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[THE:MILKMAN]

Assuming the Pro is coming I can't see it being anything other than a PS4 Pro. i.e 2x GPU plus a few future RDNA features and maybe a larger size SSD.

 

[Wooxsvan]

It will be curious to know what Cerny has cooked up w/ all that work hes supposedly putting in with improving ray-tracing.

 

[Solarstrike]

In my opinion the PS4 Pro was really the PS5.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

If they make a console that is WAY more powerful than the original then software itself becomes the bottleneck...

Devs won't utilise the power of a niche console that only 2% of people would buy... Base PS5 is always gonna be the main target

And this is a console that has to run ALL the SAME games of the standard PS5

It's a PS5 Pro, not a PS6

Maybe but even if Sony's 1st party titles are PS5 Pro optimized and it helps keep steady frames in others games I am all in even at $1000

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Is it happening?

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Is it happening?

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It is an enhancement of the current HW, so no. It makes money for Sony as people think that the more frequently HW refreshes they buy the better the games become… Despite all evidence of the contrary… .

That's not how it works. Technology is iterative. They don't completely scrap everything when developing the next generation. Tech that was developed for PS4 Pro went into PS5.

With this rumor, we are getting RDNA 3.5 + Enhanced Raytracing. Those features will be iterated on and expanded with PS6.

 

[PeteBull]

If they make a console that is WAY more powerful than the original then software itself becomes the bottleneck...

Devs won't utilise the power of a niche console that only 2% of people would buy... Base PS5 is always gonna be the main target

And this is a console that has to run ALL the SAME games of the standard PS5

It's a PS5 Pro, not a PS6

Have some faith, bro, even if base ps5 is target, as it should be, we could still get 2x resolution or 2x fps and maybe some better rt, thats plenty for enthusiast to bite

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

I think it will more Oui U.

 

[Stafford]

Read that shit again about MS saying XSX is their mid gen refresh, S is the standard one. Hell no it isn't. This truly could be their first real big mistake if they truly see it like this. They need to be serious about this, because I think we've all seen cloud isn't taking off anytime soon, go all in with consoles please.


Not gonna be pretty when many games manage to be 60fps on a PS5 Pro and the XSX struggling or not even going past 30fps.

I might really end up getting multiplatform titles starting late next year until next gen on a PS system and I never thought I'd say that.

 

[MisterXDTV]

Have some faith, bro, even if base ps5 is target, as it should be, we could still get 2x resolution or 2x fps and maybe some better rt, thats plenty for enthusiast to bite

I know, just I'm not expecting a $1000 console...

Cerny has always talked about "balance" making hardware...

Don't expect a revolution....

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

I know, just I'm not expecting a $1000 console...

Cerny has always talked about "balance" making hardware...

Don't expect a revolution....

I don't see a $1000 console either but could see $599

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

I agree they can't touch the CPU it would differentiate too much from the base model.

Get the feeling Sony will stick with Zen 2 but increase the clock frequency. By how much I'm uncertain but maybe as high as 4.5 GHz might be possible depending on the node. The GPU's going to need that for more drawcalls anyway.

But anything like adding more cores, threads, or adding encode/decode support for more instructions in line with Zen 3-5, probably won't happen. They might increase the CPU cache a bit, though.

HeisenbergFX4 told us many times why. Just like when John got a script from the Gears 5 devs on what to say, and what buzzwords to use. They tried denying it initially, fanatics circled the wagons, only for him to come clean later saying that yes, they were handed a script on what to say for the "tech breakdown" (which is why they missed a bunch of the shortcomings they conveniently don't otherwise and for other first party titles on other platforms) and he tried to pass it off as a "time issue."

Them sponsorship™ and first look™ dollars at work. Bringing them closer to the vest™ in the great internet platform wars.

Their narratives tune would be different if they were emailed in the PR inbox with Xbox XX "rumors" from a "totally anonymous source." Bet.

Funny thing about the Gears stuff is I didn't even know he was reading from a MS PR script, but it's now been pointed out a few times and I'm just like "...you couldn't even change the order you mentioned the bullet points in, John?".

Considering MS's astroturfing strategy, and knowing how much they love to get influence in enthusiasts circles, I'm not surprised if they in fact buddied up with Digital Foundry for coverage. And you're right, the moment MS decides they're doing a Series X Pro after all, they'll start to say how perfectly fine it is. Just like the media when MS started doing $70 games or increased console prices.

Actually, I wanna know what DF said about the new Series S, curious if they called out the obvious bad value proposition compared to a PS5 Digital being just $50 more, or if they skipped right over it. Or what they were saying about the cloud console for that matter, before it got shelved.

 

[PeteBull]

I know, just I'm not expecting a $1000 console...

Cerny has always talked about "balance" making hardware...

Don't expect a revolution....

By holidays 2024 i think most probable price/sweetspot is 600 to 800 bucks, for enthusiast machine i think its reasonable, and i bet tons of ppl wont have problem with that price as long as specs are solid(aka 2x base ps5 at the least gpu power wise).

Btw, 400$ ps4 we all bought in 2013 adjusted for inflation is now 524$, by holidays 2024 it will probably be well over 550$ so 600$ seems not high at all really, and 800$ provided specs are decent, wont be a problem either.

 

[Forsete]

60 fps is worth a lot to me, so I will probably buy it. Yes, yes 60fps is available on many PS5 games, but if the Pro provides better image quality I am there.

I am very happy with the PS5. They designed a very nice system this time. The SSD is (but a bit small). I truly hate loading times.
Also the haptic triggers and the feedback on the controller makes playing regular dead trigger games and regular rumble feedback games a bore. Truly revolutionary what they did with the controller IMO.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

I mentioned PS getting away with it, because since Jim Ryan took over, PS has somewhat reverted back to its cocky ways at the start of the ps3 era. Really started with Layden IMO.

Charging too much for peripherals and hardware (IMO), not a lot of substantial software (by most metrics, I think we can all somewhat agree this gen has been disappointing in game output), and releasing a newer version of something they barely scratched yet.

MS is just far, far worse.

So this time, Sony gets away with it a bit easier.

If I ranked my console allegiance, it would be PS-> Nintendo-> Xbox.

So I am not saying this stuff as an enemy of PlayStation. I just much enjoyed their output from ps1 to ps2, and then their resurgence from 2nd half of ps3 to ps4.

5, even as an owner, has been a bit disappointing. IMO.

