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[3liteDragon]

No, if Microsoft is reporting the number then the number is shipped or "sold" to retailers. Explained here:

"Microsoft is revealing today that it will "shortly" have shipped 10 million Xbox One consoles to retailers. The significant milestone comes exactly three months after Sony first revealed it had hit 10 million sales of its PlayStation 4 console worldwide. Microsoft’s sales figures count devices shipped to retailers, rather than sales directly to consumers."

Microsoft reaches 10 million Xbox One shipments three months after the PS4

A Microsoft milestone

www.theverge.com

Analysts get their data from sales to customers. They don't have access to shipped numbers unless Microsoft provides it to them. These are not interchangeable.

That's shipped, not sold.
By now Xbox probably shipped 15 million, which would line up with the 13.8 million sold number.

Still looking like 2:1 or higher this gen. Let’s hope they get out of this supply issue by 2024.

 

[reinking]

Well Xbox isn’t 2-1 behind so far this gen but consoles have had supply issues both sides also when the activision deal gets done that can make a huge difference. We will see as the gen goes on

I think we all expected improvement. 2:1 is terrible so there is a lot of potential to close the gap. I'm not knocking Game Pass or Xbox. I have both. So far, I don't see Game Pass taking people away from Playstation. What I have seen (anecdotal I know), Game Pass makes the XB Series consoles a fantastic secondary console. I know a few "Sony" people that bought a Series S because with Game Pass they don't have to worry about spending money to buy games for their second console. They just jumped on the upgrade loophole and have a secondary console and three years worth of games on the cheap. It remains to be seen if this will cause signficant conversion going into the next generation.

 

[pasterpl]

When you consider how terrible the first two years of this generation were for Xbox in terms of game output it's not that bad.

The whole theory that the Series S was some sort of genius move that would close the gap has no basis in reality tho, it wasn't able to help that much even with ample stock and deals.

Flight sim, forza horizon, psychonauts 2, grounded, gears hivebusters, forza HotWheels, halo, age of empires 3 and 4, as dusk falls etc. all rated rather high. With lots of different genres. We can probably add games like deathloop and ghost wire Tokyo to that list and ongoing growth of sea of thieves. And it now looks like quite a lot.

 

[El Pistolero]

 

[Neofire]

Gaf verified the numbers, if they weren't verified they would have banned you back then. Gaf used to have insiders and leakers back then, data wasn't just thrown out there and people beleived it.

Those numbers linked to GAF in the OP ARE the NPD numbers in those NPD threads.

Even if you don't believe them despite gaf used to having leakers and industry insiders back in the day, Microsofts official announcement of 6.6. million Xbox 360 and Xbox Ones sold in Dec/Nov 2014 still adds up to similar numbers estimating the split.

I know all about the so called "leakers" I've been on this site a long time. Didn't believe them then without confirmation of from the companies themselves and I don't believe them now. If MS starts reporting and says it's around 18-20 million then I will eat crow but til then huge pinch of salt from all 3rd party sources to be frank.

 

[bitbydeath]

No it's a high amount.

https://leviathyn.com/63398/900000-xbox-ones-left-unsold/

It was a big deal when the Xbox One has 900k on the shelves to pad out the shipping numbers, and you could still by launch edition Xbox Ones months later. including outside of the US. That was without supply constraints, and being able to go in the majority of stores and being able ti pick it up.

There's no way there are 1.2 million Xbox Series consoles on store shelves right now.

It’s low compared to last-gens 3-5M on shelves, and you may have missed my previous edit.

Edit: Think of it this way, Sony has far less on shelves so their 21M number is rather static compared to Microsoft’s 13.8M.

 

[ACESHIGH]

38M consoles is an awful lot for machines that play souped up ps4/x one games. I feel that next gen didn't even start yet...
It's a good thing in a way. Still cruising with my old ass gaming rig.

 

[Mr Moose]

Microsoft didn't say anything about shipped, it said that it was the best selling Xbox,.

Also your number would have 1.2 million Xbox Series consoles on the shelf. Supply is not anywhere high enough for that. Xbox One was at 13 million by Jan 2015, going to August 2015, that's about 15 million right there, so the Series consoles have to be ahead of that.

