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Audiophile GAF
- Thread starter Maiden Voyage
- Start date
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
Gold looks good on you.
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
To borrow from John Darko, I am a music first audiophile. Meaning the music is more important that audio quality & gear. I've found my diminishing returns point and unless I suddenly become a billionaire, I'm quite satisfied with the gear I have.I'm thinking about audiophile stuffz tonight
Just gonna listen to Radiohead/Tool and embrace my current gear
Not going down the rabbit hole, I'm saving up for more vital things
I almost got back into CDs but with Apple Music doing lossless, there is no real reason to. I just need the vinyl market to calm the hell down. The new Zach Bryan album doesn't ship until March of 2023, for example.
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ForAcademicPurposes
Gold Member
I can't justify the price. I could but I'd have to give up some creature comforts on my end. I did end up giving somebody their first record though and she was over the moon with it.
lem0n
Member
Hi friends, first time poster in here and just dipping my toes into decent quality audio for the very first time.
I'm looking for suggestions on some gear. Mainly, speakers and a record player. I've already got some HD6XX and a Darkvoice 336SE tube amp on the way. I was going to get a basic Schiit stack for my desk/PC, and pair the Darkvoice with the record player, and move the headphones between setups as I wanted. Eventually the music corner would have it's own dedicated set but I'm trying not to go too nuts without knowing what I like yet. Ideally, speakers will go on computer desk but will be wired to both amp/record player AND PC. Is this possible?
I'm completely new to this so be kind, lol
I'm looking for suggestions on some gear. Mainly, speakers and a record player. I've already got some HD6XX and a Darkvoice 336SE tube amp on the way. I was going to get a basic Schiit stack for my desk/PC, and pair the Darkvoice with the record player, and move the headphones between setups as I wanted. Eventually the music corner would have it's own dedicated set but I'm trying not to go too nuts without knowing what I like yet. Ideally, speakers will go on computer desk but will be wired to both amp/record player AND PC. Is this possible?
I'm completely new to this so be kind, lol
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
How far are these places from one another?
lem0n
Member
Small room, think extra bedroom. Computer setup is on north wall, record player will be on west wall.
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
Ok. Long lengths can cause problems with cables. You should be fine if it’s a small room. Some issues otherwise.
You’ll need to route everything through a something that would allow for separate input switching to the same output. This could be a pre-amp or a switch device like the Schiit Sys.
Your amp is for headphones right? Are you buying an amplifier for your speakers or are they active (meaning the amplifier is built-in)? The above point may be moot depending on your amplifier, as some come with multi-input selection (these are called integrated amplifiers).
For the record player you may need to buy a phono preamp (like a Schiit Mani) unless it comes baked in.
What speakers are you going to get or do you have?
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lem0n
Member
First off thanks for your input and helping me out!
I will check that Sys out. Sounds like what I need.
Yeah, amp is for headphones but I maybe wrongly assumed that Id be able to use that same amp for the speakers that I choose. I haven’t purchased any speakers yet, I was looking at some Klipsch or Edifer monitors on Amazon, but am very much open to suggestions in the 2-300 dollar range. Maybe a little more if I can’t live without em.
Is it worth seeking out a built in phono amp record player, or does it make more sense to get them separately?
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
Speakers in that range are decent. Lots to choose from. For the amp see how much wattage they put out on the rca outs. You can use this to help pick speakers that will work with it. If there’s no amplification, then you can skip the sys and get an integrated amp.
The phono stage is up to you. If you’re a beginner there is no shame in going with one built-in. My record player is an Audio-Technica LP120 and has a built-in phono stage, for example. People have removed it as a half-step upgrade by bringing in a nicer external phono stage.
No problem on the help. I learned most of what I know from randos online too.
TheHighFlyingBirds
Member
If you do go for a separate phono stage, make sure this is near the record player, i.e. use a short cable from record player to phono stage, then a longer cable from phono stage to amp. This due to signals pre and post phono stage (mV to V) and a longer cable pre phono introduces higher capacitance issues.
