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[MasterCornholio]

Hopefully it performs even better now. I hope we don't have to wait long for the comparisons.

 

[Fredrik]

That is easy to fix... just downgrade the PS5 version... probably what happened with this new patch
That is why a performance analysis is needed again.

New patches are coming all the time. A new analysis after each patch on each game and each platform, to spot differences we’re usually unable to notice ourselves, seems like an awful lot of work... And for nothing if you ask me.

Honestly, don’t worry, if there is a downgrade we’ll hear about it or it won’t be big enough to matter anyway. And you can always start the game and take a peek yourself.

 

[STARSBarry]

So the question I have is... does the Xbox Series X version run better than a 3 grand PC? because if not... why would anyone care about that version of a game when all there games are on PC now, its why the Xbox One was my first console I ever traded in once I realised there would literally be no true exclusives on Microsoft anymore.

 

[dlbeast]

As everyone focuses on tit for tat, i just wonder is everyone enjoying the game?

 

[Bernd Lauert]

As everyone focuses on tit for tat, i just wonder is everyone enjoying the game?

Waiting for deep sale/Gamepass tbh.

 

[Halo is Back]

We can all do better

This is Neogaf during a new console generation.........you are being too optimistic

 

[Valued Gamer]

OP is a Vietnamese soldier still fighting deep in the jungles in 1997.

Vietnam won the war.

 

[Valued Gamer]

So many times this gen people have jumped on things and got burned.
Be it that PS5 didnt have hardware accelerated Ray Tracing, or PS5 was RDNA 1, or that Sony believed in generations, or that MS had no games (they buy Zenimax), or that the PS5 would only have 100 BC titles, or that PS5 was 13.x tflops cos Klee etc etc etc.

If this generation has taught anyone anything, its that you should hold your horses before running with something as a fact.

 

[SlimySnake]

btw the ps5 version of this game is broken in image quality mode. it chugs like crazy now.

 

[DarkMage619]

btw the ps5 version of this game is broken in image quality mode. it chugs like crazy now.

I wonder if anyone will be posting any DJ Khaled images over it.

 

[oldergamer]

Yup, people were jumping to conclusions. Called this.

 

[Fredrik]

So the question I have is... does the Xbox Series X version run better than a 3 grand PC? because if not... why would anyone care about that version of a game when all there games are on PC now, its why the Xbox One was my first console I ever traded in once I realised there would literally be no true exclusives on Microsoft anymore.

Is the $500 box running games better than the $3000 box?
No of course not, unless the PC version is badly optimized, probably not even then.

OPINION: Generally speaking you always go with the PC version on sim racing games unless there is a specific reason why that won’t work. Better performance and visuals, more options, triple screen setups or super ultra wide screens, it can make a night and day difference. You really can’t go back to play serious racers on consoles and a TV several meters away after trying it, imo.

Dirt 5 is very arcadey though and plays great on console.

As for Xbox and PC they can make a nice combo if you want some couch gaming occasionally and play a lot with the family, with MS exclusives you always get licenses for both platforms and with save sync you can alternate easily depending on which setup you prefer for the game you play. It’s nice. Backwards-compatibility on Xbox is nice too, but you’ve probably heard that before.

In my household PC and Xbox aren’t competing against each other like you often hear on the net, except for sim racing as I mentioned, and first person games because mouse control is better. I certainly play more on PC at the moment but for some games Xbox absolutely suits me better. My #2 GOTY Ori and the Will of the Wisps is played on Xbox. AC Valhalla is played on Xbox.

And Dirt 5 is played on Xbox. Solid arcade rally racer, fast, smooth, controls well, lots of track variety, fun with the family, it’s no Sega Raliy but it’s fun, reminds me a lot of Rallisport Challenge. 8/10

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I don't know about you guys, but I think this new gen has the most patches ever.

How many patches has Dirt 5 and 2077 already had?

 

[Fredrik]

I don't know about you guys, but I think this new gen has the most patches ever.

How many patches has Dirt 5 and 2077 already had?

