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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen

Same. Big mistake because since then YouTube has recommended three story spoilers videos with huge spoilers in the title. Thanks a lot Google, you cunts.

And they want to let AI control everything in the future. Their retarded algorithms think we want to see story spoilers the day before launch.
Eh. If I got like better call saul (which I’m watching now with my gf) or say red dead redemption 2 back in the day spoiled I’d be perturbed but insomniacs Spider-Man 2?

You might as well spoil “give a mouse a cookie” or “cat in the hat” for me. I’ve seen the cutscenes and the writing and story is a joke in my opinion. It’s a cute romp. Nothin more
 
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MidGenRefresh

*Refreshes biennially
Same. Big mistake because since then YouTube has recommended three story spoilers videos with huge spoilers in the title. Thanks a lot Google, you cunts.

And they want to let AI control everything in the future. Their retarded algorithms think we want to see story spoilers the day before launch.

That algorithm is on drugs, seriously. I've watched like 2-3 videos of Spider-Man 2 on PS5 and now my feed is flooded by videos of "BEST COSUMIZATIONS FOR YOUR PS5". I'm like, dude, what the actual fuck. People do that? Hey Google, my PS5 is a dust magnet for 95% of the year and I only switch it on to a) see if it still works or b) play new Sony exclusive banger. That's it.

 

Alex11

Member
Lol, a regular gamer took this in photomode, not a virtual cinematographer. He screwed up the DoF but overall it still looks ace.




Oh and these pics in all of it's path-traced glory running on a mighty 4090 is sooooo much better right? Neck and neck with CG am I right?



8oDyXYr.jpg
P1Af9W0.jpg
Au2enKx.jpg
These pictures of CP actually look ok, and you can see the lighting is natural, there are other places in game where you can take unflattering screens if you want, it's not perfect.

You're taking it too personal, it's not that SM2 is an ugly game, far from it, just that people had higher expectations from it and they are right.
 

alloush

Member
I don't know what's worse. A downgrade or the fact that it's bugged on release. Either way, we lose.
Not defending spidey 2, everyone knows I was disappointed with the graphics but name me one game that isn’t marred with bugs on release. It’s been the case since the PS3 days.
 

MidGenRefresh

*Refreshes biennially
These pictures of CP actually look ok, and you can see the lighting is natural, there are other places in game where you can take unflattering screens if you want, it's not perfect.

You're taking it too personal, it's not that SM2 is an ugly game, far from it, just that people had higher expectations from it and they are right.

Exactly. Spider-Man 2 looks good. Good enough. I'm hyped for tomorrow. Today I've moved PS5 to my office where my smaller 42 inch LG OLED TV is located, will lock myself and play all afternoon. I have only one short business meeting at 10 AM. It's going to be great.

I honestly hate when people shit on Cyberpunk path-tracing but never actually played it.

ozYIosn.jpg
 
Exactly. Spider-Man 2 looks good. Good enough. I'm hyped for tomorrow. Today I've moved PS5 to my office where my smaller 42 inch LG OLED TV is located, will lock myself and play all afternoon. I have only one short business meeting at 10 AM. It's going to be great.

I honestly hate when people shit on Cyberpunk path-tracing but never actually played it.

ozYIosn.jpg
That pathtracing drip.
 

ChiefDada

Gold Member
I don't know what's worse. A downgrade or the fact that it's bugged on release. Either way, we lose.

Bro, you've been posting CP2077 and had the nerve to talk about gamed being bugged upon release!

You're taking it too personal, it's not that SM2 is an ugly game, far from it, just that people had higher expectations from it and they are right.

I'm really not. In fact there are some rendering issues where SM2 deserves honest criticism. I've brought them up myself with the shadow rendering. But saying SM2 isn't a generational leap from OG SM is the type of talk that lowers the quality of discussion in this thread.
 

MidGenRefresh

*Refreshes biennially
Bro, you've been posting CP2077 and had the nerve to talk about gamed being bugged upon release!

