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PS5 Pro will be a glimpse into the future of gaming hardware much like PS4 Pro was

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onQ123

Member
PS4 Pro brought in the era where the native resolution was no longer important & a look where GPU hardware was heading with Rapid Packed Math .

Many of you laughed when I warned that you shouldn't just look at the FLOPs number because things were changing now look where we are "Dual Issue Compute"

So what should we expect from the future of gaming hardware based on PS5 Pro?

PS5 Pro will be the 1st console where the compute pipeline far exceeds the normal rendering pipeline so we are really close to the point where Ray-Tracing & other compute rendering techniques will be the best choice when making games over the traditional rendering pipeline.
 
adamsapple

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Another O onQ123 post / thread about how 'i told you all I was right'.

Stop It Oh Hush GIF by RØDE Microphones
 
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Ozriel

M$FT
onQ123 said:
Many of you laughed when I warned that you shouldn't just look at the FLOPs number because things were changing now look where we are "Dual Issue Compute"
Click to expand...

Seems they were right to laugh, since you’re unable to show how the PS4 Pro was a ‘glimpse into the future’.
Was there anything the PS4 Pro introduced that made a big splash in Cerny’s famous PS5 hardware introduction?

onQ123 said:
PS5 Pro will be the 1st console where the compute pipeline far exceeds the normal rendering pipeline so we are really close to the point where Ray-Tracing & other compute rendering techniques will be the best choice when making games over the traditional rendering pipeline.
Click to expand...

Why wouldn’t this just be Nvidia’s GPUs that are actually leading the way vs AMD’s stuff?
 
Skifi28

Skifi28

Member
Ozriel said:
Seems they were right to laugh, since you’re unable to show how the PS4 Pro was a ‘glimpse into the future’.
Was there anything the PS4 Pro introduced that made a big splash in Cerny’s famous PS5 hardware introduction?
Click to expand...
The PS4 pro was the start of the image reconstruction race. While not AI, checkerboarding was a very interesting solution at the time for achieving perceived 4k with much lower GPU grunt. While it was laughed out of the room by PC folk at the time as "faux k", it's interesting to see the turn the industry has taken since then. To the point almost nobody uses native resolutions if they can. I always felt it was unfortunate that they didn't evolve the technique for the PS5 and we instead have to rely on FSR2 which often leads to much poorer image quality, especially in motion.

In a way, it really was a glimpse into the future. Hardware constraints often lead to innovative solutions.
 
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shamoomoo

Member
TheRedRiders said:
Let's give credit to Nvidia here, they've been pioneering a lot of the advanced graphics technologies we're seeing in the graphics space. This is especially true for things like AI and ray-tracing.

AMD and Sony have just been trailing behind them, as usual.
Click to expand...
No. Ray tracing and path tracing was a thing before Nvidia. Also,it seems AI/ML can be used for more than imagine clarity, with the 4th generations of AI hardware,the only usage was with reducing pixels noise.
 
Hero_Select

Hero_Select

Member
But the PS4 pro wasn't a glimpse into the future.. I bought it day one and it's always been a purchase I regretted.

Weird post.

Edit: spelling
 
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DaGwaphics

DaGwaphics

Member
I have no idea about the PS5 Pro, but the 4 Pro didn't bring much forward. It kept all the technology from the base PS4 and upped the compute. No major changes to memory, CPU or storage. If checkerboard rendering is the thing they showed off early, I'm not sure that bodes well for the PS5 Pro. LOL

If anything, the mid-gens just muddied the water and reduced the "upgrade" we felt from the new gen. Though we are probably marching to an incremental upgrade future anyway.
 
Clear

Clear

CliffyB's Cock Holster
Cerny's not reinventing the wheel, but Sony under him have been making very smart choices technology-wise.

Hardware assistance for checker-boarding in PS4Pro was smart, the I/O block on the PS5 APU is still a brilliant innovation, so I wouldn't discount how effective the 5 Pro's bespoke tech is likely to be.
 
diffusionx

diffusionx

Gold Member
PS4 Pro proved that you could get great image quality without having to go to native resolution. It also, weirdly, outperformed the One X more often than it should have. OP is right in that we are living in that world where even high-end PC users with $1600 GPUs are fine playing games at sub-native resolution (while NeoGAF posters bitch about sub-native console games when DF videos come out).

Still not convinced by the PS5 Pro, though. I'll probably get one unless the price is totally insane, but it seems kind of pointless. This time around though it seems like Sony is more following the trends (on PC) instead of trying something new.
 
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onQ123

Member
Hero_Select said:
But the PS4 pro wasn't a glimpse I to the future.. I bought it day one and it's always been a purchase I regretted.

Weird post.
Click to expand...

PS4 Pro was the sacrificial lamb so we could move on from chasing native resolution & this generation got to enjoy 60 - 120fps because of it.
 
Gaiff

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
onQ123 said:
PS4 Pro was the sacrificial lamb so we could move on from chasing native resolution & this generation got to enjoy 60 - 120fps because of it.
Click to expand...
DLSS and FSR have a lot more to do with that than checkerboard rendering.
 
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DaGwaphics

DaGwaphics

Member
Caffeine said:
just better image quality thats about it.
Click to expand...