Probably like 5 or so. And more will come. That’s why I said that a new DF analysis after each patch on each game and each platform, to spot differences we’re usually unable to even notice ourselves, seems like an awful lot of work for nothing. I think people need to stop trying to find a gap this gen, it’s getting ridiculous, it’s likely never going to be a noticeable one. I think once the big bugs are squished they’ll look the same unless we run the games though some software.

 

[jroc74]

Reading the title and some of the replies, the exact same thing can be applied to the variable clocks of the PS5....

 

[DForce]

Where was that said in the OP? Where was it even implied? What were any outlandish claims made about BC titles?

Quick answer tho is no, that isn't OK either. But I have no idea what you are referring to as outlandish claim.

Many BC games were loading faster on the Xbox Series X and here some of your posts.

This is kind of the amazing part; suddenly it's Sony's SSD I/O that needs all of this work explicitly programmed against it to harness, when that flies in the face of the ease-of-use we've seen some developers state. Granted, those devs could've just been saying that from their own definition of "easy-to-use", but I digress.

And now MS's approach is the one that works automatically with no work involved. Suddenly needing to put in more work to get results is a strength again. It's amazing, these dance moves are amazing xD.

Spoiler

I'm just having a bit of fun at the expense of some folks, for sure. How hard is it to just say both systems will have really, really good SSD solutions that are ultimately to the benefit of third-parties across the board?

That doesn't matter too much; look at the chart Longdi posted above and apparently PS4 Pro has faster cold boot time than both PS5 and Series X, but PS4 Pro wasn't designed with SSDs in mind.

BC games (and all games in general), even if they aren't programmed explicitly to the full capabilities of a system's I/O design, they still have the raw hardware to leverage. People need to keep in mind the BC games being tested here by and large aren't even leveraging most of MS's XvA features; it's unknown if they are leveraging Sony's raw or not. I'd assume they aren't programmed against most of Sony's featureset.

At the very least we can already get a glimpse of how these solutions will perform in practice and it turns out it's not going to be the clear-out blow-out in favor of PS5 a lot of people were repeatedly saying, because there's still other parts of the system architecture that have to work with the data coming off the SSDs. I think once both are getting pushed to their limits, Sony's solution will maintain a lead in terms of I/O, but the real-world margin between them and MS on this note is going to be a lot smaller than people have been conditioned to think it'd be going simply off some of the (few) specs on the I/O we got on paper early in the year.

Lets not pretend you were drawing conclusions based off of early comparison results of BC games.

 

[Knitted Knight]

Many BC games were loading faster on the Xbox Series X and here some of your posts.






Lets not pretend you were drawing conclusions based off of early comparison results of BC games.

Where was Gondor when BC performance was discussed? Where was Gondor when performance delta was used as a hammer? Where was Go.....

The self awareness of this thread is quite amusing. The urge to even create it and frame it in such a way.

 

[Raekwon26]

This thread is complete BS.

 

[Strider Highwind]

As everyone focuses on tit for tat, i just wonder is everyone enjoying the game?

I was asking this question back when all the noise was going on....like.....okay but are people in these threads playing Dirt 5?!

I think both consoles are gonna be fine and i feel like these little fights over launch titles that won't hold a candle to what the hardware is doing 2 years from now, or 5 years from now are laughable.

You would think these guys played Knack, Ryse, or COD Ghosts at the beginning of last gen and stopped there. Nobody expected those games to define shxt

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Many BC games were loading faster on the Xbox Series X and here some of your posts.

Lets not pretend you were drawing conclusions based off of early comparison results of BC games.

And let's not pretend when Cerny boasted PS5 SSD speeds in March 2020 which were probably highest in all of gaming (I'm not sure if any PC SSDs at the time were faster than 5.5 gb/s, but if there were there couldn't have been many PC drives faster), the blanket assumption was that games on PS5 were going to load faster than Series X since PS5's SSD is more than double Series X's speed. Then you had all that Kraken stuff about 22 gb/s.