But again, just my honest opinion. Maybe it isn’t for everybody, maybe some love the output, maybe some are so invested in console warring they convince themselves they do, too.

Who knows.

PS4 had a worse first 3 years

 

[MisterXDTV]

PS4 had a worse first 3 years

And this time the Pro model is launching a year later, after 4 years not 3

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

We don't need native 4K. Waste. Of. Resources. 1440p/1800p reconstruction is plenty fine.

Especially when every PC gamer uses DLSS/FSR/XeSS, so why are we always falling back on the "native train" when it comes to consoles?

Facts

 

[Dice]

Did someone say Trinity?

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

We don't need native 4K. Waste. Of. Resources. 1440p/1800p reconstruction is plenty fine.

Especially when every PC gamer uses DLSS/FSR/XeSS, so why are we always falling back on the "native train" when it comes to consoles?

I think I have mentioned this before but its something Ybarra wanted Xbox to pioneer in for their consoles was a DLSS equivalent, he said years ago it was the future

Even with the PS5 Pro I too will be happy with 1440p and locked 60 fps or even 120 when possible

 

[DeepEnigma]

I think I have mentioned this before but its something Ybarra wanted Xbox to pioneer in for their consoles was a DLSS equivalent, he said years ago it was the future

Even with the PS5 Pro I too will be happy with 1440p and locked 60 fps or even 120 when possible

Same. It's what the PS4Pro was essentially. Sony's launch into reconstruction techniques upscaling to 4K and the like. Same with their pinnacle of scaler engines soc tech in their TVs.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

PS4 had a worse first 3 years

Everything is subjective, I guess - but…

Ps4 launch + first 3 years (end of 2016) had:

• KZ: Shadowfall, graphically ambitious FPS exclusive to next gen.
• Resogun, exclusive to ps4 (for a while),
• Knack
• Driveclub
• Infamous: Second Son
• Bloodborne
• Until Dawn
• Order 1886
• Uncharted 4

All of these were “next gen” exclusive, I believe, with one or two titles ending up being ported backwards (like Resogun). This list doesn’t include last gen ports or multiplat launches. I think that’s right, from memory.

Ps5 first 3 years has had:

• Astro
• Demon Souls (remastered, not sure I should include it but whatever).
• Destruction All Stars
• R&C: Rift Apart
• returnal
• FF VIi
• Ghost wire: Tokyo
• Forespoken
• FF XVI

Right?

I didn’t put Spider-Man or TLOU, because it was literally remasters of a LAST gen game. Same reason I didn’t put the few titles on ps4 from ps3.

Ps4 worse? Meh. All subjective I guess. IMO, probably better + an expectation of stuff they showed at e3 for the future that looked awesome too (sorely lacking that vision now).

 

[Kuwitzzer]

Everything is subjective, I guess - but…

Ps4 launch + first 3 years (end of 2016) had:

• KZ: Shadowfall, graphically ambitious FPS exclusive to next gen.
• Resogun, exclusive to ps4 (for a while),
• Knack
• Driveclub
• Infamous: Second Son
• Bloodborne
• Until Dawn
• Order 1886
• Uncharted 4

All of these were “next gen” exclusive, I believe, with one or two titles ending up being ported backwards (like Resogun). This list doesn’t include last gen ports or multiplat launches. I think that’s right, from memory.

Ps5 first 3 years has had:

• Astro
• Demon Souls (remastered, not sure I should include it but whatever).
• Destruction All Stars
• R&C: Rift Apart
• returnal
• FF VIi
• Ghost wire: Tokyo
• Forespoken
• FF XVI

Right?

I didn’t put Spider-Man or TLOU, because it was literally remasters of a LAST gen game. Same reason I didn’t put the few titles on ps4 from ps3.

Ps4 worse? Meh. All subjective I guess. IMO, probably better + an expectation of stuff they showed at e3 for the future that looked awesome too (sorely lacking that vision now).

Next Gen in graphics? That’s it? Because quality-wise they are worse. Also, I don’t care if some are cross gen because they still release on PS5 and they show Sony first party output capability.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

Next Gen in graphics? That’s it? Because quality-wise they are worse.

If we are discussing power/ maximizing output of new hardware, I would think visuals are the major concept to discuss.

But EVEN if we do what you suggest, and judge the quality.

The highest rated METACRITIC ps4 exclusive in the first 3 years:

1. Uncharted 4, 93
2. Bloodborne, 92
3. Resogun, 84

The highest rated METACRITIC ps5 exclusives in the first 3 years (so far):

1. Demon Souls, a remastered game, 92
2. Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart, 88
3. FF VII Intragrade, 89 (really just a directors cut of the SAME ps4 game, probably shouldn’t be on the list).

So, of the top 3 games, ps4 wins 2/3. And 2 of the games on the ps5 list are remasters or special cuts…

So yes, quality wise - ps4 still, on paper, wins.

Let’s crunch the average MC score of the 9 titles listed for each:

Ps4 - 76.55 average

Ps5 - 80.66 average

But if you remove the 2 remasters i mentioned…

Ps5 - 77.86 average.

Pretty similar, but I would argue again, the system was being PUSHED more on ps4 (more innovation, the point of my argument), than on ps5. So far.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

If we are discussing power/ maximizing output of new hardware, I would think visuals are the major concept to discuss.

But EVEN if we do what you suggest, and judge the quality.

The highest rated METACRITIC ps4 exclusive in the first 3 years:

1. Uncharted 4, 93
2. Bloodborne, 92
3. Resogun, 84

The highest rated METACRITIC ps5 exclusives in the first 3 years (so far):

1. Demon Souls, a remastered game, 92
2. Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart, 88
3. FF VII Intragrade, 89 (really just a directors cut of the SAME ps4 game, probably shouldn’t be on the list).

So, of the top 3 games, ps4 wins 2/3. And 2 of the games on the ps5 list are remasters or special cuts…

So yes, quality wise - ps4 still, on paper, wins.

Let’s crunch the average MC score of the 9 titles listed for each:

Ps4 - 76.55 average

Ps5 - 80.66 average

But if you remove the 2 remasters i mentioned…

Ps5 - 77.86 average.

Pretty similar, but I would argue again, the system was being PUSHED more on ps4 (more innovation, the point of my argument), than on ps5. So far.

Like I said, I do not care about the fact that some are cross gen. What I am seeing is that Sony has delivered more first party games and exclusive deals this generation compared to the last one.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

Like I said, I do not care about the fact that some are cross gen. What I am seeing is that Sony has delivered more first party games and exclusive deals this generation compared to the last one.