What's the source for this? They were at 20M at the end of 2015.

 

[nominedomine]

Flight sim, forza horizon, psychonauts 2, grounded, gears hivebusters, forza HotWheels, halo, age of empires 3 and 4, as dusk falls etc. all rated rather high. With lots of different genres. We can probably add games like deathloop and ghost wire Tokyo to that list and ongoing growth of sea of thieves. And it now looks like quite a lot.

Exactly, look at that list, it really pales in comparison to what the PS5 is getting in the first two years. It's embarrassing how unprepared MS was and it doesn't look like they'll be prepared any time soon. You even added DLC, rereleases, PC games and that sort of stuff to the list yet it still does nothing, it doesn't move the needle at all.

There is just no excitement around the Xbox, value doesn't excite people, value is boring. Starfield is what seemed to be making some waves but it got really quiet after the reveal, eerily reminding of Halo and we all know how that turned out.

When I think about the games PS5 had stuff like Deathloop and Ghost Wire Tokyo don't even cross my mind yet here you are waiting for them still.

 

[Topher]

If the Xbox Series is still outpacing Xbox One than it would have to be over 15 million at least. Sure we won't know the exact number because Microsoft won't give them but we at least have a floor.

That assumes your estimated 9 million sold through is accurate. Factually, we have no idea what that number really is. If it were 8 million sold through then that makes Ampere's number pretty close. But again, we don't know.

No it's a high amount.

https://leviathyn.com/63398/900000-xbox-ones-left-unsold/

It was a big deal when the Xbox One has 900k on the shelves to pad out the shipping numbers, and you could still by launch edition Xbox Ones months later. including outside of the US. That was without supply constraints, and being able to go in the majority of stores and being able ti pick it up.

There's no way there are 1.2 million Xbox Series consoles on store shelves right now.

If that is accurate then that's 900k on the shelves during Xbox One's launch holiday when demand was at its highest. There will have been a lot more units on store shelves a year and a half later.

 

[Riky]

Flight sim, forza horizon, psychonauts 2, grounded, gears hivebusters, forza HotWheels, halo, age of empires 3 and 4, as dusk falls etc. all rated rather high. With lots of different genres. We can probably add games like deathloop and ghost wire Tokyo to that list and ongoing growth of sea of thieves. And it now looks like quite a lot.

Im sure they won publisher of the year with the highest average in history, that's how terrible it's been.

 

[anothertech]

Ppl losing their minds when they dont realize it's all tales from your ass.

Without hard numbers it's all bollocks.

And it's probably closer to 2:1 ratio than most people realize.

It's fucking September and Ms has yet to release another first party game. I mean holy fuck.

The value in gamepass isn't going to move shit when it's main selling point hasn't been utilized in a fucking year.

 

[Stuart360]

Im sure they won publisher of the year with the highest average in history, that's how terrible it's been.

Yeah but how many of them were 3rd person semi open world action games?. Thats the only games that really matter.

 

[Eddie-Griffin]

I know all about the so called "leakers" I've been on this site a long time. Didn't believe them then without confirmation of from the companies themselves and I don't believe them now. If MS starts reporting and says it's around 18-20 million then I will eat crow but til then huge pinch of salt from all 3rd party sources to be frank.

The NPD threads literally had people with NPD verify their claims about NPD, stop it. Ampere isn't even using tracking data.

It’s low compared to last-gens 3-5M on shelves, and you may have missed my previous edit.

Edit: Think of it this way, Sony has far less on shelves so their 21M number is rather static compared to Microsoft’s 13.8M.

There were not 3-5 million on the shelves, unless you're talking about very late when sales collapse, we are still in the first two years of the gen. There hasn't been 3-5 million consoles sitting on shelves in the first two years of any gen.

That assumes your estimated 9 million sold through is accurate. Factually, we have no idea what that number really is. If it were 8 million sold through then that makes Ampere's number pretty close.