There wasn't enough information at the time to know exactly how that 5.5gb/s speed was going to transition to BC speeds, nor how Series X BC performance exactly was either. If anything, gamers were expecting PS5 BC to be fast as some Sony employee showed PS4 Spiderman loading on a PS5 and it loaded it in a second. So gamers expect BC loading to be fast too.

Turns out Series X loads games faster than PS5 most of the time for BC/cross plat games. And there's no 1 second load times. Games load faster than last gen consoles but can still be in the 10, 20 or 30 second range for both systems.

And only recently have gamers been educated enough that it has to the way both systems treat BC/cross plat kinds of games, where One X is more powerful than Pro so it seems to come to that.

 

[dlbeast]

I was asking this question back when all the noise was going on....like.....okay but are people in these threads playing Dirt 5?!

I think both consoles are gonna be fine and i feel like these little fights over launch titles that won't hold a candle to what the hardware is doing 2 years from now, or 5 years from now are laughable.

You would think these guys played Knack, Ryse, or COD Ghosts at the beginning of last gen and stopped there. Nobody expected those games to define shxt

Well done sir.

 

[Shmunter]

Word of caution to the champagne poppers. Put the cork back in till resolution and performance is compared....just incase.

 

[Clarissa]

OP trying to act all noble now when he has indulged in console warring and FUD about the ps5 lol.

Stop putting on an act already for fuck's sake.

 

[DForce]

And let's not pretend when Cerny boasted PS5 SSD speeds in March 2020 which were probably highest in all of gaming (I'm not sure if any PC SSDs at the time were faster than 5.5 gb/s, but if there were there couldn't have been many PC drives faster), the blanket assumption was that games on PS5 were going to load faster than Series X since PS5's SSD is more than double Series X's speed. Then you had all that Kraken stuff about 22 gb/s.

There wasn't enough information at the time to know exactly how that 5.5gb/s speed was going to transition to BC speeds, nor how Series X BC performance exactly was either. If anything, gamers were expecting PS5 BC to be fast as some Sony employee showed PS4 Spiderman loading on a PS5 and it loaded it in a second. So gamers expect BC loading to be fast too.

Turns out Series X loads games faster than PS5 most of the time for BC/cross plat games. And there's no 1 second load times. Games load faster than last gen consoles but can still be in the 10, 20 or 30 second range for both systems.

And only recently have gamers been educated enough that it has to the way both systems treat BC/cross plat kinds of games, where One X is more powerful than Pro so it seems to come to that.

You need to go back and watch Mark Cerny's talk because you don't know what you're even talking about.

Mark Cerny

You can see this on PlayStation 4 if I use an SSD with 10 times the speed of a standard hard drive I probably see only double the loading speed if that.

We know this because you can put an SSD on a PS4 and you will only see a small increase over a standard HDD when it comes to loading.




If you were actually paying attention to Mark Cerny's talk, his talk about SSD had a lot to do with data streaming, memory management and game design - loading into games instantly was only part of the talk.

Only games that truly load faster on XsX are mostly BC games with a few next gen titles that are still not leveraging the true SSD speeds. Fact is, he drew conclusions based on BC

 

[Marlenus]

If I built 2 PCs and one was close to PS5 specs and the other close to Series X specs the PC close to Series X specs would give a higher framerate.

Given the raw hardware for Series X has a higjer performance ceiling than PS5 when it comes to framerate the obvious conclusion as to why multiplats work better on PS5 is software.

 

[FranXico]

If I built 2 PCs and one was close to PS5 specs and the other close to Series X specs the PC close to Series X specs would give a higher framerate.

Given the raw hardware for Series X has a higjer performance ceiling than PS5 when it comes to framerate the obvious conclusion as to why multiplats work better on PS5 is software.

But they are different architectures. They may be based on RDNA2, but are both custom. Especially the PS5. Your "similarly specced PCs" would not be as similar as you believe. There's more to performance than the teraflops number.