Perhaps this is a good place to ask. I just purchased a 55” Sony XR A80J oled tv for my bedroom which is an amazing tv and definitely overkill for a bedroom tv but whatever. I was sick of my old 2010 Samsung that made black look grayish white. Now that I have this awesome screen I want to be able to watch movies I. My bed with better sound than the tv speakers offer. What’s the best bang for my buck in maybe the $800-$1000 ranges? I don’t need full surround sound but if there is a good option for that without having to run a bunch of cables I’d do it. I’d like whatever I got to include a subwoofer.
Get a Sonos Arc, or beam if you wanna go cheaper.
Or better yet get a the new Sony sound bar bit more than 1000.
They all do virtual surrond and do it really well. The new samsung sound bar with rears is also pretty good.
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
Yeah for a bedroom set-up, I personally would not want a full ack of gear unless it's your only system to really get good sound. I don't know anything about sound bars, as I've never owned one. From what I've read/watched on YT, it seems like there are decent sounders out there for this type of thing.
teezzy
Banned
So with wireless Bluetooth buds...
Does the audio quality of my device at all matter? I mean I listen on Spotify on a Galaxy S21 and have all the settings set to high quality, etc
Is it safe to assume that once you're already streaming and using a non-wired connection you're "sacrificing" enough data that it won't make a difference? I mean at that point the drivers/amps/etc are all in the buds themselves right?
Sounds great to me. Just curious. Like would a dedicated flac device really make any discernable difference?
I'm a big believer in "good enough" in regards to most enthusiast realms like audio
Does the audio quality of my device at all matter? I mean I listen on Spotify on a Galaxy S21 and have all the settings set to high quality, etc
Is it safe to assume that once you're already streaming and using a non-wired connection you're "sacrificing" enough data that it won't make a difference? I mean at that point the drivers/amps/etc are all in the buds themselves right?
Sounds great to me. Just curious. Like would a dedicated flac device really make any discernable difference?
I'm a big believer in "good enough" in regards to most enthusiast realms like audio
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
Do you ever "actively" listen or is it more casual for you? By actively listening I mean specifically only giving the music for 100% focus and intent.
I'm pulling this number out of my ass, but I would venture to guess 95% of people cannot tell the difference in Flac vs 320kps OGG. With BT you are sacrificing some audio quality but TBH, as long as you're enjoying it who cares?
As and aside... I'm not big on IEMs or buds. I have several pairs of both and they are strictly utility for me (workout, mowing, phone calls, etc.). If I'm going to listen to music, I want it coming out of speakers. If I can't get that, then I go to a pair of open back headphones or AirPod Maxes (or if I want to listen with Dolby Atmos). IEMs and buds are at the very, very bottom of the list for me.
teezzy
Banned
What - like close my eyes and listen? Yeah I do that sometimes
AeonGaidenRaiden
Member
A friend thats an audiophile but also experiments with random brands recommended me these. Holy shit, the bass, the highs and lows...its basically monitor earphones with crazy sound and build quality for $30+. They have a detachable cable from the earphones which is always a plus and the cable is so well protected, these things wont wrangle up when in pocket (i hate bluetooth earphones).
KZ ZS10 Pro
KZ ZS10 Pro
ForAcademicPurposes
Gold Member
Been using these for my commute every work day. Cheap as chips. Mine are purple and chrome though. I haven't had the urge the buy something more high end like from Campfire Audio for example.A friend thats an audiophile but also experiments with random brands recommended me these. Holy shit, the bass, the highs and lows...its basically monitor earphones with crazy sound and build quality for $30+. They have a detachable cable from the earphones which is always a plus and the cable is so well protected, these things wont wrangle up when in pocket (i hate bluetooth earphones).