First off, being 1 million off is uncommon. But even if we played you're unusual table and said it was 8 million they still wouldn't be close because that would mean with US sales alone that would put Xbox One at 10.5 million and then another 2 million for the rest of the world which is still 12.5, and you would have 8 months unaccounted for world wide to reach august 2015 to match august 2022 now. Amperes numbers just can't work.

If that is accurate then that's 900k on the shelves during Xbox One's launch holiday when demand was at its highest. There will have been a lot more units on store shelves a year and a half later.

That only happens if they don't cut shipments. but they did. it's also not comparable to Bit's 1.2 million Series X|S on shelves claim because the Series consoles, X especially, are constrained, and with the Xbox One you could already go in most stores anywhere in the country and buy one, same internationally. That's why the 900k was a big deal because it caused discounts and people trying to move stock on the floor in various countries.

That was with just 900k on the shelves.

 

[Eddie-Griffin]

What's the source for this? They were at 20M at the end of 2015.

I stopped at August so not sure where the confusion is.

Xbox One near 10 million shipped start of November, 4 million or so during the holidays, over 13 million by January, 15 million by August is reasonable.. Could be more than that, but we don't know how close to 10 million sold they were at that announcement.

I'm not sure on that 20 million though. i guess they could have sold 5 in that 4 months. But 2015 was a bad year the second half.

 

[Pop]

I did my part, bougth a series X yesterday to go side by side with my PC.

why though
thats a bad pairing

 

[sncvsrtoip]

Without supply constraints diff margin would be defenitly higher

 

[Kagey K]

why though
thats a bad pairing

Why is that a bad pairing?

It's a cohesive ecosystem where you can get the most out of your account when you have both.

 

[Riky]

I did my part, bougth a series X yesterday to go side by side with my PC.

Play anywhere is great for this, you can get up to five versions of a game for one price.

 

[Kagey K]

Without supply constraints diff margin would be defenitly higher

Doesn't matter, and changes nothing.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Well if the numbers are wrong the only company to blame is Microsoft. If its higher they should quote numbers and you won't get negative incorrect press circling.

 

[Robb]

Sounds low for Series X/S, would have expected more. What’s the margin of error for these estimates?

 

[Sanepar]

why though
thats a bad pairing

It is not. My wife is playing FH5 everyday, I need my PC back.

 

[Topher]

First off, being 1 million off is uncommon. But even if we played you're unusual table and said it was 8 million they still wouldn't be close because that would mean with US sales alone that would put Xbox One at 10.5 million and then another 2 million for the rest of the world which is still 12.5, and you would have 8 months unaccounted for world wide to reach august 2015 to match august 2022 now. Amperes numbers just can't work.

Sold through being off one million from shipped is uncommon? Based on? And considering the time period of 2015 is when Microsoft suddenly decided it would stop sharing sales numbers then seems to point to sales not being good. But it is all still a guess.

That only happens if they don't cut shipments. but they did. it's also not comparable to Bit's 1.2 million Series X|S on shelves claim because the Series consoles, X especially, are constrained, and with the Xbox One you could already go in most stores anywhere in the country and buy one, same internationally. That's why the 900k was a big deal because it caused discounts and people trying to move stock on the floor in various countries.

That was with just 900k on the shelves.

I'm not saying it is comparable to XSX. So even after cutting shipments they had 900k on the shelves during the holiday launch. Yeah....that tells me the following year they had a lot less sold through than the 10 million shipped. How much we still don't know, but doesn't sound like it was even close to 10 million.

 

[GhostOfTsu]

Zhuges post history on this forum would say otherwise.

That means nothing. Look at adamsapple posting history here or Era. He was even accused of being a PS4 Pro shill since he liked it so much (and everything Sony) until he took a new identity. People change when they have an agenda

What do you want us to do then ?

If Pro owners say good things about the device, we get accused of being shills or advertisers. Sure DS wasn't gameplay but it was running on Pro hardware. Even if the OG PS4 version runs at native 1080p and has a rock solid frame rate, the Pro version will improve upon it.

There's a whole host of already released games with obvious Pro advantages (some supremely significant, others barely worth mentioning) and it'll just keep increasing.

 

[Kagey K]

What’s the margin of error for these estimates?