But my argument, that you quoted, was based on the point that there isn't as many exclusives for PS5. That was literally my point.

So why are we discussing this then?

Edit: Nuance and context are everything, and I am realizing that the conversation started far back and you probably didn't see the beginning or have the context. So it makes sense why you wouldn't think about it the way I was intending the message.

 

[Kuwitzzer]

But my argument, that you quoted, was based on the point that there isn't as many exclusives for PS5. That was literally my point.

So why are we discussing this then?

Because you should try to be more nuanced about that then? How is it worse than PS4 when Sony delivers more games this gen, because the games also release on PS4? Really? PS4 literally had no worthwhile games at launch too, definitely worse, it only won xbone because of xbone self destruction.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

If we are discussing power/ maximizing output of new hardware, I would think visuals are the major concept to discuss.

But EVEN if we do what you suggest, and judge the quality.

The highest rated METACRITIC ps4 exclusive in the first 3 years:

1. Uncharted 4, 93
2. Bloodborne, 92
3. Resogun, 84

The highest rated METACRITIC ps5 exclusives in the first 3 years (so far):

1. Demon Souls, a remastered game, 92
2. Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart, 88
3. FF VII Intragrade, 89 (really just a directors cut of the SAME ps4 game, probably shouldn’t be on the list).

So, of the top 3 games, ps4 wins 2/3. And 2 of the games on the ps5 list are remasters or special cuts…

So yes, quality wise - ps4 still, on paper, wins.

Let’s crunch the average MC score of the 9 titles listed for each:

Ps4 - 76.55 average

Ps5 - 80.66 average

But if you remove the 2 remasters i mentioned…

Ps5 - 77.86 average.

Pretty similar, but I would argue again, the system was being PUSHED more on ps4 (more innovation, the point of my argument), than on ps5. So far.

I mean, you do realize the world was fucc'd for over a year right? 'Ya know, due to COVID and the lockdowns throwing everything off-balance for everyone. And somehow even with that, Sony managed a slightly better average even when removing remasters. In a way I say that is very commendable.

Also Demon's Souls was a remake, not a remaster.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

Because you should try to be more nuanced about that then? How is it worse than PS4 when Sony delivers more games this gen, because the games also release on PS4? Really? PS4 literally had no worthwhile games at launch too, definitely worse, it only won xbone because of xbone self destruction.

I actually edited the post, but not in time apparently, to suggest that it is likely you missed the far back beginning of the conversation you were quoting. So I can understand your argument better. No worries, no hard feelings.

I mean, you do realize the world was fucc'd for over a year right? 'Ya know, due to COVID and the lockdowns throwing everything off-balance for everyone. And somehow even with that, Sony managed a slightly better average even when removing remasters. In a way I say that is very commendable.

Also Demon's Souls was a remake, not a remaster.

Which is why I left it on there.

I do indeed realize that, although games take many years to develop with development of the ps5 games starting well before COVID, so I don't think it helps bolster the fact that nearly 3 full years in we are sorely lacking new, fresh, innovative IPs (outside of Astro).

This is again mimicked in the industry as a whole, not exclusive to PS at all. The difference however has been PS history of exclusives being the system seller. Now, they are drying up on that too. With ps4 being a slight lower average, I think it's still pretty clear that the top of the shelf was stronger. Right off the bat you have UC4, Bloodborne, and KZ: SF. 3 strong names.

Ps5... what competes? For PS exclusives, in particular?

I don't think thats a controversial statement to make, that we are seeing less excitement. We know that GG has been working on a FPS title... we have seen the job listings, seen industry insiders hint to it (Like Colin, actually trustworthy PS insiders), etc. But where is it? With ps4 launch, we had a promise of things to come. The strongest E3 shows PS ever put down was midway between ps3 lifecycle, to the end of Playstation @ E3. Their conferences were amazing showing off even distant titles to keep you excited.

Where are those, now?

Spider-Man 2, Wolverine.

What else? Where is the FPS genre? Where is the next ND game? HECK, where is friggin FACTIONS?

Again, this isn't argument from a PS hater. I am a fan. But you have to learn to criticize things you love if you expect them to not fall into crap you use to love, when it comes to tech. Period. I was around when Pachter thought Sony may go out of business. When N4G was a XBOX only cesspool that dunked heavily on any "good" ps news. I have seen the tide shift, and I am worried that PS future is going to be contentious, especially with the unstoppable consolidation from the main rival.

That's all.

 

[Kerotan]

I would hazard to guess less than 1%.

Even by PS6 8K TV's will be fairly nice.

Any dev with a brain wouldn't go past 4k and will put all extra power into frames.

 

[Kerotan]

Assuming the Pro is coming I can't see it being anything other than a PS4 Pro. i.e 2x GPU plus a few future RDNA features and maybe a larger size SSD.

It better have a bigger SSD. I manage just fine but no excuse we don't get 1GB of actual space for games.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

I actually edited the post, but not in time apparently, to suggest that it is likely you missed the far back beginning of the conversation you were quoting. So I can understand your argument better. No worries, no hard feelings.



Which is why I left it on there.

I do indeed realize that, although games take many years to develop with development of the ps5 games starting well before COVID, so I don't think it helps bolster the fact that nearly 3 full years in we are sorely lacking new, fresh, innovative IPs (outside of Astro).

This is again mimicked in the industry as a whole, not exclusive to PS at all. The difference however has been PS history of exclusives being the system seller. Now, they are drying up on that too. With ps4 being a slight lower average, I think it's still pretty clear that the top of the shelf was stronger. Right off the bat you have UC4, Bloodborne, and KZ: SF. 3 strong names.

Ps5... what competes? For PS exclusives, in particular?

I don't think thats a controversial statement to make, that we are seeing less excitement. We know that GG has been working on a FPS title... we have seen the job listings, seen industry insiders hint to it (Like Colin, actually trustworthy PS insiders), etc. But where is it? With ps4 launch, we had a promise of things to come. The strongest E3 shows PS ever put down was midway between ps3 lifecycle, to the end of Playstation @ E3. Their conferences were amazing showing off even distant titles to keep you excited.

Where are those, now?

Spider-Man 2, Wolverine.

What else? Where is the FPS genre? Where is the next ND game? HECK, where is friggin FACTIONS?