 

[Sebsal1874]

The multiplayer is terrible. For a racing game, this is the biggest disappointment

 

[MilkyJoe]

So the question I have is... does the Xbox Series X version run better than a 3 grand PC? because if not... why would anyone care about that version of a game when all there games are on PC now, its why the Xbox One was my first console I ever traded in once I realised there would literally be no true exclusives on Microsoft anymore.

Do the council deliver 3 grand PCs like they do recycling bins, where you live? If not, you're being a bit of a nob

 

[Vtecomega]

So is this game worth getting? People still playing it or its dead?

 

[ANIMAL1975]

 

[Fredrik]

I was asking this question back when all the noise was going on....like.....okay but are people in these threads playing Dirt 5?!

I think it says a lot when everyone seems to wait on a new analysis to learn if the performance is good or if anything has been downgraded. I mean it’s not that hard to start the game and check.

And if they actually have the game but think it’s too hard to notice any changes or issues without professional help, then why even worry about it? This is like some gaming hypochondria lol

But once everyone have VRR these discussions will fade anyway. I haven’t cared about a variable framerate on PC since I got gsync - I see the number change, 50,70,100, and everything looks smooooth.

 

[Fredrik]

So is this game worth getting? People still playing it or its dead?

Definitely worth getting in my opinion. Copy paste from my post earlier:

”Solid arcade rally racer, fast, smooth, controls well, lots of track variety, fun with the family, it’s no Sega Raliy but it’s fun, reminds me a lot of Rallisport Challenge. 8/10 ”

I should add that I have no idea if it’s dead online though.

 

[Marlenus]

But they are different architectures. They may be based on RDNA2, but are both custom. Especially the PS5. Your "similarly specced PCs" would not be as similar as you believe. There's more to performance than the teraflops number.

Not that much is custom on the GPU / CPU front. Most of the custom work goes into IO stuff like the SSD and compression/decompression. Die size does not indicate that either one has anything especially fancy beyond that like a large L3 cache pool so it is entirely comparable.

Consoles are not made from magic technology that makes using PC parts for performance estimation impossible. So a 10Tflop RDNA2 based pc with a 3.5Ghz 3700X will have lower FPS than a 12 Tflop RDNA2 based system with a 3.6Ghz 3700X even if the 10Tflop machine had a PCIe 4 SSD and the other has a PCIe 3 SSD.

Most of the console longevity across a gen comes from the software stack and it appears that the PS5 software stack is creating more optimised code for the console to run than the Series X software stack.

Once the 6700XT comes out we can compare a highly clocked 40CU part to a low clocked 60CU part to see how they compare but I am not expecting any surprises. If anything RDNA2 seems to scale slightly better with more CUs than clockspeed but there is not much in it as it scales well with both.

 

[Shmunter]

I think it says a lot when everyone seems to wait on a new analysis to learn if the performance is good or if anything has been downgraded. I mean it’s not that hard to start the game and check.

And if they actually have the game but think it’s too hard to notice any changes or issues without professional help, then why even worry about it? This is like some gaming hypochondria lol

But once everyone have VRR these discussions will fade anyway. I haven’t cared about a variable framerate on PC since I got gsync - I see the number change, 50,70,100, and everything looks smooooth.

Just because your Mickey Mouse system can’t pull consisten frames does mean us console guys need to put up with it.

 

[bitbydeath]

I think we should all just be sensible about this and blame craig for the differences found.

 

[Strider Highwind]

I think it says a lot when everyone seems to wait on a new analysis to learn if the performance is good or if anything has been downgraded. I mean it’s not that hard to start the game and check.

And if they actually have the game but think it’s too hard to notice any changes or issues without professional help, then why even worry about it? This is like some gaming hypochondria lol

But once everyone have VRR these discussions will fade anyway. I haven’t cared about a variable framerate on PC since I got gsync - I see the number change, 50,70,100, and everything looks smooooth.

All 100% facts lol

 

[Vtecomega]

Definitely worth getting in my opinion. Copy paste from my post earlier:

”Solid arcade rally racer, fast, smooth, controls well, lots of track variety, fun with the family, it’s no Sega Raliy but it’s fun, reminds me a lot of Rallisport Challenge. 8/10 ”

I should add that I have no idea if it’s dead online though.