Quite high, as anyone with a brain and basic math skills can see.

 

[Eddie-Griffin]

Sold through being off one million from shipped is uncommon? Based on?

Based on the fact that 900k for the Xbox One was seen as a big deal and unprecedented and was mocked all over the place. That wasn't even one year into the gen.

Sold through being off one million from shipped is uncommon? Based on? And considering the time period of 2015 is when Microsoft suddenly decided it would stop sharing sales numbers then seems to point to sales not being good. But it is all still a guess.

Except 10.5 million wouldn't be a guess, that would be about the number they sold by January, for Ampere to be proven wrong we don't need anything more than that. But that's using your questionable number of 8 million.

The likely hood of 8 million from 10 million shipped is close to zero so in reality it's more likely to be 9 million sold through, assuming that Xbox overwhipped getting ready for the holidays. That's 11.5 million in January 2015.

there's no way the Xbox one sold less than 2 million consoles in the EIGHT months after that. But even if it did sell less and only sold 1 million during that time, that's 12.5 million Xbox Ones, and the Xbox Series consoles are trending a good amount ahead of where the Xbox one was, so that still would have to be over 14 million.

No matter how you slice it the 13.8 from Ampere doesn't work with the math.

Sold through being off one million from shipped is uncommon? Based on? And considering the time period of 2015 is when Microsoft suddenly decided it would stop sharing sales numbers then seems to point to sales not being good. But it is all still a guess.



I'm not saying it is comparable to XSX. So even after cutting shipments they had 900k on the shelves during the holiday launch. Yeah....that tells me the following year had a lot less sold through than the 10 million shipped. How much we still don't know, but doesn't sound like it was even close to 10 million.

The 900k was from 2013, they already fixed that issue in 2014.

 

[Robb]

Quite high, as anyone with a brain and basic math skills can see.

Sure, but what’s the actual +\- number? I didn’t find it in the OP’s link.

 

[Kagey K]

Sure, but what’s the actual +\- number? I didn’t find it in the OP’s link.

I couldn't tell you. They don't provide that info.

 

[Eddie-Griffin]

That means nothing

I noticed you cropped out the part of my post asking you to provide what you based your accusation of him being an "xbox cheerleader" on. But have not yet answered the question.

Well if the numbers are wrong the only company to blame is Microsoft. If its higher they should quote numbers and you won't get negative incorrect press circling.

Can't blame Microsoft for gaming outlets using wrong numbers they know are wrong, like from Vgchartz. lol.

 

[Topher]

Based on the fact that 900k for the Xbox One was seen as a big deal and unprecedented and was mocked all over the place. That wasn't even one year into the gen.

The internet mocking something isn't a basis of anything.

Except 10.5 million wouldn't be a guess, that would be about the number they sold by January, for Ampere to be proven wrong we don't need anything more than that. But that's using your questionable number of 8 million.

The likely hood of 8 million from 10 million shipped is close to zero so in reality it's more likely to be 9 million sold through, assuming that Xbox overwhipped getting ready for the holidays. That's 11.5 million in January 2015.

there's no way the Xbox one sold less than 2 million consoles in the EIGHT months after that. But even if it did sell less and only sold 1 million during that time, that's 12.5 million Xbox Ones, and the Xbox Series consoles are trending a good amount ahead of where the Xbox one was, so that still would have to be over 14 million.

No matter how you slice it the 13.8 from Ampere doesn't work with the math.

The 900k was from 2013, they already fixed that issue in 2014.

I'll end with saying that all that goes back to this being a lot of speculation from both of us really. Can't say Ampere's math is wrong when we don't even have actual numbers to start with.

 

[Robb]

I couldn't tell you. They don't provide that info.

Oh okay.. I guess we don’t know the level of confidence either then?

I always find it strange how it’s so widely accepted to provide estimations without any error margins. What’s the point.

 

[Eddie-Griffin]

The internet mocking something isn't a basis of anything.

Not sure why you ignored the part of my post mentioning WHY it was mocked.

The internet mocking something isn't a basis of anything.