Again, this isn't argument from a PS hater. I am a fan. But you have to learn to criticize things you love if you expect them to not fall into crap you use to love, when it comes to tech. Period. I was around when Pachter thought Sony may go out of business. When N4G was a XBOX only cesspool that dunked heavily on any "good" ps news. I have seen the tide shift, and I am worried that PS future is going to be contentious, especially with the unstoppable consolidation from the main rival.

That's all.

Wait wait wait, hold up. You are misremembering Sony's 1P output in the early PS1 and PS2 years. PS1's first few years were mainly defined by 3P games. Ridge Racer, Tekken Toshinden, Resident Evil, Tomb Raider etc. Wipeout was in there too, but that was Psygnosis who were acquired not long ago. Otherwise Sony's 1P releases in the first three years of PS1 were decent/good games like Crime Crackers and Motor Toon, but those weren't the big system sellers.

PS2 is kind of similar, though I'd say on average the 1P output was stronger in the first three years between games like Dark Cloud, Fantavision and Okage: Shadow King. But again, the big pushers, both in system-sellers and pushing the system's specs, were mostly 3P games. FFX, MGS2, Silent Hill 2, Tekken Tag, Tekken 4, GTA3...I think one of the few exceptions that was 1P was GT3.

Obviously the PS3's launch was weak software-wise and it took a while in the course of the first three years for the system-selling exclusives to drop, like Uncharted, MGS4 and Demon's Souls (and the selling power of those could be considered questionable compared to Halo 3 and Gears of War at the time, TBH). If you want to say PS5's first three years have had a lack of system-selling exclusive compared to past PS consoles, then that finger also has to be pointed at 3P devs/pubs because they were a big component to that for previous PS consoles, IMO. But the 3P front, that's something outside of Sony's control.

I agree with you though on the lack of communication regarding the future of 1P exclusives in terms of traditional games so far, or 3P exclusives that aren't "just" Final Fantasy or new IP. On that front it definitely feels like a step back and I can understand why hearing about a PS5 Pro might not be great in that respect. But that isn't anything a really good Showcase can't address; the PS5 Pro existing or not existing isn't going to change that particular issue, in all honesty.

Also agreed WRT Naughty Dog; I think out of all the Sony 1P studios they've been the most surprisingly little in showing up so far. A remake, a live-service GaaS that's had to undergo redesign and another TLOU sequel likely only just now starting production, plus a no-show (as of yet) for their new AAA IP. I hope we get some substantial update from them at a showcase later this year.

Also IMO, Sony should consider bringing back PlayStation Experience, and Kevin Butler. They really need to communicate with the enthusiast of the console base better; that's one thing I will give Microsoft credit for, even if in their case it goes to an extreme of astroturfing with shills & influencers, and enabling rampant toxicity towards PlayStation. Aside from that, it's allowed them to basically control a large amount of the online gaming narrative for the past feels like couple of years now, the ABK acquisition helping significantly there.

Sony basically just let MS go uncontested in that regard; even if it's "fake" optics (as in doesn't result in material market share shift for Xbox or Microsoft in terms of sales), it's still optics, and they get a little something out of it. Sony should do more to combat that IMO.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

Wait wait wait, hold up. You are misremembering Sony's 1P output in the early PS1 and PS2 years. PS1's first few years were mainly defined by 3P games. Ridge Racer, Tekken Toshinden, Resident Evil, Tomb Raider etc. Wipeout was in there too, but that was Psygnosis who were acquired not long ago. Otherwise Sony's 1P releases in the first three years of PS1 were decent/good games like Crime Crackers and Motor Toon, but those weren't the big system sellers.

PS2 is kind of similar, though I'd say on average the 1P output was stronger in the first three years between games like Dark Cloud, Fantavision and Okage: Shadow King. But again, the big pushers, both in system-sellers and pushing the system's specs, were mostly 3P games. FFX, MGS2, Silent Hill 2, Tekken Tag, Tekken 4, GTA3...I think one of the few exceptions that was 1P was GT3.

Obviously the PS3's launch was weak software-wise and it took a while in the course of the first three years for the system-selling exclusives to drop, like Uncharted, MGS4 and Demon's Souls (and the selling power of those could be considered questionable compared to Halo 3 and Gears of War at the time, TBH). If you want to say PS5's first three years have had a lack of system-selling exclusive compared to past PS consoles, then that finger also has to be pointed at 3P devs/pubs because they were a big component to that for previous PS consoles, IMO. But the 3P front, that's something outside of Sony's control.

I agree with you though on the lack of communication regarding the future of 1P exclusives in terms of traditional games so far, or 3P exclusives that aren't "just" Final Fantasy or new IP. On that front it definitely feels like a step back and I can understand why hearing about a PS5 Pro might not be great in that respect. But that isn't anything a really good Showcase can't address; the PS5 Pro existing or not existing isn't going to change that particular issue, in all honesty.

Also agreed WRT Naughty Dog; I think out of all the Sony 1P studios they've been the most surprisingly little in showing up so far. A remake, a live-service GaaS that's had to undergo redesign and another TLOU sequel likely only just now starting production, plus a no-show (as of yet) for their new AAA IP. I hope we get some substantial update from them at a showcase later this year.

Also IMO, Sony should consider bringing back PlayStation Experience, and Kevin Butler. They really need to communicate with the enthusiast of the console base better; that's one thing I will give Microsoft credit for, even if in their case it goes to an extreme of astroturfing with shills & influencers, and enabling rampant toxicity towards PlayStation. Aside from that, it's allowed them to basically control a large amount of the online gaming narrative for the past feels like couple of years now, the ABK acquisition helping significantly there.

Sony basically just let MS go uncontested in that regard; even if it's "fake" optics (as in doesn't result in material market share shift for Xbox or Microsoft in terms of sales), it's still optics, and they get a little something out of it. Sony should do more to combat that IMO.

I think we agree on nearly everything.

I was more referring to “recent” PlayStation history, which I highlighted by speaking about halfway through ps3 -> ps4.

Exclusive output was a whole different beast in the ps1/2 days. Plenty of 3rd party exclusive support, as you mentioned. Things have changed so incredibly much.

But yeah, we aren’t apart on these arguments. I think we agree mainly.

 

[Pedro Motta]

Assuming the Pro is coming I can't see it being anything other than a PS4 Pro. i.e 2x GPU plus a few future RDNA features and maybe a larger size SSD.

Isn't that the point big brains?

 

[Crispy Gamer]

Same. It's what the PS4Pro was essentially. Sony's launch into reconstruction techniques upscaling to 4K and the like. Same with their pinnacle of scaler engines soc tech in their TVs.

