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[Aaron Olive]

Seems they were right to laugh, since you’re unable to show how the PS4 Pro was a ‘glimpse into the future’.
Was there anything the PS4 Pro introduced that made a big splash in Cerny’s famous PS5 hardware introduction?



Why wouldn’t this just be Nvidia’s GPUs that are actually leading the way vs AMD’s stuff?

Checkerboard Rendering duh…

 

[NEbeast]

No it doesn't.

Digital Foundry
PS5 Pro only has limited clock speed increases (or actual decreases potentially) and the size of the GPU architecturally has not doubled in the way it did with PS4 Pro.


In PlayStation 4 Pro, the CPU gained a 33 percent increase in CPU power (PS5 Pro 10%) with no impact to GPU performance at all - the kind of gain you would expect from a new silicon process node. The fact that the PS5 Pro is compromised in comparison does seem to suggest that Sony is doing the best it can with a 6nm process.

You probably thought the series x was going to blow the ps5 out of the water too. Specs aren't everything.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

You probably thought the series x was going to blow the ps5 out of the water too. Specs aren't everything.

Even the brass at Xbox thought this and before DF implied it a few times it was mentioned in certain Discords the only reason it doesn’t is because all games target the PS5 first and Devs don’t take the time to push the Series X hardware

Don’t shoot the messenger

 

[Badlucktroll]

I wonder if it will be labled the “Paystation 5 pro” if its really expensive

 

[SplunkyMunkey]

No, they didn't invent that either..

In theory they did. In my lifetime its always been comparing specs on which is better. This is probably the first console I've seen that 2/3 tf less and can either keep up with same effects or slightly be better

 

[Jibran#one]

Glimpse of the future with 10 percent CPU improvement ?
U want glimpse of the future go 4090 cyberpunk that shit

 

[onQ123]

Even the brass at Xbox thought this and before DF implied it a few times it was mentioned in certain Discords the only reason it doesn’t is because all games target the PS5 first and Devs don’t take the time to push the Series X hardware

Don’t shoot the messenger

I'm teing up the messenger & holding them for ransom


Xbox Series X has the compute advantage ( A bigger one than people realize because of ML stuff) but the hardware also cut some corners where PS5 gained a lot of advantages also.

Yes games can show big advantage on Series X if they are built around Series X but the same thing will happen if a game is built around PS5.

It will always be a toss up unless one way becomes the standard way of creating games .

 

[SHA]

Will it sound like jet engine as well??

A big noisy console, highly unlikely.

 

[nush]

But the PS4 pro wasn't a glimpse I to the future.. I bought it day one and it's always been a purchase I regretted.

Weird post.

You're not alone, I can't tell the difference but that's probably because I used my pro on a new TV and not the one I used my base PS4 on. As least I brought it used, it's white and looks cooler.

 

[Gunstar75]

Yeah but let's be honest the PS4 Pro wasn't that good, and the PS5 Pro looks worse in comparison (at least on paper).

I played Titan Fall 2 for a month on the base PS4 before I got my PS4 Pro. The Pro made a big difference in visual clarity and performance in Titan Fall 2 and it was worth it just in that one game. I turned around and traded my base PS4 in the next week and never looked back.

 

[Gunstar75]

No it doesn't.

Digital Foundry
PS5 Pro only has limited clock speed increases (or actual decreases potentially) and the size of the GPU architecturally has not doubled in the way it did with PS4 Pro.


In PlayStation 4 Pro, the CPU gained a 33 percent increase in CPU power (PS5 Pro 10%) with no impact to GPU performance at all - the kind of gain you would expect from a new silicon process node. The fact that the PS5 Pro is compromised in comparison does seem to suggest that Sony is doing the best it can with a 6nm process.

PS4 Pro didn't have VRR either, so we have a 33% CPU increase with no VRR and a 10% CPU increase with VRR. Probably will be a similar frame rate increase.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Seems they were right to laugh, since you’re unable to show how the PS4 Pro was a ‘glimpse into the future’.
Was there anything the PS4 Pro introduced that made a big splash in Cerny’s famous PS5 hardware introduction?

FP16 and lower-precision compute.

Why wouldn’t this just be Nvidia’s GPUs that are actually leading the way vs AMD’s stuff?

Because Nvidia don't have the in-house devs to make meaningful use of their hardware, and most PC-exclusive 3P don't have the pipelines (budget, studio size, backing, arguably talent) to push those high-end GPUs to their limits, either.

The PC GPUs and related tech have to rely on console-centric game devs & publishers to actually push the tech they make in meaningful ways (related to playing video games).

PS4 pro can do RT and AI upscaling? If my mind is not playing tricks on me, no. But it was sweet playing games at higher native resolution with it.

Technically the SEGA Genesis and SNES can do RT, you don't need specific hardware for that. The CPU could handle all that calculation on its own, in theory.

Just depends on other design targets of the game, obviously.

 

[MR ARCADE FOREVER]

PS4 Pro brought in the era where the native resolution was no longer important & a look where GPU hardware was heading with Rapid Packed Math .