KZ ZS10 Pro
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
A friend thats an audiophile but also experiments with random brands recommended me these. Holy shit, the bass, the highs and lows...its basically monitor earphones with crazy sound and build quality for $30+. They have a detachable cable from the earphones which is always a plus and the cable is so well protected, these things wont wrangle up when in pocket (i hate bluetooth earphones).
KZ ZS10 Pro
I used to use them as my travel pair but since getting the AirPod Max, my KZ ZS10 Pros are pretty much only for mowing. Great bang for the buck. I wound up buying some foam tips for these and that made a nice improvement for comfort.
lostinblue
Banned
Haven't been able to secure Schiit stuff in Europe for ages. My current PC setup annoys me because not enough Ohms, I don't understand how PC manufactures go gaga about shit like RGB lightning but never integrate good headphone amps into their shit.
I like the DT 1990 Pro, but find the M50x "competent boring", do you produce sound or something? It's the only use where I find them to be good (but still boring).
In ear monitors I hate through and through.
EDIT: Didn't know the KZ ZS10 Pro, interesting albeit not for me.
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Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
I hear you man. Topping is supposed to be solid and more European based. They might be worth looking into if you're not already familiar with their stuff.
lostinblue
Banned
I'll look into it. Every time I hear an album with good layering I'm climbing the wall and screaming internally.
My current main headphones (not the most expensive I own, but the daily drivers) are some inexpensive AKG 240 MkII, but I can't stress how good they sound on my main hifi amp (Teac A-H300 mk1) via Chromecast Audio. For PC, I used to "main" Koss Portapros, as I prefer open headphones and am not keen on buying Grados due to the asking cost. But the cable quality is shit and not replaceable. I soldered new jacks or switched cables like 5 times until I melted the plastic in the driver while desoldering and screwed them. I'm not looking forward for having to do that several times again, so I've been basically quite frustrated.
I've actually purchased Samson SR850 because the reviews were rave, had huge drivers but were 32 Ohms, and hated it everywhere I tested them and even after equalizing them. I think the people who are singing the praises for them are deaf. Sold them as fast as I could. Super sibilant, and the "aural space" they created was always cramped. I actually used them enough to break them in, but they just sucked. Superlux are the same.
Most other stuff I tried that work well under 32 Ohms are dynamic as shit, which drives me crazy. It's like I see the waveform moving in the middle of a pitch change, reminds me of using a TV in Dynamic mode.
EDIT: Topping seems hit and miss in the audiosciencereview forum, but some are quite good. Nothing is a homerun or will spare me any money though. Schiit-Europe published on May 20 that stock is just around the corner so I think I'll be stuck waiting for a while longer.
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ForAcademicPurposes
Gold Member
TheHighFlyingBirds
Member
Always worth checking iFi, the zen dac v2 is supposed to be very good (I have the v1) which is a dac amp, but for more grunt there is the zen can, but this has no dac.
Reallink
Member
Topping is 1000% Chinese, the Chi-Fi of electronics. Nothing European based about them.
lostinblue
Banned
I'm sure he meant availability of their goods.
From where I checked it's true, anything in their lineup I could buy and have it shipped tomorrow within the European Union.
I swear Schiit-Europe has been stuck with no stock on anything meaningful for more than an year, perhaps one year and a half.
I've looked into them before, but not the zen dac v2. Thanks
I don't need a DAC
I've stockpiled Chromecast Audios when they discontinued them (still pissed about that) and am satisfied with their neutral DAC output and functionality, sounds fantastic on my vintage amps and the ability to cast from another device is nice. I still have at least one boxed that was never used. (but I won't complain if something brings a DAC included, as long as it's good)Their only fault is that they top out at 32 Ohms, so it doesn't solve the volume problem with headphones.
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TheHighFlyingBirds
Member
If you dont need a dac and just grunt then the zen can would be the one to look at, just a pure headphone amp. Plus it has balanced out which is always a nice additional feature.I'm sure he meant availability of their goods.
From where I checked it's true, anything in their lineup I could buy and have it shipped tomorrow within the European Union.
