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[Kataploom]

As by far the biggest console publisher in the world, Nintendo is always going to have the biggest share.

Third party games that don't have realistic art styles (such as Sonic, Dragon Ball Z Minecraft, Borderlands or Dragon Quest) can certainly do well.

But third party games that do have realistic art styles (such as RDR, GTA, Monster Hunter, Dark Souls or Resident Evil) can also do well.

It would makes no sense not to bring a game to Switch because of its art style.

It's not only the art style and I don't know what exactly is but Nintendo and in general japanese and indie games look and feel different from western AAA games. Even From software games that use wester inspired art style play and feel too disconnected from western gaming style.

The audience you attract to your platform will prefer the games like the ones they came from, like you're not making a pop-rock band open a black metal concert because the audience there won't like it. Some would, btw, but still not the most of them.

I only used Wii U as an example because it sold badly, btw, yet some specific type of games sold way better than on PS/Xbox because of their audience differences. Here's an example:

For one thing, the Wii U version of Shovel Knight outsold the PS4 and Xbox One versions combined, and Nintendo platforms as a whole have accounted for over 50% of the game’s total sales

https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2018/04/shovel_knight_just_crossed_two_million_units_sold

 

[Woopah]

It's not only the art style and I don't know what exactly is but Nintendo and in general japanese and indie games look and feel different from western AAA games. Even From software games that use wester inspired art style play and feel too disconnected from western gaming style.

The audience you attract to your platform will prefer the games like the ones they came from, like you're not making a pop-rock band open a black metal concert because the audience there won't like it. Some would, btw, but still not the most of them.

I only used Wii U as an example because it sold badly, btw, yet some specific type of games sold way better than on PS/Xbox because of their audience differences. Here's an example:


https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2018/04/shovel_knight_just_crossed_two_million_units_sold

Nintendo, Japanese third party and indie games cover a huge variety of art styles and gameplay types. There's no one single thing which binds all those hundreds of games together but makes them seperate from AAA third parties.

Some of the people who buy Borderlands, Assaains Creed, RDR or GTA on Switch could very well also buy Monster Hunter, Zelda TOTK, Dragon's Dogma, ect.

I don't think the people who buy Western AAA games ONLY buy those sorts of games. They'll buy Nintendo and Japanese third party games too.

I'd be quite surprised if the majority of people who buy Hogwarts Legacy and Mortal Kombat One on Switch have never bought a game from a Japanese publisher

 

[MrA]

It's not only the art style and I don't know what exactly is but Nintendo and in general japanese and indie games look and feel different from western AAA games. Even From software games that use wester inspired art style play and feel too disconnected from western gaming style.

The audience you attract to your platform will prefer the games like the ones they came from, like you're not making a pop-rock band open a black metal concert because the audience there won't like it. Some would, btw, but still not the most of them.

I only used Wii U as an example because it sold badly, btw, yet some specific type of games sold way better than on PS/Xbox because of their audience differences. Here's an example:


https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2018/04/shovel_knight_just_crossed_two_million_units_sold

Or maybe playstation and Xbox owners will simply shun games over graphics?
We know gta trilogy did second best on switch, likely a multimillion seller, witcher 3 sold a few million on switch (last update a year or 2 ago was nearly 2 million) skyrim must have sold a few million (it is 6 years old, still full price still sold new and actually the best selling version of skyrim right now)
Resident evil revelations sold over a million copies on switch

 

[daclynk]

The jump between PS3 to PS4 was the higher jump in the gaming history to date. PS4 to PS5 or Xbox One to Series X will never come close to that jump.

this will be a big Jump for Nintendo and with DLSS and RT core tech i cant wait to see what Nintendo are cooking up.

 

[Fake]

thiis will be a big Jump for Nintendo and with DLSS and RT core tech i cant wait to see what Nintendo are cooking up.

I don't think so because two things:

- Nintendo Switch 2 will have BC with Nintendo Switch, unlike PS4 with PS3
- Nintendo games are heavily art direction driven in comparison with Playstation/Xbox games

 

[tkscz]

"To dlss, or not to dlss, that's the question".

Most likely DLSS. Hell, Splatoon 3 uses FSR on the current Switch.

 

[amigastar]

If Switch 2 will have PS5 graphics i'm sure gonna buy one.

 

[daclynk]

I don't think so because two things:

- Nintendo Switch 2 will have BC with Nintendo Switch, unlike PS4 with PS3
- Nintendo games are heavily art direction driven in comparison with Playstation/Xbox games

so you dont think it will be a generational leap for Nintendo? Wii to Wii U was a generational leap and was still BC.