We just have to wait for them to show us what the differences are. It is getting harder and harder to make a huge impact. Even if you take a 6700XT and a 7900XTX and run the same game at the same framerate, the cutbacks needed on the 6700 aren't going to be as noticeable without direct comparisons as you think. That's true even of a 4090 and full path tracing, yes the lighting will look better but without direct comparisons it isn't as groundbreaking as the 4090 crowd would have you believe either.

I wish developers would spend more time on new mechanics, or the large lived in worlds this generation was supposed to bring, etc.

With that said the image quality on some of the 60fps modes has been atrocious, the PS5 Pros GPU upgrade alone would have to help with that.
 
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Negotiator101

Negotiator101

Member
HeisenbergFX4 said:
Yes it does on paper
Click to expand...
No it doesn't.

Digital Foundry
PS5 Pro only has limited clock speed increases (or actual decreases potentially) and the size of the GPU architecturally has not doubled in the way it did with PS4 Pro.


In PlayStation 4 Pro, the CPU gained a 33 percent increase in CPU power (PS5 Pro 10%) with no impact to GPU performance at all - the kind of gain you would expect from a new silicon process node. The fact that the PS5 Pro is compromised in comparison does seem to suggest that Sony is doing the best it can with a 6nm process.
 
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Fafalada

Fafracer forever
TheRedRiders said:
Let's give credit to Nvidia here, they've been pioneering a lot of the advanced graphics technologies we're seeing in the graphics space. This is especially true for things like AI and ray-tracing.
Click to expand...
I think AI merits a point, as NVidia was at the forefront of image-processing with AI stuff for over a decade now, and its realtime use just didn't exist before they brought it to the table.
But RT has been hot topic of graphics research for 3 decades before NVidia even existed as an entity, and NVidia didn't even bring in the first consumer-product accelerator to the market (like with PhysX - there were others that 'pioneered' that part).

Flipside is that there's something to be said for making mainstream products out of these things - NVidia really struggled with RT adoption until new consoles came out, so it's not like these companies are just competitors - market evolves faster thanks to all of their contributions, and relying on any one of them alone - has historically always led to stagnation or abandoned tech-trees. NVidia's own backyard has a fair few of those too.

And Pro again plays a part here - setting a new baseline for AI acceleration will lead to more adoption, and hopefully - we can finally move beyond pure cosmetic uses we've been limited to so far.
 
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onQ123

Member
Fafalada said:
I think AI merits a point, as NVidia was at the forefront of image-processing with AI stuff for over a decade now, and its realtime use just didn't exist before they brought it to the table.
But RT has been hot topic of graphics research for 3 decades before NVidia even existed as an entity, and NVidia didn't even bring in the first consumer-product accelerator to the market (like with PhysX - there were others that 'pioneered' that part).

Flipside is that there's something to be said for making mainstream products out of these things - NVidia really struggled with RT adoption until new consoles came out, so it's not like these companies are just competitors - market evolves faster thanks to all of their contributions, and relying on any one of them alone - has historically always led to stagnation or abandoned tech-trees. NVidia's own backyard has a fair few of those too.

And Pro again plays a part here - setting a new baseline for AI acceleration will lead to more adoption, and hopefully - we can finally move beyond pure cosmetic uses we've been limited to so far.
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Exactly & once ML is in the standard consoles devs will figure out things like you can turn 2D to 3D using ML & it will change game development forever.

I actually miss the days when devs would fake 3D on weak hardware & always imagine what those devs could do on the hardware we have now . Nowadays devs don't want to come up with stuff like that on their own so AI will be a good substitute for the old minds.
 
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SplunkyMunkey

Member
Negotiator101 said:
No it doesn't.

Digital Foundry
PS5 Pro only has limited clock speed increases (or actual decreases potentially) and the size of the GPU architecturally has not doubled in the way it did with PS4 Pro.


In PlayStation 4 Pro, the CPU gained a 33 percent increase in CPU power (PS5 Pro 10%) with no impact to GPU performance at all - the kind of gain you would expect from a new silicon process node. The fact that the PS5 Pro is compromised in comparison does seem to suggest that Sony is doing the best it can with a 6nm process.
Click to expand...
Maybe but with the design of the ps5 in mind ps5 pro probably achieve of using its 33tf of power.

I can still see good results coming ps5 pro. I can remember when they announced the tflops of ps5 and people where stating the specs were less impressive then series x and look how it turned out.
 
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onQ123

Member
diffusionx said:
PS4 Pro proved that you could get great image quality without having to go to native resolution. It also, weirdly, outperformed the One X more often than it should have. OP is right in that we are living in that world where even high-end PC users with $1600 GPUs are fine playing games at sub-native resolution (while NeoGAF posters bitch about sub-native console games when DF videos come out).

Still not convinced by the PS5 Pro, though. I'll probably get one unless the price is totally insane, but it seems kind of pointless. This time around though it seems like Sony is more following the trends (on PC) instead of trying something new.
Click to expand...
PS5 Pro will more than likely have a bigger visual difference than PS4 Pro did.

Adding Ray-Tracing to games that didn't have it before will be easier to see than the resolution bump PS4 games received.
 
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