

[rofif]

Then why would you call the Ally a step in the wrong direction when it’s visibly smaller than the Deck, lighter, runs cool and has silent fans?

Sure, Valve and Asus can make stuff that’s PSP sized. But you’d end up with a significantly underpowered product. Or with an ARM chipset for streaming only.

That's bs though.
It's still very heavy at over 600 grams. Doesn't sound like much but your arms will be angry with you. But yes - lighter than deck
Cooler and silent? I don't believe so. Probably not if physics are real.
Smaller? Sure. Maybe

What I am trying to say - it is not about the power or rather should not be. Surely not about windows fuckery on the go

 

[64bitmodels]

Big, power hungry, hot, heavy. Nothing that is handheld friendly.
I've had a steam deck and it's tiring to play at home, let alone get around with it.
Stuff psp sized or even miyoo mini is more suitable. Switch is also flat and much lighter.
I've also noticed that the more detailed the game is, it kinda is harder to look at on the smaller screen

handhelds arent going in this drection, the switch is still outselling everything
x86 PC emulator handhelds just aren't for you. consider picking up a retroid or an ayn odin

 

[rofif]

handhelds arent going in this drection, the switch is still outselling everything
x86 PC emulator handhelds aren't for you. consider picking up a retroid or an ayn odin

You are right. Last thing I want on the go is heavy windows in my hands
Steam Deck at least got a good system

 

[Astray]

If reviews are good for this thing then expect it to get scalped to death.

 

[SABRE220]

It should actually be pretty comparable to do at 1080p what the other consoles do at 4K.
Similar CPU (if not substantially better at single threading), 1/4th the real FP32 ALU throughput, 1/2 pixel fillrate, 1/4th the memory bandwidth, and same amount of unified memory.

At least on rasterization we're looking at something that should actually do the 2020 consoles' work at a quarter of the resolution. That's a whole lot more than what the Steam Deck could ever do.

Not even close, the series S for example does what the other consoles do at 1080p. The rog ally runs far cry 6 for example at 720p upscaled to 1080via frs with low settings.

 

[ToTTenTranz]

Are there any eGPU enclosures that use that though?

There's the One Dock, over which you can build an enclosure.
Eventually there might be enclosures for sale, but for now it's a nearly-DIY market only.

My guess is in a couple of years we'll have x86 handhelds with either OCuLink everywhere or USB4v2, in case that assymetric 120Gbps mode proves decent enough for eGPUs.

Not even close, the series S for example does what the other consoles do at 1080p. The rog ally runs far cry 6 for example at 720p upscaled to 1080via frs with low settings.

The Series S suffers from both the lack of RAM (10GB vs 16GB) and memory contention issues.

 

[SABRE220]

There's the One Dock, over which you can build an enclosure.
Eventually there might be enclosures for sale, but for now it's a nearly-DIY market only.

My guess is in a couple of years we'll have x86 handhelds with either OCuLink everywhere or USB4v2, in case that assymetric 120Gbps mode proves decent enough for eGPUs.



The Series S suffers from both the lack of RAM (10GB vs 16GB) and memory contention issues.

and... the handheld is far more gimped in comparison the benchmarks are already there even in amds own slides its not close to the series s.
Its more comparable to the steamdeck than the consoles in output.

 

[64bitmodels]

You are right. Last thing I want on the go is heavy windows in my hands
Steam Deck at least got a good system

i understand the feeling and i think its one of the reasons why ive been holding off, even if the progression of the tech is amazing the size and battery of it is not....
AYN Loki is our only hope for us looking for a smaller more portable X86 handheld that doesn't seek to beat the deck in power or specs

 

[Tams]

USB4v2, in case that assymetric 120Gbps mode proves decent enough for eGPUs

USB 4 has the bandwidth (potentially twice that of OCuLink), but if it's anything like Thunderbolt, the overhead is still going to make it less than ideal compared to OCuLink.

 

[Filben]

I think the people calling for lower power limit or lower res screen really miss the point of having the option to play at higher res or power limits.
You can always lower the res and the power limit to increase battery life.

There are many games that are not demanding that will see a large benefit from higher res or framerate.

For me it's rather a price issue. I have to pay for features I'm not intending to use. However, I like the smaller form and quiter fan of the Ally.