 

[tkscz]

Jumping on the power talk, the architecture in the Orin would put it above the PS4 in terms of how modern it's shaders would be considering Orin runs on Ampere. So when they say that FFVIIR looks closer to PS5 than PS4, it simply could mean that it's lighting and shader engines run more natural on it using modern hardware. I don't think it's saying it's going to run things with as much raw power as the PS5 would. So I can see that being the case. Just having supported hardware for shaders is the entire reason the Switch was able to receive as many PS4 ports as it was able to.

 

[Fake]

so you dont think it will be a generational leap for Nintendo? Wii to Wii U was a generational leap and was still BC.

Yeah, look at Mario Kart 8.

Is a Wii U game, a machine less powerful than both PS3 and X360.

At this point Nintendo made very clear that graphic fidelity is not their goal, instead art direction and gameplay.

What they really gonna pursuit will be native resolution, frame rate and MAYBE some sort of AA because they library really suffer from the lack of AA.

If there is or any graphic games on the next Switch, will be probably from the hands of the third parties, not the first party.

 

[Kataploom]

Jumping on the power talk, the architecture in the Orin would put it above the PS4 in terms of how modern it's shaders would be considering Orin runs on Ampere. So when they say that FFVIIR looks closer to PS5 than PS4, it simply could mean that it's lighting and shader engines run more natural on it using modern hardware. I don't think it's saying it's going to run things with as much raw power as the PS5 would. So I can see that being the case. Just having supported hardware for shaders is the entire reason the Switch was able to receive as many PS4 ports as it was able to.

Switch is already modern compared to PS4, it's just less powerful as in lacking brute force, but in terms of feature set it lacks nothing afaik, that's why even on portable mode it punches way above PS360.

It would needs a fast IO system to stand a chance against PS5 and Xbox Series in terms of hardware capabilities though, that's this generation defining paradigm.

 

[daclynk]

Yeah, look at Mario Kart 8.

Is a Wii U game, a machine less powerful than both PS3 and X360.

At this point Nintendo made very clear that graphic fidelity is not their goal, instead art direction and gameplay.

What they really gonna pursuit will be native resolution, frame rate and MAYBE some sort of AA because they library really suffer from the lack of AA.

If there is or any graphic games on the next Switch, will be probably from the hands of the third parties, not the first party.

Want to bet on it.

 

[Astral Dog]

I don't think so because two things:

- Nintendo Switch 2 will have BC with Nintendo Switch, unlike PS4 with PS3
- Nintendo games are heavily art direction driven in comparison with Playstation/Xbox games

Yeah, look at Mario Kart 8.

Is a Wii U game, a machine less powerful than both PS3 and X360.

At this point Nintendo made very clear that graphic fidelity is not their goal, instead art direction and gameplay.

What they really gonna pursuit will be native resolution, frame rate and MAYBE some sort of AA because they library really suffer from the lack of AA.

If there is or any graphic games on the next Switch, will be probably from the hands of the third parties, not the first party.

While i get your point,this is unfair to Nintendo's first party outpout.colorful art or not they normally strive to get the most lavish games while polishing the gameplay

All their consoles have games that push their systems in different ways, GameCube had Metroid Prime and Twilight Princess,Nintendo 64 with Majora's Mask,the Wii had the Metroid games,Super Mario Galaxy and Zelda
Wii U had Xenoblade X,Bayonetta 2(btw looks a lot better than Bayonetta 1)Mario Kart 8 has impressive detail

The Switch has Zelda Totk,Xenoblade 3,Metroid Dread,Super Mario Odyssey,Luigis Mansion 3, Astral Chain etc

The above games simply wouldn't have been possible on 360 its not just about the detail,but particle effects, animation,scope etc

I don't see why Switch 2 wouldn't have impressive looking games as well


Its not that Nintendo doesn't put effort into the visuals, they tailor their games for the hardware and kind of gameplay they want to showcase, since the Wii however, the games end up looking 'outdated' among gamers for obvious reasons

 

[Fake]

While i get your point,this is unfair to Nintendo's first party outpout.colorful art or not they normally strive to get the most lavish games while polishing the gameplay

All their consoles have games that push their systems in different ways, GameCube had Metroid Prime and Twilight Princess,Nintendo 64 with Majora's Mask,the Wii had the Metroid games,Super Mario Galaxy and Zelda
Wii U had Xenoblade X,Bayonetta 2(btw looks a lot better than Bayonetta 1)Mario Kart 8 has impressive detail

The Switch has Zelda Totk,Xenoblade 3,Metroid Dread,Super Mario Odyssey,Luigis Mansion 3, Astral Chain etc

The above games simply wouldn't have been possible on 360 its not just about the detail,but particle effects, animation,scope etc

I don't see why Switch 2 wouldn't have impressive looking games as well


Its not that Nintendo doesn't put effort into the visuals, they tailor their games for the hardware and kind of gameplay they want to showcase, since the Wii however, the games end up looking 'outdated' among gamers for obvious reasons

Not saying that Nintendo will not show impressive visual, just not the photorealistic that Sony did with PS4 games like Driveclub and Microsoft as well with Ryse.
I do agree that things like paticles as you mention will be improve. Physics as well, Zelda games are notorious with Physics demostration.