Cheers bro. Just bought it

 

[Panajev2001a]

Not that much is custom on the GPU / CPU front. Most of the custom work goes into IO stuff like the SSD and compression/decompression. Die size does not indicate that either one has anything especially fancy beyond that like a large L3 cache pool so it is entirely comparable.

Consoles are not made from magic technology that makes using PC parts for performance estimation impossible. So a 10Tflop RDNA2 based pc with a 3.5Ghz 3700X will have lower FPS than a 12 Tflop RDNA2 based system with a 3.6Ghz 3700X even if the 10Tflop machine had a PCIe 4 SSD and the other has a PCIe 3 SSD.

Most of the console longevity across a gen comes from the software stack and it appears that the PS5 software stack is creating more optimised code for the console to run than the Series X software stack.

Once the 6700XT comes out we can compare a highly clocked 40CU part to a low clocked 60CU part to see how they compare but I am not expecting any surprises. If anything RDNA2 seems to scale slightly better with more CUs than clockspeed but there is not much in it as it scales well with both.

They are not magic but there are items you are not considering like the amount of CU’s per Shader Array (as opposed to adding more shader arrays and shader engines... some resources are allocated per shader engine so they would scale differently in other setups) which so far only peaks in XSX as well, but sure consoles are not PC’s. A console is made of customised HW paired with deeply customised software (OS, compilers, libraries, etc...) and each console has some customisations the other does not and PC’s do not use and that are designed to offload the CPU and GPU: see I/O coprocessors, see cache scrubbers, see geometry engine, etc...

 

[borborygmus]

I don't agree with OP. It was a reasonable conclusion to draw at the time. It turned out wrong and that should be conceded without guilt.

This isn't a UN roundtable, it's a gaming forum. People are going to call it like they see it without worrying too much about being proven wrong later when more info comes out.

It seems people are suckers for that "voice of reason" tone OP used but the actual message is self-important and laughable. "We can all do better" makes it sound like it's such a big deal we should think about holding a benefit concert for the "victims" of the now debunked speculation.

 

[Fredrik]

Just because your Mickey Mouse system can’t pull consisten frames does mean us console guys need to put up with it.

The framerate isn’t magically consistent on console, it’s just capped and you can obviously do that on PC too.
But when you can’t see the fluctuations, why bother? Gsync is magic to frame fluidity, and VRR is to my knowledge the same thing, trust me it’ll be pointless to stare at a frame counter once we all have it.

 

[Shmunter]

The framerate isn’t magically consistent on console, it’s just capped and you can obviously do that on PC too.
But when you can’t see the fluctuations, why bother? Gsync is magic to frame fluidity, and VRR is to my knowledge the same thing, trust me it’ll be pointless to stare at a frame counter once we all have it.

VRR and gysync is a wheelchair for poor performance.

 

[Fredrik]

VRR and gysync is a wheelchair for poor performance.

That’s one way to look at it, but 99% of the time the performance is higher than what you’re capping it at. Lets say you have a 60fps game that actually run at around 75fps with rare dips to 57fps. Uncap and gsync it and it runs smoother since you don’t notice the variations anyway. It’s a real eye-opener when you try it for the first time. All of a sudden you get to unleash the fast greyhound you’ve always had on a tight leash.

 

[Nikana]

VRR and gysync is a wheelchair for poor performance.

That's one way to look at it I guess...

 

[Marlenus]

VRR and gysync is a wheelchair for poor performance.

So is dynamic resolution which the consoles make a lot of use of.

 

[killatopak]

So is dynamic resolution which the consoles make a lot of use of.

Difference is everyone can benefit from Dynamic Res but not everyone can use VRR or Gsync TV/Monitors.

 

[Shmunter]

So is dynamic resolution which the consoles make a lot of use of.

Built into the software, part of the rendering solution. Apples and oranges.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

How did the extra polygon count affect the FPS? If you don't have the answer, it sounds like you are the one making outlandish conclusions.