I swear Schiit-Europe has been stuck with no stock on anything meaningful for more than an year, perhaps one year and a half.
I've looked into them before, but not the zen dac v2. Thanks
I don't need a DAC
Their only fault is that they top out at 32 Ohms, so it doesn't solve the volume problem with headphones.
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
Schiit inventory in the US has been constrained. I don’t know if it’s gotten better with the new factory in Texas yet.I'm sure he meant availability of their goods.
From where I checked it's true, anything in their lineup I could buy and have it shipped tomorrow within the European Union.
I swear Schiit-Europe has been stuck with no stock on anything meaningful for more than an year, perhaps one year and a half.
I've looked into them before, but not the zen dac v2. Thanks
I don't need a DAC
Their only fault is that they top out at 32 Ohms, so it doesn't solve the volume problem with headphones.
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
crazepharmacist
Member
Anyone know anything about the new MacBooks just announced? Include support for “high impedance headphones”. Sounds like it will include a high quality dac/amp
lostinblue
Banned
Man... Don't count on it driving properly anything past 32 Ohms. I'm sure the thing they'll do is what Chromecast Audio did a few years back, usually you give 32 Ohm headphones 1,2V (so 32 Ohm headphones are tuned in for that and don't benefit from more, just like they don't benefit from more Ohms), but they implemented a mode that allowed for 32 Ohms and 2V and called it high dynamic range.
This didn't mean high dynamic range at all, try it on a good amp and it changes the sound for the worst (sounds tinier), but if you're using headphones that are over 32 Ohm what happens is... Sound is still worse than without the extra voltage with the headphones I tested, but the max volume is a bit louder. Still nothing near what they should be though. This was turned on by default btw, always turn it off if you want pristine output.
Apple is the company that hasn't even solved the speaker popping issue they had since the 2016 models.
You're lucky they don't remove the 3.5 mm plug. As they already dropped the optical out that was built in, there's simply not enough incentive for them to spend extra money imbuing high impedance overhead in their super small motherboards who already suffer from sound interference problems (speaker popping is most likely a voltage peak interference).
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farmerboy
Member
So, finally got the speakers. Haven't set up the home theatre, so just running the towers and sub. It did take some time to get the sub right. It's 12in, and required some thought on positioning and phase control. Have to run the sub at -10db from main volume, otherwise bass is to strong.
These are the Chrono 90 towers, which seemingly have just been replaced by the Townus range in the lineup.
Speakers are great, have a fantastic midrange. Bass is also pretty good, very listenable, but obviously better with the sub running at 80hz crossover.
Rated at 160w, I do feel these need more juice than my 100w pioneer lx305 can throw at them. Whilst they sound great at low volumes, I gotta crank the reciever to -8db to get to "concert like" volumes. And boy, when I do, I feel like they just elevate to a different level. A dedicated amp would be ideal. I am running them bi-amped.
Build quality is very good, and they have a certain heft to them.
Funnily enough, I think they sound better without the cloth grill on the front.
The LX305 has Dirac, but haven't used it yet. Many have reported positive results even in stereo, so I look forward to seeing what that does.
Overall very positive on these. No buyers remorse at all.
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
Feel free to post any pics of the set-up. Glad you are enjoying the experience!
kraspkibble
Permabanned.
i bought the new Sony WH-1000XM5 headphones. they cost £380 and i've never spent anywhere near that on audio hardware before. i do own XM3 earphones which were £170 but i got them as a gift. most i've spent myself is £70 for some hyperx headphones about 5 years ago. so i wouldn't say i'm an audiophile but i am willing to spend almost £400 on headphones. i guess you could say i'm dipping my toes in the water! i do appreciate good quality sounding music and would maybe go a bit further than the average person. i do have some vinyl records and i bought a sound card for my PC.
anyway, my question is this... i am probably going to move to Apple Music from Spotify and AM has lossless/hi-res lossless. i know you can't do lossless over bluetooth and Apple recommends using wired headphones and an external DAC if you are listening at over 48kHz. if i were to use the 3.5mm cable with the XM5 headphones and get a lighting to 3.5mm adapter would i be able to listen to lossless that way?
anyway, my question is this... i am probably going to move to Apple Music from Spotify and AM has lossless/hi-res lossless. i know you can't do lossless over bluetooth and Apple recommends using wired headphones and an external DAC if you are listening at over 48kHz. if i were to use the 3.5mm cable with the XM5 headphones and get a lighting to 3.5mm adapter would i be able to listen to lossless that way?