As I said, graphic fidelity is this point of you have to zoom to see every detail. This is not Nintendo goal.
Is not like Nintendo games will be impressive, they do will be impressive in their only way.

 

[mckmas8808]

I googled the steamdeck and supposedly it is 1.86 TF at $399 which dashes my hope for the switch 2 to be closer to the ps4 pro.

The only thing I can say is that Nintendo will be launching the Switch 2, two years after the release of the Steam Deck. And they'd surely have better whole sale pricing than Valve. But to get to 3TFs, it might cause for the Switch 2 to cost $399.

So 2 TFs seem more likely if they want to stay at $299.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

I think it's going to be $399 for the standard model and $299 for the Lite.

 

[Hudo]

Whatever the fuck this thing ends up being, I can't wait for the next 3D Mario game!

 

[bigdad2007]

If it is the same size and form factor as the switch, a portable PS4 would be amazing. Considering most games up until this current year were made to target PS4 and Xbox one means there is a gigantic pool of games the switch 2 could play.

 

[Bernkastel]

It's funny to think, Series S may been a serious blunder for Microsoft, but a huge favor to Nintendo.

If something like a Series S can be made portable, then it's not a blunder anymore. Steam Deck shows the best tech in a sub 499 USD portable possible with current tech. Steam Deck GPU is only 1.6 TF compared to the 1.8 TF PS4 GPU, ofcourse Steam Deck has other advantages due to using much recent SOCs. But Nintendo is supposed make that thing have a decent battery life unlike Steam Deck. Unless Nintendo and Nvidia hired wizards, we still don't have the tech to make anything as powerful as last gen pro consoles portable at a competitive price with decent battery life.
If it is somehow possible by 2025, then Microsoft will also make the Series S portable.

 

[BlackTron]

If something like a Series S can be made portable, then it's not a blunder anymore. Steam Deck shows the best tech in a sub 499 USD portable possible with current tech. Steam Deck GPU is only 1.6 TF compared to the 1.8 TF PS4 GPU, ofcourse Steam Deck has other advantages due to using much recent SOCs. But Nintendo is supposed make that thing have a decent battery life unlike Steam Deck. Unless Nintendo and Nvidia hired wizards, we still don't have the tech to make anything as powerful as last gen pro consoles portable at a competitive price with decent battery life.
If it is somehow possible by 2025, then Microsoft will also make the Series S portable.

You should read the other comments after the post you quoted -I never said nor believe that Switch 2 will be a portable Xbox Series S.

But Series S will likely be responsible for putting a shit ton of "this generation" games within ample firing range of Switch 2.

 

[Investor9872]

Nintendo will always prioritize battery life over performance for their handheld consoles! I think Nintendo's next console will be less than 2 TFLOPS. The Switch is less than 0.4 TFLOPS when docked.

 

[Interfectum]

Nintendo will always prioritize battery life over performance for their handheld consoles! I think Nintendo's next console will be less than 2 TFLOPS. The Switch is less than 0.4 TFLOPS when docked.

My hope is this time Nintendo utilizes the docking hardware to push Switch 2 hard when docked. Whether that be resolution, DLSS, RTX, whatever.

 

[BlackTron]

Nintendo will always prioritize battery life over performance for their handheld consoles! I think Nintendo's next console will be less than 2 TFLOPS. The Switch is less than 0.4 TFLOPS when docked.

The Series X and PS5 are over 10 TFLOPS. But because of Series S, a big number of "next gen only" games have to run on a 4 TFLOP machine.

Having made those games with this scalability and limitation in mind already will make them better suited for Switch 2 ports.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

As by far the biggest console publisher in the world, Nintendo is always going to have the biggest share.

Third party games that don't have realistic art styles (such as Sonic, Dragon Ball Z Minecraft, Borderlands or Dragon Quest) can certainly do well.

But third party games that do have realistic art styles (such as RDR, GTA, Monster Hunter, Dark Souls or Resident Evil) can also do well.