I'll end with saying that all that goes back to this being a lot of speculation from both of us really. Can't say Ampere's math is wrong when we don't even have actual numbers.

I can easily say Ampere is wrong just with the number we had before they stopped reporting. As long as MS says that Xbox Series is tracking ahead of both Xbox One and 360, we know where the floor is. and it's not 13.8 million. Any numbers Xbox One would have had to be higher for Series.

 

[Topher]

Not sure why you ignored the part of my post mentioning WHY it was mocked.

Because it amounted to "the internet said so". That's meaningless.

I can easily say Ampere is wrong just with the number we had before they stopped reporting. As long as MS says that Xbox Series is tracking ahead of both Xbox One and 360, we know where the floor is. and it's not 13.8 million. Any numbers Xbox One would have had to be higher for Series.

That starting number of sold through is pure speculation so no, I disagree.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

Xbox is clearly beyond 13.8 million by now lol. The 13.8 million was as of March 2022. The Series X, for example, have had numerous months since where it has outsold PS5 in multiple territories, but especially in the USA. Chances of it being at 13.8 million still while clearly competing so well next to PS5 in the official sales information we do get (even if not the exact numbers) are pretty much slim to none.

 

[Eddie-Griffin]

Because it amounted to "the internet said so". That's meaningless.

People noted that it was unusual historically, it wasn't the "internet said so" like you say.

That starting number of sold through is pure speculation so no, I disagree.

So is your 8 million, which doesn't make any sense. But you seem to be picking and choosing here.

 

[bentanchorbolt]

I don't understand why so many people care about this tbh. Unless you are a shareholder in either company, it shouldn't matter how much one console sells unless its bombing and in danger of losing support, which is not a problem for Sony or MS.

 

[Duchess]

You know, the Series consoles must have sold more than 13 million units by now. It has to be 18 million.

Because, honestly, if it's 13 million, those numbers are absolute shit.

Think about it - that's the COMBINED numbers for both the Series X and S. If you assume it's a 50/50 split, that means the Series X has only sold 6.5 million units since launch. And even if you set the numbers at 75/25, you're still only looking at 9 million.

 

[Topher]

People noted that it was unusual historically, it wasn't the "internet said so" like you say.

"People" is no different that "internet said so".

So is your 8 million, which doesn't make any sense. But you seem to be picking and choosing here.

Of course that 8 million number is speculation. I've said from the beginning we don't know the actual number. So nope, not "picking and choosing" at all. All of it is speculation.[/QUOTE]

 

[GhostOfTsu]

I noticed you cropped out the part of my post asking you to provide what you based your accusation of him being an "xbox cheerleader" on. But have not yet answered the question.

It's because of his Tweets around the time Activision was announced and anytime there's a big MS release or news. I don't feel going on Twitter to get them but there's a reason why Xbox fans always post them around. Always a positive spin.

 

[Mr Moose]

I stopped at August so not sure where the confusion is.

Xbox One near 10 million shipped start of November, 4 million or so during the holidays, over 13 million by January, 15 million by August is reasonable.. Could be more than that, but we don't know how close to 10 million sold they were at that announcement.

I'm not sure on that 20 million though. i guess they could have sold 5 in that 4 months. But 2015 was a bad year the second half.

 

[Kagey K]

I don't understand why so many people care about this tbh. Unless you are a shareholder in either company, it shouldn't matter how much one console sells unless its bombing and in danger of losing support, which is not a problem for Sony or MS.

The thing is anyone with a retirement plan is an MS shareholder whether they know it or not.

As a FAANG stock it is in most group portfolios.

 

[Ozriel]

When you consider how terrible the first two years of this generation were for Xbox in terms of game output it's not that bad.

This makes no sense. We’re yet to hit 2 years in this generation, and 2021 was a good year for Xbox releases.

The whole theory that the Series S was some sort of genius move that would close the gap has no basis in reality tho, it wasn't able to help that much even with ample stock and deals.

Nobody at Microsoft ever claimed to have introduced the Series S to catch up to PlayStation in hardware sales. Key intent is to appeal to budget conscious gamers and drive Gamepass subscriptions…and it’s succeeding quite well at those.