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
I assume your device is an iPhone since you need a lightning to 3.5mm adapter? I don't believe the DAC in the Apple-made adapter is able to convert lossless but I could be wrong and a cursory search online yielding no interesting results.
You can get an external DAC that can handle lossless (sorry, prices are in USD). Audioquest Dragonfly Black $120 or FiiO KA1 $50, for example. You can also get a DAC Amp combo if you move to higher impedance headphones.
Best bang-for-buck IMO is always going to come from the speakers or drivers themselves. If you truly want a step-up I would recommend looking into a solid pair of open back headphones. Your use case will absolutely matter on open vs closed back so know what you are getting beforehand (open back sounds better but there is no filtering of outside noise & likewise everyone externally can hear what you're listening to). Also take into account where & how you primarily listen to music the most and build your system around that. Life will change your situation so speakers and gear might change over time but a solid portable set-up is always useful at least some of the time.
I can ramble about this shit all day so feel free to ask more. Others in this thread have good opinions as well. These days I am not so much on the portable side unless I am traveling. My go-to now are the AirPod Max for the combo of noise canceling and spatial audio / Dolby Atmos. I know my sound quality is taking a hit but I don't really care so much as I am almost never trying to critically listen to music with headphones on.
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ForAcademicPurposes
Gold Member
It's quite an experience to listen to Julia Holter with a capable pair of iems, especially if you're blazed.
ForAcademicPurposes
Gold Member
manfestival
Member
Anyone want to share their playlists for critical listening? Would prefer if you have it on amazon or the songs can be found on amazon. In a mood to listen to a bunch of random stuff over my usual playlist tracks.
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
As seeing Smashing Pumpkins and Evanescence being favourite bands here, you'd be better off listening to the yule log channel.
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Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
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farmerboy
Member
Setting things up this time around, I listened to a lot of Cake - Fashion Nugget and Prolonging the Magic. Horns/brass, percussion, strong bass and very clear vocals. Found that it was great music to evaluate different aspects of the speakers.
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lostinblue
Banned
I don't have a playlist, but I do have a few "sample" songs, that I use to benchmark headphones, amps, dacs and speakers. So when I want to test something specific I usually know what to tune in.
It's only useful if you're used to these songs and their signatures so I don't think saying I use A, B and C helps all that much. Mileage will vary.
I enjoy testing how midrange is on most speakers, so my first tests are midrange hell scenarios, this way if the driver is dynamic I'll know instantly, and if the sound driver has slow floaty response I'll know as well (sound turns to mud), if it's fast but without character as well (I don't like those, only good for mastering) you also see how treble and bass work together, find a song that either behaves like a wave that stays in the middle then goes up (treble) then down (bass) or one that has both a bassline and a treble line going on at the same time. Preferably find an example of both to test stuff.
When looking for interesting production values I sometimes use this website:
dr.loudness-war.info
Good Dynamic Range ensures that the sound stage is as big as it can be and IMO genre is less important when headphones and speakers can make you travel to a place as if you were there. That never happens with bad mastering/Low Dynamic Range, as good as the music is. Basically, find a good album with good DR and it's even better.
A while ago I found Paco de Lúcia... that dude never pressed any album with a master any less than perfect for close listening, it's insane. And some collaborators of his, like John McLaughlin and Al Di Meola, colaborators of his are also usually good, but I would double check just to be sure.
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