It makes no sense not to bring a game to Switch because of its art style.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Yeah, look at Mario Kart 8.

Is a Wii U game, a machine less powerful than both PS3 and X360.

Don't agree with the latter.

 

[Woopah]

Which part do you disagree with?

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Which part do you disagree with?

The part you said that's wrong.

 

[Woopah]

The part you said that's wrong.

Well what I said was pretty well evidenced. So you tell me which part you need evidence for, and I'll provide it. Fair deal?

 

[JimboJones]

The only thing I can say is that Nintendo will be launching the Switch 2, two years after the release of the Steam Deck. And they'd surely have better whole sale pricing than Valve. But to get to 3TFs, it might cause for the Switch 2 to cost $399.

So 2 TFs seem more likely if they want to stay at $299.

Switch 2 developers are also (hopefully in most cases) going to optimize for whatever hardware nvidia/Nintendo come up with so even if the rawpower may not be there it should hopefully punch above it's weight, steamdeck at the end of the day is PC games going through a compatibility layer.

 

[blacktout]

Well what I said was pretty well evidenced. So you tell me which part you need evidence for, and I'll provide it. Fair deal?

Don't expect him to respond. He's one of the most obnoxious bad-faith posters on this site, just endless motivated thinking and console warring.

 

[Woopah]

Don't expect him to respond. He's one of the most obnoxious bad-faith posters on this site, just endless motivated thinking and console warring.

That's very disappointing. I expect people to act in a decent way and engage in discussion. But maybe I've overestimated him.

 

[BlackTron]

Well what I said was pretty well evidenced. So you tell me which part you need evidence for, and I'll provide it. Fair deal?

You know what part he disagreed with, Switch being less powerful than PS360; he specified it when he said "the latter". You just want to drag it on with endless shit posting instead of getting to a point that you can't make.

I have to assume that you don't even own or use a Switch because if you did, you would know that that's nonsense. Having owned all systems in the conversation, Wii U was a step up from 360, playing some of the same games with extra breathing room, bells and whistles. For example, 360 ran Batman Arkham City at 30FPS, while WiiU got around 35, while also running a parallel video feed to the Gamepad at the same time. Meanwhile, the Switch has demonstrated it can do everything the WiiU does with extra headroom countless times, in a small package, thanks to newer tech/architecture (Nvidia).

Edit: Don't be fooled into thinking Woopah is so disingenuous, I confused myself into thinking Fake 's comments were his.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Is this accurate, in terms of power ranking or tech capability in the console space?

360 - PS3 - Wii U - Switch - Xbox One - PS4 - PS4 Pro - Xbox One X - Xbox Series S - Xbox Series X / PS5 - Pro Consoles - Next Gen

Maybe the Switch 2 sits somewhere between the PS4 and PS4 Pro, but utilises DLSS and other new techniques to deliver a few current gen games at much lower resolution/framerate/graphics.

 

[BlackTron]

Is this accurate, in terms of power ranking or tech capability in the console space?

360 - PS3 - Switch - Xbox One - PS4 - PS4 Pro - Xbox One X - Xbox Series S - Xbox Series X / PS5 - Pro Consoles - Next Gen

Maybe the Switch 2 sits somewhere between the PS4 and PS4 Pro, but utilises DLSS and other new techniques to deliver a few current gen games at much lower resolution/framerate/graphics.

That looks very accurate to me, even though the One X and Series S trade blows on specs (yeah I know, lol)

 

[Woopah]

You know what part he disagreed with, Switch being less powerful than PS360; he specified it when he said "the latter". You just want to drag it on with endless shit posting instead of getting to a point that you can't make.

I have to assume that you don't even own or use a Switch because if you did, you would know that that's nonsense. Having owned all systems in the conversation, Wii U was a step up from 360, playing some of the same games with extra breathing room, bells and whistles. For example, 360 ran Batman Arkham City at 30FPS, while WiiU got around 35, while also running a parallel video feed to the Gamepad at the same time. Meanwhile, the Switch has demonstrated it can do everything the WiiU does with extra headroom countless times, in a small package, thanks to newer tech/architecture (Nvidia).

I think you're mixing things up and have quoted the wrong person. I never said the Switch was less powerful than the PS360. Fake said the Wii U was less powerful and Soulzbone said "the latter" to them.

Southbourne said I said something wrong about Switch software sales . And now I'm waiting to find out which part.

 

[BlackTron]

I think you're mixing things up and have quoted the wrong person. I never said the Switch was less powerful than the PS360. Fake said the Wii U was less powerful and Soulzbone said "the latter" to them.