Not saying the Ally isn't cool. It's adding more options which in itself is great. But I wish I had a portable PC with the Deck's power, but OLED screen, smaller form and being more quiet and still be sold at 420 EUR.

so far I'm happy in general with the Deck and I won't be needing more power nor battery because I only play small indie games on it which makes the battery last 5-7h.

 

[Tams]

Are there any eGPU enclosures that use that though?

Well, ASUS naturally have several more for their own implementation.

And GPD naturally are going to release one with their devices that will have OCuLink.

GPD roadmap includes 3 new mini-laptops & GPU dock (GPD P4 Max, Pocket 4, Win Mini and GPD G1 dock) - Liliputing

GPD roadmap includes 3 new mini-laptops & GPU dock (GPD P4 Max, Pocket 4, Win Mini and GPD G1 dock)

liliputing.com

Plus the DIY stuff.

 

[Ozriel]

That's bs though.
It's still very heavy at over 600 grams. Doesn't sound like much but your arms will be angry with you. But yes - lighter than deck
Cooler and silent? I don't believe so. Probably not if physics are real.
Smaller? Sure. Maybe

What I am trying to say - it is not about the power or rather should not be. Surely not about windows fuckery on the go

‘Maybe’? When there are numerous videos out there previewing the silent fans and comparing the size vs the Steam deck?

And it is all about the power. That’s what’s needed to run AAA PC games.

 

[Ozriel]

For me it's rather a price issue. I have to pay for features I'm not intending to use. However, I like the smaller form and quiter fan of the Ally.

Not saying the Ally isn't cool. It's adding more options which in itself is great. But I wish I had a portable PC with the Deck's power, but OLED screen, smaller form and being more quiet and still be sold at 420 EUR.

so far I'm happy in general with the Deck and I won't be needing more power nor battery because I only play small indie games on it which makes the battery last 5-7h.

Not sure why you’d say the Ally’s additional features are things you won’t use.

Small indie games are the perfect experience that’ll shine on a 1080p 120hz display.

 

[StereoVsn]

I'm not entirely sure what's going on there. Physically it's an OCuLink connector (that GPD are speculated to be using in the Win Mini), which is not proprietry, but apparently ASUS did some fiddling about with it.

Though maybe the only proprietary thing about it is the combined USB C - OCuLink connector.

Let's be clear here, neither USB 4 nor Thunderbolt 3 are great for using eGPUs.

I just want a 2nd USB-C connector without using a dock and some standard options.

Would I use eGpu with a handheld? Nah, got a decent PC for that. Would I use 2nd USB port while charging? Sure, easily, from a keyboard/mouse dongle to USB drive, etc.

 

[poppabk]

We need a name. I’d buy this for $999.

At a guess Sientra and they cost a lot more than $999.

 

[DenchDeckard]

The d pad is rank....

 

[rnlval]

Exactly this.
Before we had decent upscalers one could argue that 720p rendered at a native 720p screen would look better than 720p on a 1080p panel because the scaling wouldn't be linear and we could get some additional aliasing.
But with today's upscaling techniques, higher pixel density is almost always a better thing.

The Ally even has RSR in its custom driver / UI settings like the Steam Deck. It means we can just set the game's resolution to 720p and then the FSR/RSR's upscaler + sharpening filter kicks off for a pretty decent 1080p presentation.
If a game has a temporal reconstruction like TAAU, TSR or FSR2 then it's even better.
I'll even risk arguing that, on a 7" screen, 1080p on FSR2 Performance (540p native) might look and perform better than rendering 720p native on a 720p screen. Just imagine how far this thing could fly with 540p native rendering.



Neither me or my other Deck-owning friends are upset about the Ally. In fact we all kind of just agree about the Deck's shortcomings (many of which the Ally solves) but still love the Deck as the best thing there is out there regardless. Some of us are probably going to upgrade and others are going to wait a bit for other offers.

What I did see are a bunch of Linux nutjobs over at r/linux_gaming and r/SteamDeck angry that a Windows handheld might prove a better option for gaming than SteamOS.

Valve hopes that the SteamDeck will kickstart gaming PC's handheld category. Gaming is X86 CPU's best chance to break into the handheld segment without directly aiming at mobile phone SoCs.