Broooooooooooooooooo. Broooooo! Bro, Cyberpunk 2077 is still bugged to this day. I know because I've played it on release, and multiple times afterwards (including 2.0 update). I just found it funny that the other day Insomniac was flexing that the game on disc is complete and now we finding out about massive bugs like this and day one patch that's like 30GB.

You can start a thread "Technical Polish I Expect This Gen" if you want to discuss it.

Cyberpunk still looking good thou.

0dRY9CL.png


bUpiDKp.png


Y7luJTx.png
 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Eh. If I got like better call saul (which I’m watching now with my gf) or say red dead redemption 2 back in the day spoiled I’d be perturbed but insomniacs Spider-Man 2?

You might as well spoil “give a mouse a cookie” or “cat in the hat” for me. I’ve seen the cutscenes and the writing and story is a joke in my opinion. It’s a cute romp. Nothin more
i thought the first spiderman game had the best spiderman story since spiderman 2. so it means something to me.

also, a couple of these spoilers were major story beats i was not expecting so kinda pissed atm.
 

MidGenRefresh

*Refreshes biennially
Honestly insomniac missed a trick by not modeling their building to have things sticking out like this. I get that NYC doesnt have a lot of these kind of buildings but its a comic book adaptation. Doesnt have to be 1:1.

It just gives these buildings a more 3d look which is lacking in Spiderman 2.

Not every neighborhood but places like Little China look like this:

New-Project-22-1024x683.png
 
i thought the first spiderman game had the best spiderman story since spiderman 2. so it means something to me.

also, a couple of these spoilers were major story beats i was not expecting so kinda pissed atm.
Yeah first one was alright. Best story since Spider-Man 2 is a low bar. That’s like asking me to step over a bar an inch off the ground.

They’ve gotten progressively more childish with MM and now SP2 to where they’ve completely jumped the shark.

And also I hate to be this guy, I’m not some MAGA dude or anything but if you do your research they’ve added some diversity hires to the writing team. I believe there’s a new woke ass woman or two on the writing staff that weren’t present for the first game. They also parted ways with some of the writers from the first game and replaced them with these girls so.
 
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MidGenRefresh

*Refreshes biennially
This is a nice comparison showing improvements to lighting. It's looking good but I'm not sure what the hell is going on with windows on some of these skyscrapers. Looks like mosaic and not a smooth glass surface.

WN2O89C.jpg


Qk9bH7d.jpg


Real thing:

Met-Life-and-Chysler-Building-2-2.jpg


I'm honestly shocked this scene is path-traced because lighting doesn't look too great. Computer panel especially doesn't look natural. Not too great even under rasterization standards imo

Brooooooooooooooo! Bro!! The entire table is a glowing, pink cube, BRO!
 

Kuwitzzer

Member
Eh. If I got like better call saul (which I’m watching now with my gf) or say red dead redemption 2 back in the day spoiled I’d be perturbed but insomniacs Spider-Man 2?

You might as well spoil “give a mouse a cookie” or “cat in the hat” for me. I’ve seen the cutscenes and the writing and story is a joke in my opinion. It’s a cute romp. Nothin more
Why your talks alway reek of pretentious stuff like this? What’s wrong with not wanting to be spoiled of game you are about to experience? RDR2 is nothing compared to many older movies I watched yet I also do not want be spoiled.
 

ProtoByte

Member
:|

What do you mean so? They’re making a war movie. So they needed to nail the scale of a large war. They could have done the lazy thing and went all cgi. Instead? They literally hired THOUSANDS of extras to make it look REAL. That is ambition. There is t a single game dev on earth that would do things the hard way just to make it more epic? Which is the whole point we’re getting at… they lack ambition.
This is the movie equivalent of Starfield sandwiches. One, it's not as impressive as it sounds - it's hardly the first movie to have thousands of extras, and it won't be the last. It's a nice technical detail if you're interested in film production. Beyond that, most people don't give a shit, and most people won't notice the difference to the point of discriminating between it and any other large scale film. Two, it means nothing if the more fundamental stuff isn't in place. I remember reading about all the wild shit going on on set for The Revenant, only to watch the movie and think it sucked. Very few of the images, technically impressive as they were, really stuck.