Many of you laughed when I warned that you shouldn't just look at the FLOPs number because things were changing now look where we are "Dual Issue Compute"

So what should we expect from the future of gaming hardware based on PS5 Pro?

PS5 Pro will be the 1st console where the compute pipeline far exceeds the normal rendering pipeline so we are really close to the point where Ray-Tracing & other compute rendering techniques will be the best choice when making games over the traditional rendering pipeline.

Ok, Sony rep

 

[ReBurn]

Ignore the haters onQ. I still believe in you.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

cant see shit. how i wish that post had PSSR

 

[midnightAI]

No it doesn't.

Digital Foundry
PS5 Pro only has limited clock speed increases (or actual decreases potentially) and the size of the GPU architecturally has not doubled in the way it did with PS4 Pro.


In PlayStation 4 Pro, the CPU gained a 33 percent increase in CPU power (PS5 Pro 10%) with no impact to GPU performance at all - the kind of gain you would expect from a new silicon process node. The fact that the PS5 Pro is compromised in comparison does seem to suggest that Sony is doing the best it can with a 6nm process.

Here's a tip for you, in fact I've mentioned it several times before.... Stop listening to DF

 

[Hero_Select]

PS4 Pro was the sacrificial lamb so we could move on from chasing native resolution & this generation got to enjoy 60 - 120fps because of it.

This would have happened anyway.

 

[Deerock71]

 

[semiconscious]

my ps5 pro is awesome! now, if only there were some games to play on it...

 

[Darchaos]

Its time for devs to just go back to a normal cycle with one console. Not this shitscam with one halfdone console and then release the real one in the middle of the cycle. I understand that its a buisness and all but come on.

 

[onQ123]

This would have happened anyway.

Yeah but people was done crying about FauxK when the new consoles arrived

 

[onQ123]

Its time for devs to just go back to a normal cycle with one console. Not this shitscam with one halfdone console and then release the real one in the middle of the cycle. I understand that its a buisness and all but come on.

This BS again? PS4 & Xbox One remained the main console throughout the generation & the same will happen with PS5 & PS5 Pro.

It's going on 11 years now & PS4 is still being pushed.

 

[intbal]

Image reconstruction existed before PS4 Pro.
I don't know what the first such example was, but Killzone Shadow Fall had it in multiplayer.
Rainbow Six Siege and Quantum Break also used different methods of image reconstruction before the Pro was released.

 

[Ozriel]

FP16 and lower-precision compute.

I don’t recall heavy emphasis on them in Cerny’s talk. I could be wrong though…

Because Nvidia don't have the in-house devs to make meaningful use of their hardware, and most PC-exclusive 3P don't have the pipelines (budget, studio size, backing, arguably talent) to push those high-end GPUs to their limits, either.

The PC GPUs and related tech have to rely on console-centric game devs & publishers to actually push the tech they make in meaningful ways (related to playing video games).

If we’re talking about tech that’s the future of gaming, Nvidia’s pushed RT, driven AI powered upscaling with DLSS and now DLSS frame gen.

Hard to argue it’s only about console centric devs when we’re getting games like Cyberpunk with path tracing etc.

 

[shamoomoo]

No it doesn't.

Digital Foundry
PS5 Pro only has limited clock speed increases (or actual decreases potentially) and the size of the GPU architecturally has not doubled in the way it did with PS4 Pro.


In PlayStation 4 Pro, the CPU gained a 33 percent increase in CPU power (PS5 Pro 10%) with no impact to GPU performance at all - the kind of gain you would expect from a new silicon process node. The fact that the PS5 Pro is compromised in comparison does seem to suggest that Sony is doing the best it can with a 6nm process.

What does the GPU need to double in size for a significant upgrade?

 

[onQ123]

Image reconstruction existed before PS4 Pro.
I don't know what the first such example was, but Killzone Shadow Fall had it in multiplayer.
Rainbow Six Siege and Quantum Break also used different methods of image reconstruction before the Pro was released.

Of course you're not going to do stuff in hardware unless it was tested in software 1st.

 

[Negotiator101]

PS4 Pro didn't have VRR either, so we have a 33% CPU increase with no VRR and a 10% CPU increase with VRR. Probably will be a similar frame rate increase.

Yeah possibly, just looked slightly underwhelming on paper but let's wait and see. I bought the PS4 Pro last generation and was satisfied although not blown away and I'll probably get the PS5 Pro as well.

 

[Gaiff]

Technically the SEGA Genesis and SNES can do RT, you don't need specific hardware for that. The CPU could handle all that calculation on its own, in theory.

Without a Z-buffer and reliance on Mode 7 for planar surfaces? I know what you’re saying but let’s not go crazy here. Ray tracing hit the mainstream in the mid-2000s with Cars.

 

[Negotiator101]

Here's a tip for you, in fact I've mentioned it several times before.... Stop listening to DF

Who do you suppose I listen to? You? They know their shit, certainly better than the competition anyway. Either way the numbers are undeniable.

 

[Negotiator101]

What does the GPU need to double in size for a significant upgrade?

It's a comparison, nothing more.

 

[Lysandros]

You probably thought the series x was going to blow the ps5 out of the water too. Specs aren't everything.