Southbourne said I said something wrong about Switch software sales . And now I'm waiting to find out which part.

You're right, the flow of messages had me off-track, but it should have been directed at Fake (a surprisingly fitting user name)

 

[Woopah]

You're right, the flow of messages had me off-track, but it should have been directed at Fake (a surprisingly fitting user name)

No worries

 

[asdasdasdbb]

BTW, what I think happened is that the Switch Pro got derailed because of Crypto took all the capacity at the time of the Switch OLED's release. Nintendo got mad of course, and even flirted with some other ARM based CPU makers. But ultimately came back.

Someone in one of the threads mentioned Thor (the Ada Tegra). Not happening. For one the Automotive version isn't going to be released until 2025. Still think it's T239 but there's the possibility it's on a better Samsung node.

 

[Unknown?]

Switch got away with drought by porting Wii U games to it. Will they be able to be consistent with more time consuming games and no backlog to port over?

 

[asdasdasdbb]

Switch got away with drought by porting Wii U games to it. Will they be able to be consistent with more time consuming games and no backlog to port over?

100% you will be able to play Switch 1 games on it Day 1. Whether you will have to pay again remains to be seen.

 

[lestar]

Switch got away with drought by porting Wii U games to it. Will they be able to be consistent with more time consuming games and no backlog to port over?

Switch 2 will be busy getting 4K ports/patches of switch games and ps4 ports

 

[Beechos]

How much data storage does everyone expect the switch 2 to have? If this thing is supposed to run games equivalent to xbox and ps4 games especially aaa ones that can be 50gb plus, would card prices go up too since they would need more storage space, the price of storage cards scale a lot different than mult blu ray discs.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

How much data storage does everyone expect the switch 2 to have? If this thing is supposed to run games equivalent to xbox and ps4 games especially aaa ones that can be 50gb plus, would card prices go up too since they would need more storage space, the price of storage cards scale a lot different than mult blu ray discs.

512 GB (plus the SD card slot). As for carts I wouldn't be surprised if most games get the Jedi Survivor treatment where you have to download the rest of the game.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

I expect ssd like tech for the game media and maybe a ssd like I/O internally like PS5(likely not as robust)
So the games won't be cheap...

 

[YOU PC BRO?!]

Switch 2 should punch above its weight. It won’t be anywhere close to ps5 levels of raw performance but that doesn’t mean it can’t perform the same.

DLSS along with frame generation (if supported) would get Switch 2 closer to PS5 performance than people would expect (if not fidelity). That’s of course assuming no FSR on the PlayStation side.

Think about it. Switch 2 docked, running at 1080p 30fps. DLSS 3.5 upscale to 4K. Frame generation up to 60 fps. It’s a whole new world baby!!!

*I’m not being entirely serious before someone comes at me…

 

[daclynk]

360 - PS3 - WIIU- Switch - Xbox One - PS4 - PS4 Pro - Xbox One X - Xbox Series S - Xbox Series X / PS5 - Pro Consoles - Next Gen

Fixed.
i still cant believe people think WiiU wasnt powerful done the PS360.

 

[KingT731]

Fixed.
i still cant believe people think WiiU wasnt powerful done the PS360.

I would surmise that it's because a lot of the uplift came from modernization rather than flat out power and that is mostly the same with the Wii U -> Switch

 

[skyfall]

They have to make it more powerfull because they are trying to get full third party support

 

[Woopah]

Switch got away with drought by porting Wii U games to it. Will they be able to be consistent with more time consuming games and no backlog to port over?

They only needed to rely on Wii U ports in the first 2 years of Switch while they were still combining their development pipelines into one device.

They haven't needed them for the other 5 years of Switch, so shouldn't need them for Switch 2 (we'll still get remakes and remasters though).

 

[Kataploom]

I would surmise that it's because a lot of the uplift came from modernization rather than flat out power and that is mostly the same with the Wii U -> Switch

Even then, GPU was way better due to efficiency and more modern feature set alone and RAM was just enormous in comparison, I don't think Nintendo could do Zelda BOTW if it wasn't for the RAM.

For that sole reason, not even counting PBR, deferred rendering and real time global illumination which were posible but at way higher cost in PS360 and I don't believe all at once even in linear cinematic games, the RAM requirements is what would make Zelda BOTW impossible in 7th gen machines... And the differences in RAM is so big (PS3: 256MB + 256MB, X360: 512MB, Wii U: 2GB) that "making it fit" wouldn't work without redesigning the whole game.

And Wii U also had a 32 MB of eDRAM so yeah, games made for it were way beyond the possibilities of those other consoles.