Plenty of games have cool nerd details if that's what you're looking for.

some games like COD have 2000+ people working on them and 250 million dollar budgets and we can’t even get destructive environments in a war game. Even though they are reusing the same base game design every goddamn year
Cmon, you know better than this.
One, destruction was kneecapped for 10 years due to the awful CPUs in 8th gen consoles. 2, destruction doesn't exist in a vacuum. It actually affects game design. I want and demand a lot more of it, but you know that it's never been an industry standard feature, and that design trends will gave to shift quite a bit to accommodate them.

Still better than 95% of games. Or at least on par.
I don't think I'd agree. 95% is too much.

And creativity. I can’t name a single thing game devs are ambitious with. Game design? Lol. Graphics? Lol. Writing? Lol.
Alan Wake 2 is about to come out dude. That seems to be hitting everything you're talking about here.

Beyond that, would you really, truthfully say that cinema has advanced or evolved to such an insane degree? We're sitting here on about Napoleon; Ben Hur is a thing. Laurence of Arabia is a thing.

There is nothing. There’s zero ambition in the industry
Lol

I will not stand for TLOU 2 slander. An actually ambitious game that took risks and had a devs go out of their comfort zones. Intense and visually stunning gory combat, best graphics of the gen, etc
I thought there was zero ambition in the games industry? Anyway, I love everything about that game other than the story. People's brains break when it comes to Druckmann, but I can smell a lot of the bad pacing, confused intent, and stupid symbolism attempts from Haley Gross of Westworld experience.

They should stop hiring Hollywood writers and go for actual novelists if they're going to hire from outside. Half the clowns in tinsel town are running on the fumes of novelists anyway.
 
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Why your talks alway reek of pretentious stuff like this? What’s wrong with not wanting to be spoiled of game you are about to experience? RDR2 is nothing compared to many older movies I watched yet I also do not want be spoiled.
Oh gee let me guess. Spider-Man fan?

I prefaced not once but twice it’s my opinion. Have a seat and maybe Google what pretentious means
 

Kuwitzzer

Member
Sure. Bayonetta 3 had some insane setpieces but was clearly held back by the switch. it looked like a 240p pixelated mess. Arguably the worst looking AAA game ive ever played despite some of the most insane setpieces ever. But DMC and Asura's Wrath pale in comparison to both games.

I dont agree. In terms of the basics, yes, ever since the silent era, movies have largely remained the same format, but you cant watch Oppenheimer and tell me its the same boring biopic as Stephen Hawkins or even Oscar winning ones like the beautiful mind. Nolan shot it like a fast paced thriller defying genre conventions. Same games for Batman. It's a serial killer movie not a super hero one. Id hardly call those movies formulaic.

Point we are trying to make is that movies are far more ambitious than games despite game budgets ballooning to $200 million per iterative sequel if Sonys own figures are to be believed. Nolan chose not to rely upon CG for his war movie. Sam Mendes got 2000 extras on screen at once for 1917 when CG wouldve done just fine. Tom Cruise is continuing to push practical effects and stunts. James Cameron is doing insane things with Avatar. Avatar 2 in 3d at 60 fps was a spellbinding experience. The underwater scenes felt like I was there. If thats not innovative or ambitious i dont know what is. And this is coming from someone who HATED Peter Jackson's 60 fps hobbit movies.

This whole idea that movies were so much better back in the day is hilarious. Compare Dune from the 80s to Dune by Denise Villenvue. It's not even fucking close. And no it's not just because the storytelling had better execution. It's the craftmanship, the ambition to go bigger and push boundries, that is sorely lacking from the video game industry which has $200 million, 500-1000 devs, and 5 years to make anything in the world and then chooses to make generic open world games instead. You can call Marvel and Disney movies generic, but Dune, Batman, Oppenheimer, Top Gun Maverick, Avatar 2 are all your summer popcorn blockbusters that are far more ambitious than your AAA games from first and third party A-tier developers.