I remember all of the ridicule Sony took for having checkerboard rendering instead of "native" , they probably didn't pioneer reconstruction techniques but they damn sure made it mainstream btw DF Alex has a new video about RTX IO lol now IO matters because Nvidia is ready to release something

 

[Rykan]

Maybe not "coordinated" PR conspiracy, but the timing of DF suddenly bringing up Series X being MS's mid-gen refresh was not coincidence to when MS themselves said they had no mid-gen refresh planned. Because the truth is, there was nor has ever been any marketing by Microsoft that the Series X was their mid-gen system.

In fact, at first they marketed it as their flagship, and that games would be developed with Series X in mind then downscaled to run on the Series S. That's what they convinced many of us to believe. So why are we only hearing about Series X being MS's mid-gen refresh from DF shortly after MS said they have nothing planned for a mid-gen system refresh (outside of the cancelled cloud streaming console)?

I'm not saying MS paid DF to say it; DF may've had their own reasons for putting the narrative out there, maybe repeating it to legitimize it better. The only plausible explanation I can think of WRT Series X as a mid-gen refresh is MS's own statements from Hot Chips 2020, where they said they took the dual-system approach because they weren't sure they could scale production costs down over the gen to make a Series X slim or whatever. But that wouldn't even support the idea they considered the Series X their mid-gen refresh internally.

OTOH if we're to support that Series X actually is their mid-gen refresh, then that supports my theory on Series X & S development, that they were mainly influenced by the One S & One X strategy, meaning Series development probably didn't start until mid-late 2017, or possibly later in 2017, after MS got market feedback from the One S and One X. Which probably also supports a few other things they were doing up to the system's release like parading about being "full RDNA2", because they had to wait on AMD for features to be finished for DX12U support (and Sony may not have needed to wait because they already developed their own forks equivalent to those solutions years earlier since they likely began PS5 development shortly after PS4's launch and didn't scale down R&D at some critical point last gen the way Microsoft did for Xbox).

Now some of that is obviously my own speculation but regarding DF I think it's fair to say, they go out of their way to not challenge certain marketing and messaging points Microsoft put out regarding the Xbox consoles. OTOH, they don't go out of their to do the same with, say, Sony, i.e they will more openly critique and question various claims by Sony and (usually) be forced to accept those claims were correct after fielding tests on them.

If you want to call that "Xbox bias" then hey, fine. But I never necessarily called it that, myself.

The anecdote of DF members saying :"This is what Microsoft told us before the launch of the Series X" was mentioned during their "podcast" in which Digital Foundry members discuss the latest news, and "MS says they have no new console planned" was the topic because MS recently made that statement. What is the catch here?

The reason they don't market Xbox series X as a mid gen refresh is because Mid gen refresh is not a marketing term. It never has been. It's a phrase that was introduced somewhere to describe consoles coming out halfway the typical cycle. It has never been used as a term to market anything. At no point have there been adds saying "Buy PS4 Pro NOW! Our latest Mid gen refresh!" or "One X: The most powerful Mid gen refresh console!".

Again, the only way that Microsoft considers the Series X a "mid gen refresh" is in the sense that they have a base model (Series S) and a more expensive model (Series X). That's it. The segment that you're referring to isn't nearly as exciting as you make it out to be. Have you watched it? I suggest you do.

Okay so you don't call them biased, but you do make completely unfounded and baseless claims about "Coordinated PR" and them not "Challenging certain marketing and messaging points while they more openly critique their competitors?

Ok man.

Sure. I literally offered to send EL my credentials if he request them, though I would have to figure out wtf I still have available after 9ish years out. I have been here a long time. Why would I lie about it? Internet cool points? I literally talked about it extensively not being a glamour job.

Just let it go. Nobody is buying your BS.

"Why would I lie about it" Because you're attempting to speak from a point of authority. You've done that several times already. The fact that you can't even mention in what form (IE THE ACTUAL JOB) you worked in the industry says enough. We're well beyond that point anyway, because there's no position out there that matches the fanfiction that you've created. I don't think you quite realize just how blatantly obvious it is that you've made it up. Your lack of knowledge on the subjects we've discussed instantly give away that you don't have even the slightest clue of what you're talking about.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

If it plays current performance mode games at a locked 60 with the benefits of quality mode and enhanced ray tracing, it will be well worth it.

 

[mrabott]

There is a segment of gamers who just like talking about upgraded existing specs. And there are websites /youtubers with podcasts who like to capitalize on this need to theorize about upgrading existing tech.

There is no PS5 pro.

Macro and Micro, global, economic factors make a PS5 Pro a non starter. But obviously, people will discuss this fake news as if it's real, because...

I agree with everything you wrote. I just don't doubt that both Sony and MS launch pro versions of their devices.

I hope not, but you can't rule out this possible release.

 

[Perrott]

Everything is subjective, I guess - but…

Ps4 launch + first 3 years (end of 2016) had:

• KZ: Shadowfall, graphically ambitious FPS exclusive to next gen.
• Resogun, exclusive to ps4 (for a while),
• Knack
• Driveclub
• Infamous: Second Son
• Bloodborne
• Until Dawn
• Order 1886
• Uncharted 4

All of these were “next gen” exclusive, I believe, with one or two titles ending up being ported backwards (like Resogun). This list doesn’t include last gen ports or multiplat launches. I think that’s right, from memory.

Ps5 first 3 years has had:

• Astro
• Demon Souls (remastered, not sure I should include it but whatever).
• Destruction All Stars
• R&C: Rift Apart
• returnal
• FF VIi
• Ghost wire: Tokyo
• Forespoken
• FF XVI

Right?

I didn’t put Spider-Man or TLOU, because it was literally remasters of a LAST gen game. Same reason I didn’t put the few titles on ps4 from ps3.

Ps4 worse? Meh. All subjective I guess. IMO, probably better + an expectation of stuff they showed at e3 for the future that looked awesome too (sorely lacking that vision now).

Your comparison is very flawed. This is what an appropriate comparison looks like:

PlayStation 4 | Launch (2013)
Big disappointment from the AAA exclusives that should have carried the console launch.

• [73] Killzone: Shadow Fall
• [54] Knack
• [84] Resogun

PlayStation 5 | Launch (2020)
A varied launch lineup with some pretty big names and a high level of quality all around.