 

[iHaunter]

Series s/x will not even be close to 360 sales in the end.

Been going downhill since that clown destroyed XB1. Still hasn't recovered.

 

[bitbydeath]

There were not 3-5 million on the shelves, unless you're talking about very late when sales collapse, we are still in the first two years of the gen. There hasn't been 3-5 million consoles sitting on shelves in the first two years of any gen.

Here’s an example of 3M sitting on shelves.

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/ps4-passes-63-3-million-shipped-as-of-june-30.1414015/

Not sure what the big deal is, Xbox numbers are still good.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Decent numbers so far particularly for Sony.

its a tough one this gen , it feels like it hasn’t really got going yet and I can’t say I have been too impressed but I understand given all the circumstances and launching consoles during a pandemic would of been very difficult.

I’m hoping well into next year we see some truly impressive stuff happening with the games, updates and new features for the UIs particularly Series X because that dash feels like last gen in some aspects.

 

[Eddie-Griffin]

Was debated, the chart is wrong, the PS3 numbers alone show this given what both companies officially put out around that same quarter.

But I can see it still being true, 20 million for Xbox One's case isn't far fetched.

It's because of his Tweets around the time Activision was announced and anytime there's a big MS release or news. I don't feel going on Twitter to get them but there's a reason why Xbox fans always post them around. Always a positive spin.

So because of relatively recent actions, and not the majority of his actions, you're coming to this conclusion. ooooook

I don't understand why so many people care about this tbh. Unless you are a shareholder in either company, it shouldn't matter how much one console sells unless its bombing and in danger of losing support, which is not a problem for Sony or MS.

Xbox One was in dire straights until it was turned around and support increased giving values to new buyers and existing buyers who were left hanging. As old as your copy and pasted statement is, it's always been wrong. Sales are important for the actual content that happens on or comes to the hardware.

Look at where the Xbox One and PS3 were at the start, and then where they ended up at, all correlated with a sales increase.

 

[Mr Moose]

Was debated, the chart is wrong, the PS3 numbers alone show this given what both companies officially put out around that same quarter.

But I can see it still being true, 20 million for Xbox One's case isn't far fetched.

That's NPD, are you saying NPD can't be trusted?
eedar.com

 

[Negotiator101]

https://game-news24.com/2022/08/26/according-to-ampere-analysis-ps5-sold-52-more-than-xbox-x-s/



A lot of people online are discussing this numbers as gospel but they don't really make much ense.

Microsoft CEO and Phil iirc, both confirmed that the Xbox Series was doing better than the Xbox 360 and the Xbox One. So we already have an idea what the floor for Xbox Series sales are.

In November 2014, the Xbox One was almost at 10 million sold

https://gamerant.com/xbox-one-sales-10-million-units/

Sold 1.4 million for November NPD for the month

https://xfdev.neogaf.com/threads/np...3-npd-data-error-ac-u-5.950407/post-142975576

And in December NPD sold 1.3 million

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/dece...ons-closes-january-13th.964549/post-147709046

That's just in the US, not including UK and the rest of the world. So Xbox would already be around 14 million by January 2015. Where we are at now August 2022, would be Xbox One in August 2015, so that means 8 more months of sales for the Xbox One, putting it maybe at 15 or 16 million.

There's no way the 13.8 million figure is correct, the Xbox Series consoles would have to be 2 or 3 million behind the Xbox One and that's impossible. i think the real numbers are somewhere between 17-20 million. PS5 was over 21 million sold last month, so it may be at 22 or 23 million by now, which provides a gap that makes much more sense.

This sounds more likely, we know it's selling better than previous Xbox consoles so nicely done my friend

 

[bentanchorbolt]

Xbox One was in dire straights until it was turned around and support increased giving values to new buyers and existing buyers who were left hanging. As old as your copy and pasted statement is, it's always been wrong. Sales are important for the actual content that happens on or comes to the hardware.

Look at where the Xbox One and PS3 were at the start, and then where they ended up at, all correlated with a sales increase.

I've been online since the 90s and its always bickering about sales that never actually makes a difference. Good on you for thinking these threads about sales matter.