I dont know man. You are a zelda fan. They just made arguably the most innovative game in a decade on a hardware that is almost 20 years old while other devs wouldnt even bother implementing the most fucking physics on hardware literally 50x more powerful. If you think devs are ambitious today then you need only compare totk to horizon forbidden west and other generic open world games.

see above.
That’s because you are only looking at movies through technology lens. Of course the movies gotta look better now, how can they look even close when the gap is 40 years. But when it comes to writing, ideas, novelty, epitome of cinema, no current movies can beat past movies. Your examples, especially Avatar 2 is all about spectacle. The Batman while good is nothing special, it’s a good detective , mystery movie but that’s about it.
 
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That’s because you are only looking at movies through technology lens. Of course the movies gotta look better now, how can they look even close when the gap is 40 years. But when it comes to writing, ideas, novelty, epitome of cinema, no current movies can beat past movies. Your examples, especially Avatar 2 is all about spectacle. The Batman while good is nothing special, it’s a good detective , mystery movie but that’s about it.
To be fair this whole conversation started in regards to TASM2 cgi. As far as I’ve read it’s all been focusing on the technical side of things so you’re making a slightly moot point.

It was Spider-Man in movies visuals and then hypothetical Spider-Man game visuals. I mean this is a graphics thread. Story wasn’t a primary part of the film vs gaming discussion that took place here
 

Kuwitzzer

Member
To be fair this whole conversation started in regards to TASM2 cgi. As far as I’ve read it’s all been focusing on the technical side of things so you’re making a slightly moot point.

It was Spider-Man in movies visuals and then hypothetical Spider-Man game visuals. I mean this is a graphics thread. Story wasn’t a primary part of the film vs gaming discussion that took place here
And that is why you have no rights to even talk about standards or novelty when the only thing you care about is spectacles.
 
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I’m a Spider Man fan for being hostile towards your opinion, yeah sure dude.
Don’t be purposefully obtuse. You know that’s not what I’m talking about

You clearly got incensed by what I said because you registered it as some attack and probably thought “this guy thinks he’s above my Spider-Man video game? What adjective can I throw at him… pretentious!”
 
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And that is why you have no rights to even talk about standards or novelty when the only thing you care about is spectacles.
Dude… what? I’m explaining to you the topic of the conversation people were having…? How did you go from that to “I only care about spectacle ergo I have no credibility”???
 
Bro, you've been posting CP2077 and had the nerve to talk about gamed being bugged upon release!



I'm really not. In fact there are some rendering issues where SM2 deserves honest criticism. I've brought them up myself with the shadow rendering. But saying SM2 isn't a generational leap from OG SM is the type of talk that lowers the quality of discussion in this thread.
I really don’t see how it’s a generational leap at all - how is it one? Compared to others? That video comparing sm remastered to sm2 seemed to illustrate quite clearly that it’s pretty much par for the course it’s less of a bump than what happens within a single gen in most respects
 
Unity is a good pick. I went back to look at Gears of War 3 and it still look crazy because of all the prebaked lighting.
NEHCNBM.jpg
eEgmJcG.jpg


The detail on some of the multiplayer maps is still insane even today.

Gears 2 > Gears 3 was more of a "leap" than Spiderman 1> Spiderman 2, except that game didn't have the benefit of going from cross gen to current gen!

I remember how impressive some of those maps were ...checkout, the stadium map, etc. Everything was improved and it was obvious and it was awesome. s
Some people probably didn't like the slightly more colorful artstyle of Gears 3 but the difference was obvious.

This is one of the reasons why Spiderman 2 is always going to be disappointing compared to what we used to see from devs.
 
Gears 2 > Gears 3 was more of a "leap" than Spiderman 1> Spiderman 2, except that game didn't have the benefit of going from cross gen to current gen!