• [83] Astro's Playroom
• [92] Demon's Souls
• [85] Marvel's Spider-Man: Miles Morales
• [79] Sackboy: A Big Adventure

PlayStation 4 | Year 1 (2014)
Decent inFAMOUS games and bug-ridden releases of DriveClub and LittleBigPlanet 3.

• [67] CounterSpy
• [71] DriveClub
• [59] Entwined
• [75] Hohokum
  • [73] inFAMOUS: First Light
• [80] inFAMOUS: Second Son
• [79] LittleBigPlanet 3
• [83] MLB 14: The Show

PlayStation 5 | Year 1 (2021)
Despite the flop of Destruction AllStars, it was a solid year overall.

• [88] Deathloop
• [62] Destruction AllStars
  • [81] Final Fantasy VII Remake: Intergrade - Episode INTERmission
  • [84] Ghost of Tsushima: Iki Island
• [81] Kena: Bridge of Spirits
• [78] MLB The Show 21
• [88] Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart
• [86] Returnal

PlayStation 4 | Year 2 (2015)
A year carried by the critical acclaim of Bloodborne and sleeper hit status of Until Dawn, but tainted by the end result of The Order 1886 as well as the lack of a high-profile release later in the year.

• [92] Bloodborne
  • [87] Bloodborne: The Old Hunters
  • [79] DriveClub Bikes
• [78] Everybody's Gone to the Rapture
• [63] Fat Princess Adventures
• [81] Helldivers
• [80] MLB 15: The Show
• [81] Tearaway Unfolded
• [63] The Order 1886
• [79] Until Dawn

PlayStation 5 | Year 2 (2022)
A fantastic year, with a steady flow of high-quality AAA releases from some of PlayStation's biggest franchises.

• [75] GhostWire: Tokyo
• [94] God of War: Ragnarok
• [87] Gran Turismo 7
• [88] Horizon: Forbidden West
• [77] MLB The Show 22
  • [N/A] Returnal: Ascension
• [88] The Last Of Us Part I

PlayStation 4 | Year 3 (2016)
Some amazing releases on the PS4 side of things, but mixed to absolutely terrible results when it comes to PSVR's launch window games and the PSN lineup.

• [79] Alienation
• [71] Bound
• [66] DriveClub VR
• [62] Here They Lie
• [53] Kill Strain
• [72] Let It Die
• [85] MLB The Show 16
• [59] PlayStation VR Worlds
• [85] Ratchet & Clank
• [78] RIGS: Mechanized Combat League
• [64] Shadow of the Beast
• [77] Street Fighter V
• [82] The Last Guardian
• [54] The Tomorrow Children
• [69] Tumble VR
• [93] Uncharted 4: A Thief's End
• [72] Until Dawn: Rush of Blood

PlayStation 5 | Year 3 (2023)
The bad taste of mouth left by Forspoken was kind of mitigated by Final Fantasy XVI and the successful launch of PSVR2. We're now waiting to see how the Firewall, Helldivers and Spider-Man sequels pan out over the course of the second half of the year.

• [87] Final Fantasy XVI
• [N/A] Firewall Ultra
• [64] Forspoken
  • [71] Forspoken: In Tanta We Trust
• [N/A] Helldivers II
• [79] Horizon: Call of the Mountain
  • [82] Horizon: Forbidden West - Burning Shores
• [N/A] Marvel's Spider-Man 2
• [82] MLB The Show 23

In conclusion, the output of games during the early years of the PS5 generation was of a much better quality than in the case of the PS4.

 

[chromhound]

Could mine crypto with that thing

 

[ToTTenTranz]

Demon Souls (remastered, not sure I should include it but whatever).

1. Demon Souls, a remastered game, 92

You don't even know Demon's Souls isn't a remaster...

Okay so you don't call them biased, but you do make completely unfounded and baseless claims about "Coordinated PR" and them not "Challenging certain marketing and messaging points while they more openly critique their competitors?

It's not unfounded to claim Digitalfoundry did coordinated PR for Microsoft when they were chosen/hired to make their specs reveal online.
It's also true that Alex Battaglia came out shouting about the Xbox having a superior GPU when he had no data from Sony to compare against, though I do admit Alex is a special(ly biased) case among the DF members.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Your comparison is very flawed. This is what an appropriate comparison looks like:

PlayStation 4 | Launch (2013)
Big disappointment from the AAA exclusives that should have carried the console launch.

• [73] Killzone: Shadow Fall
• [54] Knack
• [84] Resogun

PlayStation 5 | Launch (2020)
A varied launch lineup with some pretty big names and a high level of quality all around.

• [83] Astro's Playroom
• [92] Demon's Souls
• [85] Marvel's Spider-Man: Miles Morales
• [79] Sackboy: A Big Adventure

PlayStation 4 | Year 1 (2014)
Decent inFAMOUS games and bug-ridden releases of DriveClub and LittleBigPlanet 3.

• [67] CounterSpy
• [71] DriveClub
• [59] Entwined
• [75] Hohokum
  • [73] inFAMOUS: First Light
• [80] inFAMOUS: Second Son
• [79] LittleBigPlanet 3
• [83] MLB 14: The Show

PlayStation 5 | Year 1 (2021)
Despite the flop of Destruction AllStars, it was a solid year overall.

• [88] Deathloop
• [62] Destruction AllStars
  • [81] Final Fantasy VII Remake: Intergrade - Episode INTERmission
  • [84] Ghost of Tsushima: Iki Island
• [81] Kena: Bridge of Spirits
• [78] MLB The Show 21
• [88] Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart
• [86] Returnal

PlayStation 4 | Year 2 (2015)
A year carried by the critical acclaim of Bloodborne and sleeper hit status of Until Dawn, but tainted by the end result of The Order 1886 as well as the lack of a high-profile release later in the year.

• [92] Bloodborne
  • [87] Bloodborne: The Old Hunters
  • [79] DriveClub Bikes
• [78] Everybody's Gone to the Rapture
• [63] Fat Princess Adventures
• [81] Helldivers
• [80] MLB 15: The Show
• [81] Tearaway Unfolded
• [63] The Order 1886
• [79] Until Dawn

PlayStation 5 | Year 2 (2022)
A fantastic year, with a steady flow of high-quality AAA releases from some of PlayStation's biggest franchises.

• [75] GhostWire: Tokyo
• [94] God of War: Ragnarok
• [87] Gran Turismo 7
• [88] Horizon: Forbidden West
• [77] MLB The Show 22
  • [N/A] Returnal: Ascension
• [88] The Last Of Us Part I

PlayStation 4 | Year 3 (2016)
Some amazing releases on the PS4 side of things, but mixed to absolutely terrible results when it comes to PSVR's launch window games and the PSN lineup.