The specs in no way indicated that XSX was going to blow away PS5. The specs showed an evenly matched picture. That's the likes of DF and clueless fanboys who chose to embrace a distorted interpretation of them.

 

[analog_future]

What a shortsighted thread. PS5 Pro specs are that of a mid-tier 2024 PC. Nothing to scoff at but you literally could've had an equivalent "vision of the future" 4-5 years ago on the PC side.

 

[blastprocessor]

4060ti to 4070

 

[onQ123]

What a shortsighted thread. PS5 Pro specs are that of a mid-tier 2024 PC. Nothing to scoff at but you literally could've had an equivalent "vision of the future" 4-5 years ago on the PC side.

You will learn one day lol

 

[midnightAI]

Who do you suppose I listen to? You? They know their shit, certainly better than the competition anyway. Either way the numbers are undeniable.

Don't listen to anyone other than a Dev/tech working with the hardware or Sony themselves?

They know about as much as your average gaming enthusiast, they even disagree amongst themselves. They make guesstimates which are quite often proven wrong. Numbers don't tell the whole story (this is why TF numbers alone are useless), I thought everyone learnt that when the Series X and PS5 specs were originally released?

 

[rodrigolfp]

PS4 Pro brought in the era where the native resolution was no longer important

It was still important because checkboard sucks and that is why Nvidia and AMD don't use it. AI upscaling is where it became "not important" anymore.

 

[FireFly]

Many of you laughed when I warned that you shouldn't just look at the FLOPs number because things were changing now look where we are "Dual Issue Compute"

On the PC, Nvidia had been beating the GCN architecture with lower TF parts for years. Not that it makes sense to think you can "invent" the idea that real world performance comparisons depend on more than one metric. It would be like "inventing" the idea that lower clocked CPUs can beat higher clocked ones.

 

[Romulus]

Ps4 pro felt like a baby step.

 

[LordOfChaos]

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

PSSR (PlayStation Spectral Super Resolution Upscaling)

Is the future.

 

[twilo99]

No. Ray tracing and path tracing was a thing before Nvidia. Also,it seems AI/ML can be used for more than imagine clarity, with the 4th generations of AI hardware,the only usage was with reducing pixels noise.

I'm starting to understand what went wrong in the GPU business, at least from a gaming standpoint, and that's the huge bet Nvidia put towards ML/AI, which ultimately made gaming GPUs more expensive, and the features we are getting on the gaming side almost feel like a second thought.. just because they have all this ML hardware in there for neural network workloads, we might as well find some way to use it for gaming.

That was the right call for Nvidia, but their primary product is no longer the gaming GPU... that is now ML/data center hardware, and eventually I fear that the gaming side will just be getting the leftover from whatever they are doing on the ML front.

Hopefully I'm wrong.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Image reconstruction existed before PS4 Pro.
I don't know what the first such example was, but Killzone Shadow Fall had it in multiplayer.
Rainbow Six Siege and Quantum Break also used different methods of image reconstruction before the Pro was released.

Some PS360 gen games had it too like MGS4.

 

[Gaiff]

No. Ray tracing and path tracing was a thing before Nvidia.

In video games? Don’t think so.

 

[Physiognomonics]

First AI upscaling on consoles. All games forward will use AI upscaling by default on all future console games (well PS5 Pro) and this will be the first thing to be compared between future comparisons (well when Xbox will get its own AI upscaling in a few years, LOL).

And much needed improvements in RT effects in number and quality applied on console games.

Overall this will be a much bigger improvement than bare CBR 1800p or 1440p from 1080p we got on PS4 Pro.

No it doesn't.

Digital Foundry
PS5 Pro only has limited clock speed increases (or actual decreases potentially) and the size of the GPU architecturally has not doubled in the way it did with PS4 Pro.


In PlayStation 4 Pro, the CPU gained a 33 percent increase in CPU power (PS5 Pro 10%) with no impact to GPU performance at all - the kind of gain you would expect from a new silicon process node. The fact that the PS5 Pro is compromised in comparison does seem to suggest that Sony is doing the best it can with a 6nm process.

Seems we found Mr Leadbetter Gaf account.

 

[lmimmfn]

Erm the PC does exist outside of OPs bubble and has always determined where gaming is going/advancement of tech.

 

[DAHGAMING]

Bluds gunna be disapointed in a few months.

 

[Topher]

Biggest mistake in gaming is overhyping shit.......especially hardware.

 

[onQ123]

Bluds gunna be disapointed in a few months.

Disappointed for what? My thread has nothing to do with how powerful a console is .

 

[onQ123]

Biggest mistake in gaming is overhyping shit.......especially hardware.

What am I overhyping?

The normal rendering pipeline of this console isn't much higher than PS5 & Xbox Series X

It's enough to take the base resolution & FPS up a little if making games in a traditional way but the Ray-Tracing & Upscaling using all that leftover Compute will make a big difference.

 

[DAHGAMING]

Disappointed for what? My thread has nothing to do with how powerful a console is .

DIsapointed when its released and it turns out Series X is the still the most powerfull alpha console out there and will only be beaten by the next Xbo dream machine .