I remember how impressive some of those maps were ...checkout, the stadium map, etc. Everything was improved and it was obvious and it was awesome. s
Some people probably didn't like the slightly more colorful artstyle of Gears 3 but the difference was obvious.

This is one of the reasons why Spiderman 2 is always going to be disappointing compared to what we used to see from devs.
The 60fps curse.

Imagine if uncharted 4 had to run 60fps. Wouldn’t be as big of a leap from 3. Common sense.

Now here we are busting out the magnifying glass and microscopes to find a difference between a premium AAA first party sequel and it’s predecessor from goddamn 2018. It’s ridiculous.
 
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ChiefDada

Gold Member
I really don’t see how it’s a generational leap at all - how is it one? Compared to others? That video comparing sm remastered to sm2 seemed to illustrate quite clearly that it’s pretty much par for the course it’s less of a bump than what happens within a single gen in most respects


SM Remastered and SM2 are both PS5 only games. Do you understanding my point better now when it comes to fairly measuring generational difference?
 
SM Remastered and SM2 are both PS5 only games. Do you understanding my point better now when it comes to fairly measuring generational difference?

What? SM remastered is a remaster of a ps4 game. It's already an accepted fact that Miles Morales, a cross gen game, edges out Sm1 visually. You'd have a point if SM1 had higher fidelity amd showed that it was actually behaving like a ps5 only game but it isn't.

People are using the SM1 remaster and Miles interchangeably when comparing
since they're so close. Now, you're playing semantics.
 
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ChiefDada

Gold Member
What? SM remastered is a remaster of a ps4 game. It's already an accepted fact that Miles Morales, a cross gen game, edges out Sm1 visually.

SM Remastered and Miles Morales PS5 are both native PS5 games with visual features that couldn't have been executed on the last gen console, namely RT reflections, high res textures, and shading/lighting in more than a few sections.

People are using the SM1 remaster and Miles interchangeably when comparing
since they're so close. Now, you're playing semantics

Lol if you think the visual difference between SM PS4 and SM Remastered can be waved off as semantics, then you shouldn't have a problem comparing SM PS4 with SM2.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
SM Remastered and Miles Morales PS5 are both native PS5 games with visual features that couldn't have been executed on the last gen console, namely RT reflections, high res textures, and shading/lighting in more than a few sections.



Lol if you think the visual difference between SM PS4 and SM Remastered can be waved off as semantics, then you shouldn't have a problem comparing SM PS4 with SM2.
Just because a game got a ps5 sku, it doesn’t make it a ps5 only game. By that logic, every cross Gen game at launch was a ps5 game. Watch dogs had the same exact enhancements as Spider-Man remastered. But textures, ray tracing etc. re village used ray tracing for its lighting on next Gen consoles, doesn’t mean it’s a ps5 game. So yes, you are arguing semantics.

That said, i do agree that for more accurate comparisons the base ps4 or ps4 pro versions should be used.
 

RNK

Member
Just because a game got a ps5 sku, it doesn’t make it a ps5 only game. By that logic, every cross Gen game at launch was a ps5 game. Watch dogs had the same exact enhancements as Spider-Man remastered. But textures, ray tracing etc. re village used ray tracing for its lighting on next Gen consoles, doesn’t mean it’s a ps5 game. So yes, you are arguing semantics.

That said, i do agree that for more accurate comparisons the base ps4 or ps4 pro versions should be used.
It should still be compared to the base game of Spider-man 1 if we're comparing generation to generation.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Now here we are busting out the magnifying glass and microscopes to find a difference
In some cases yes. But we have seen several instances where the difference is obvious and massive.

They have clearly improved:
- lighting especially mid day lighting
- rt reflections
- better hair rendering
- better trees
- denser traffic
- faster traversal


These are immediately noticeable and next Gen. Other stuff like building assets, night time rendering, character models have received upgrades but yes they do require magnifying glasses etc. but i disagree that you need a microscope in every scenario.