• [79] Alienation
• [71] Bound
• [66] DriveClub VR
• [62] Here They Lie
• [53] Kill Strain
• [72] Let It Die
• [85] MLB The Show 16
• [59] PlayStation VR Worlds
• [85] Ratchet & Clank
• [78] RIGS: Mechanized Combat League
• [64] Shadow of the Beast
• [77] Street Fighter V
• [82] The Last Guardian
• [54] The Tomorrow Children
• [69] Tumble VR
• [93] Uncharted 4: A Thief's End
• [72] Until Dawn: Rush of Blood

PlayStation 5 | Year 3 (2023)
The bad taste of mouth left by Forspoken was kind of mitigated by Final Fantasy XVI and the successful launch of PSVR2. We're now waiting to see how the Firewall, Helldivers and Spider-Man sequels pan out over the course of the second half of the year.

• [87] Final Fantasy XVI
• [N/A] Firewall Ultra
• [64] Forspoken
  • [71] Forspoken: In Tanta We Trust
• [N/A] Helldivers II
• [79] Horizon: Call of the Mountain
  • [82] Horizon: Forbidden West - Burning Shores
• [N/A] Marvel's Spider-Man 2
• [82] MLB The Show 23

In conclusion, the output of games during the early years of the PS5 generation was of a much better quality than in the case of the PS4.

Going by ratings, PS5 wins. Going by new IPs, PS4 wins.

 

[Edgelord79]

Not at $1000 lol. I’m out. At that point I would wait for the PS6.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Your comparison is very flawed. This is what an appropriate comparison looks like:

PlayStation 4 | Launch (2013)
Big disappointment from the AAA exclusives that should have carried the console launch.

• [73] Killzone: Shadow Fall
• [54] Knack
• [84] Resogun

PlayStation 5 | Launch (2020)
A varied launch lineup with some pretty big names and a high level of quality all around.

• [83] Astro's Playroom
• [92] Demon's Souls
• [85] Marvel's Spider-Man: Miles Morales
• [79] Sackboy: A Big Adventure

PlayStation 4 | Year 1 (2014)
Decent inFAMOUS games and bug-ridden releases of DriveClub and LittleBigPlanet 3.

• [67] CounterSpy
• [71] DriveClub
• [59] Entwined
• [75] Hohokum
  • [73] inFAMOUS: First Light
• [80] inFAMOUS: Second Son
• [79] LittleBigPlanet 3
• [83] MLB 14: The Show

PlayStation 5 | Year 1 (2021)
Despite the flop of Destruction AllStars, it was a solid year overall.

• [88] Deathloop
• [62] Destruction AllStars
  • [81] Final Fantasy VII Remake: Intergrade - Episode INTERmission
  • [84] Ghost of Tsushima: Iki Island
• [81] Kena: Bridge of Spirits
• [78] MLB The Show 21
• [88] Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart
• [86] Returnal

PlayStation 4 | Year 2 (2015)
A year carried by the critical acclaim of Bloodborne and sleeper hit status of Until Dawn, but tainted by the end result of The Order 1886 as well as the lack of a high-profile release later in the year.

• [92] Bloodborne
  • [87] Bloodborne: The Old Hunters
  • [79] DriveClub Bikes
• [78] Everybody's Gone to the Rapture
• [63] Fat Princess Adventures
• [81] Helldivers
• [80] MLB 15: The Show
• [81] Tearaway Unfolded
• [63] The Order 1886
• [79] Until Dawn

PlayStation 5 | Year 2 (2022)
A fantastic year, with a steady flow of high-quality AAA releases from some of PlayStation's biggest franchises.

• [75] GhostWire: Tokyo
• [94] God of War: Ragnarok
• [87] Gran Turismo 7
• [88] Horizon: Forbidden West
• [77] MLB The Show 22
  • [N/A] Returnal: Ascension
• [88] The Last Of Us Part I

PlayStation 4 | Year 3 (2016)
Some amazing releases on the PS4 side of things, but mixed to absolutely terrible results when it comes to PSVR's launch window games and the PSN lineup.

• [79] Alienation
• [71] Bound
• [66] DriveClub VR
• [62] Here They Lie
• [53] Kill Strain
• [72] Let It Die
• [85] MLB The Show 16
• [59] PlayStation VR Worlds
• [85] Ratchet & Clank
• [78] RIGS: Mechanized Combat League
• [64] Shadow of the Beast
• [77] Street Fighter V
• [82] The Last Guardian
• [54] The Tomorrow Children
• [69] Tumble VR
• [93] Uncharted 4: A Thief's End
• [72] Until Dawn: Rush of Blood

PlayStation 5 | Year 3 (2023)
The bad taste of mouth left by Forspoken was kind of mitigated by Final Fantasy XVI and the successful launch of PSVR2. We're now waiting to see how the Firewall, Helldivers and Spider-Man sequels pan out over the course of the second half of the year.

• [87] Final Fantasy XVI
• [N/A] Firewall Ultra
• [64] Forspoken
  • [71] Forspoken: In Tanta We Trust
• [N/A] Helldivers II
• [79] Horizon: Call of the Mountain
  • [82] Horizon: Forbidden West - Burning Shores
• [N/A] Marvel's Spider-Man 2
• [82] MLB The Show 23

In conclusion, the output of games during the early years of the PS5 generation was of a much better quality than in the case of the PS4.

Yep.

Using the top 3 games or the average (including indies and otherwise) is a very flawed way to compare. Especially since review scores trend lower with time.

The fact is, Sony has had a much stronger cadence of AAA releases since the PS5 launch versus PS4.

 

[Rykan]

It's not unfounded to claim Digitalfoundry did coordinated PR for Microsoft when they were chosen/hired to make their specs reveal online.
It's also true that Alex Battaglia came out shouting about the Xbox having a superior GPU when he had no data from Sony to compare against, though I do admit Alex is a special(ly biased) case among the DF members.

Sure, but that's not what he said. What you're referring to is just coverage of a promo event. Press events are normal and common.

The Xbox Series X GPU is superior to the one in the PS5, so what is the issue here?

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Get the feeling Sony will stick with Zen 2 but increase the clock frequency. By how much I'm uncertain but maybe as high as 4.5 GHz might be possible depending on the node. The GPU's going to need that for more drawcalls anyway.