Huh? WAT?!? This is about an update to a bug in the game that affected LOD in the 120 FPS mode. Codemasters fixed that issue. That's what the thread is about. I'm on topic here, and have zero idea what path you're trying to veer off to.

Lets see if NXGamer and all those PS fanboy youtubers will make a video now

@NXGamer We’re waiting

Eh, I'm not in this to sling mud or anything like that. DiRT 5 is "old news" now insofar as tech analysis, and NX did cover Hivebusters a few days, seemed pretty impressed (as they should; it's some of the best-looking content out on any system right now).

All the same I doubt DF will do an updated DiRT 5 video, but they have at least made a tweet about the update.

Hopefully it performs even better now. I hope we don't have to wait long for the comparisons.

Don't think we're gonna get any more DiRT 5 comparisons, it's kind of old hat now (crazily enough) and lots of people getting ready for the holidays. By the time the new year comes around there'll be new 3P releases around the corner and people'll probably get on to those.

btw the ps5 version of this game is broken in image quality mode. it chugs like crazy now.

Sounds like another patch incoming to fix that, hopefully the dev is already aware.

Reading the title and some of the replies, the exact same thing can be applied to the variable clocks of the PS5....

I actually agree with this, and have even made a few posts previously expressing that. We can see on PC how variable clocks helps with game performance when the game isn't fully saturating the GPU with workloads, as it'll just run at peak clocks for whatever clock setting the card is at.

In that sense the PS5 is like a PC GPU, except it can draw the CPU's power budget if needed to sustain GPU performance. Something that's being introduced on PC with SmartShift.

Many BC games were loading faster on the Xbox Series X and here some of your posts.






Lets not pretend you were drawing conclusions based off of early comparison results of BC games.

Damn, you came with the receipts! I respect that. But allow me to put a little perspective on those posts.

The first one...I won't even pretend that wasn't me having a bit of fun and dicking around at a few folk's expense. But I said as such in the spoiler, and I was going off the general tone in that thread. Who knows, maybe that day I was just a bit clownish and/or groggy, but it is what it is.

The 2nd post though, well that was me making some observations off BC results, but I find no issues with that post whatsoever. Keep in mind I've never once said for anyone to NOT draw some conclusions on relative system performance between PS5 and Series X going by the 3P cross-gen port results. Why would I say that is wrong? I've also not contested any conclusions stating that the two systems would be pretty much identical to each other in terms of at least 3P game performance, going off those results.

In fact I have posts way earlier than those quoted saying I wouldn't of even been surprised if PS5 performed slightly better in several 3P games at launch, because I took into consideration devkit tardiness and MS's part, and also their 2 SKUs having very different specs in terms of graphics. So by that same notion, how is my conclusion the two systems will have near-identical SSD I/O performance a reach? Because again like with the 3P performance conclusions, I'm basing that conclusion on actual results we can directly observe, and what's more it's not a conclusion denigrating the PS5's solution or trying to implicate there's bottlenecks in their setup. No speculation like that on my behalf whatsover.

And that's where we start to divulge. My comments on relative SSD I/O performance between the two systems has never and never will devolve into implicating there "must be some bottleneck(s)" in PS5's design as to why it's closer than expected, whereas I have seen MANY people implicate that Series X must have severe design bottlenecks as the answer to why PS5 3P games are very close and in several cases exceeding Series X versions in some areas. The intent of the former is to give props to one while avoiding degradation of the other; the intent of the latter is to give props to one by degrading the other.

 

[JackMcGunns]

 

[II_JumPeR_I]

If I built 2 PCs and one was close to PS5 specs and the other close to Series X specs the PC close to Series X specs would give a higher framerate.

Given the raw hardware for Series X has a higjer performance ceiling than PS5 when it comes to framerate the obvious conclusion as to why multiplats work better on PS5 is software.

Pssst PS5 fanboys dont wanna hear that

 

[DeepEnigma]

Pssst PS5 fanboys dont wanna hear that

Maybe because some of them have more context and nuance than that disingenuous take.