I would’ve loved to have Matrix quality building asset quality, character models and lighting but they have come very close with some lighting conditions, traffic density, and reflections. The smooth panning shots of the city are simply not possible last Gen. I know because we never got a cutscene like that.
 

Markio128

Gold Member
You can pick and poke at screenshots all you want, but I can say with absolute certainty, that Spider-Man 2 is a fucking stunner. I’ve played the first hour or so in fidelity mode, and I honestly can’t figure out how Insomniac have made it feel so smooth.
 
I remember how impressive some of those maps were ...checkout, the stadium map, etc. Everything was improved and it was obvious and it was awesome. s
Some people probably didn't like the slightly more colorful artstyle of Gears 3 but the difference was obvious.
I was exclusively on my PC back then but I definitely remember Gears of War 3 being a stand out console title at the time. What stood out to me years ago about it was the shading, animation work, how they were conserving extremely detailed textures with high contrast lighting, effects like DOF and object motion blur ect.
 
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SM Remastered and Miles Morales PS5 are both native PS5 games with visual features that couldn't have been executed on the last gen console, namely RT reflections, high res textures, and shading/lighting in more than a few sections.



Lol if you think the visual difference between SM PS4 and SM Remastered can be waved off as semantics, then you shouldn't have a problem comparing SM PS4 with SM2.

I can see comparing ps4 pro 2018 to sm2. In that case not a big difference compared to Last of Us 1 to Last of Us 2 or God of War 3 to God of War 4.

More accurate comparison would be Uncharted 3 Remastered (ps4) to Uncharted 4 or Last of Us 1 Remastered (ps4 pro) to Last of Us 2 (ps4 pro) or LoU1 Remaster (ps4 pro) to LoU1 Remake (ps5)
 

setoman

Member
SM Remastered and Miles Morales PS5 are both native PS5 games with visual features that couldn't have been executed on the last gen console, namely RT reflections, high res textures, and shading/lighting in more than a few sections.

Lol if you think the visual difference between SM PS4 and SM Remastered can be waved off as semantics, then you shouldn't have a problem comparing SM PS4 with SM2.
Rather than play and enjoy the game.
Look at the lengths you would go to twist reality and revise history just to fandom spiderman...Just because it turned out that the difference between SM1 to SM2 is just improved lighting.

First of all, PC games from day one historically receive 100x more features than the console counterparts and not a single soul ever called the PC version of a game "the next gen version".

PC Version historically sees improvement in Texture Quality (upto 4k textures), Resolution, Level Of Detail, Draw Distance, Reflection Quality, Lighting Quality, Volumetric Lighting/Fog Quality, Ambient Occlusion Quality, Anti-Aliasing Quality, Shadow Resolution/Quality, Particle/Effects Quality, Geometric Detail and more.

Console usually run these features at low/medium while PC has access to high, very high and ultra slider options.
A bigger gap than SM1 OG and SM1 Remaster.
And yet no one calls pc version of games "the next gen version".

To give you an example: Console (PS4/XBO) for example would have SSAO for a game while PC would have option far more expensive and far more better alternatives like HBAO, HBAO+, VXAO, Percentage Closer Soft Shadows (PCSS) and finally RTAO.

Another example is reflections:
Console games (PS4/XBO) would sometimes have low resolution cubemaps. But because the PC version has access to (high > very high and ultra settings for reflection).
You end up with features like a much higher resolution cube map, Parallax-Corrected Cubemaps (PCC), Screen Space Reflection (SSR) with various resolutions, Planar Reflections and finally Ray traced reflections.

Another example is Global Illumination Quality slider: that games like Quantum break, etc has.

Another example is PC versions having Parallax Occlusion Mapping(POM) and Tessellation..

I could keep going but I will stop.

The point is, the SM1 Remaster is the barebone difference of what a normal PC version multiplatform game would have at release. Infact as I have shown above, a PC version game would have alot more improvements.

Calling it a native PS5 next gen version is straight up cope and revising of history.
 
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