But anything like adding more cores, threads, or adding encode/decode support for more instructions in line with Zen 3-5, probably won't happen. They might increase the CPU cache a bit, though.

Yup. On a 5nm node, taking the clock up to 4.2-4.5Ghz wouldn't be too hard. And I definitely can see them increasing cache,thats the best y to increase overall CPU performance without having to actually change much or do anything on the game logic side of things.

Funny thing about the Gears stuff is I didn't even know he was reading from a MS PR script, but it's now been pointed out a few times and I'm just like "...you couldn't even change the order you mentioned the bullet points in, John?".

Considering MS's astroturfing strategy, and knowing how much they love to get influence in enthusiasts circles, I'm not surprised if they in fact buddied up with Digital Foundry for coverage. And you're right, the moment MS decides they're doing a Series X Pro after all, they'll start to say how perfectly fine it is. Just like the media when MS started doing $70 games or increased console prices.

Actually, I wanna know what DF said about the new Series S, curious if they called out the obvious bad value proposition compared to a PS5 Digital being just $50 more, or if they skipped right over it. Or what they were saying about the cloud console for that matter, before it got shelved.

I personally do not see DF as being credible anymore. I don't know why we let these things slide in gaming, but its a literal and obvious conflict of interest, when a company whose job it is to critique or cover gaming tech, is making sponsorship deals with the very companies they are supposed to be covering. How can they possibly maintain their credibility while doing that?

Sure, but that's not what he said. What you're referring to is just coverage of a promo event. Press events are normal and common.

The Xbox Series X GPU is superior to the one in the PS5, so what is the issue here?

Yh, the same way every AMD GPU that has a higher TF number is superior to the nearest Nvidia counterpart right?

 

[Rykan]

Yh, the same way every AMD GPU that has a higher TF number is superior to the nearest Nvidia counterpart right?

Both PS5 and Xbox series X GPU are made by the same manufacturer. The Xbox series X having a more capable GPU is an objective fact.

The outrage over their coverage of a reveal is hilarious. Wait until you find out that literally every gaming press outlet has agreements to cover game reveals and events.

 

[DeVeAn]

Because Microsoft's "mid gen refresh" came out at launch and isn't any more powerful in practice than Sony's base model PS5, while the PS5 pro will actually be what a "mid gen refresh" is supposed to be because it's more powerful. This is why it's not the same concept. Because we know how time works.

Hahahaha ok you win.

 

[CLW]

But will my floppage improve?

 

[0neAnd0nly]

The anecdote of DF members saying :"This is what Microsoft told us before the launch of the Series X" was mentioned during their "podcast" in which Digital Foundry members discuss the latest news, and "MS says they have no new console planned" was the topic because MS recently made that statement. What is the catch here?

The reason they don't market Xbox series X as a mid gen refresh is because Mid gen refresh is not a marketing term. It never has been. It's a phrase that was introduced somewhere to describe consoles coming out halfway the typical cycle. It has never been used as a term to market anything. At no point have there been adds saying "Buy PS4 Pro NOW! Our latest Mid gen refresh!" or "One X: The most powerful Mid gen refresh console!".

Again, the only way that Microsoft considers the Series X a "mid gen refresh" is in the sense that they have a base model (Series S) and a more expensive model (Series X). That's it. The segment that you're referring to isn't nearly as exciting as you make it out to be. Have you watched it? I suggest you do.

Okay so you don't call them biased, but you do make completely unfounded and baseless claims about "Coordinated PR" and them not "Challenging certain marketing and messaging points while they more openly critique their competitors?


Just let it go. Nobody is buying your BS.

"Why would I lie about it" Because you're attempting to speak from a point of authority. You've done that several times already. The fact that you can't even mention in what form (IE THE ACTUAL JOB) you worked in the industry says enough. We're well beyond that point anyway, because there's no position out there that matches the fanfiction that you've created. I don't think you quite realize just how blatantly obvious it is that you've made it up. Your lack of knowledge on the subjects we've discussed instantly give away that you don't have even the slightest clue of what you're talking about.

Ok man.

What a lame hill to die on. EL, feel free to contact me whenever and I can do my best to back up a claim.

It isn’t authority, it’s just I have a bit of insight.

You can believe whatever. I haven’t been particularly hostile with you, not sure why you are so angry at fellow GAF member.

Calling a grown dude a liar about a past job lol. Average age of GAF is MID T H I R T I E S, why in the WORLD would I care to lie in a room of other adults is beyond me. Idk why it offends me so much, I don’t mind people disagreeing with me or my feelings, but calling me a liar is a bit much.

My position, if clarity is actually needed, was in marketing and outreach. The title wouldn’t make a lick of sense to you and likely expose too many specifics I’d rather not devuldge. I didn’t “become” a manager, I was literally hired into the role.

It isn’t a “special” role to manage a team. I had many bosses above me.

I’ll be slightly more specific just to further my legitimatecy, not that you care but in general I don’t like anybody questioning my honesty.

My boss worked, at one point, for Fall Line Studio.

He still works in the industry, elsewhere now. He’s a big shot. Good dude, eclectic. Dabbles in many things.

He personally saw the release of several major games during his roles in different studios.

In my stint, I only saw the discussion of one title, an indie I talked about earlier in the thread.

It isn’t fanfic. Geez I wish someone else here worked in the industry in a similar position.

You go to many BORING meetings and conferences. You hang and talk with people, my goodness. You make it sound like I am speaking of some lucrative and special job. It isn’t.

I happened to be a part of the industry pre ps4 launch and got to oversee that inside. That’s why I can attest to certain things like “I know they aren’t fully maxing potential”. It was a problem in the 4/ One generation, and it is still a problem now.

I’m sorry there isn’t anything I can do to please you. I hope you let your vile disdain for a random with an opposite opinion go. GAF has always been great because it was and is a great community. Dislike my opinion all you want, but it’s extremely immature to question my honesty, when I feel as though I have given enough specifics to make it OBVIOUS I am not lying.

Forget my “authority”. I am not at all that, I simply do have insight, legitimately, whether you like to hear it or not.

My second stint was nothing more than doing media coverage for a small media spin off. Our most famous article (per click and share) was an article previewing PSVR prior to it launching… funny enough.

That is closed, sold off and shuttered. Didn’t last long, but was fun as I got to dabble in a lot more local events, including giveaways for cool gaming items.

Hope your night is great, do try not to have so much anger towards a rando, if you could. I’ve been here a while and would never want to damage my reputation by lying.