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Sackboy: A Big Adventure reportedly found on SteamDB
- Thread starter Draugoth
- Start date
Gen.Grievous
Member
Asking the real questions.
SoloKingRobert
Banned
Remember Xbox? Where are those gamers that said what's the point owning an Xbox if I can play all their games on PC?
AV
We ain't outta here in ten minutes, we won't need no rocket to fly through space
This thread needs at least ONE post about the game from somebody who actually played it, so here it is; it's a really neat, cute little platformer that you shouldn't spend $60 on. It might come to PC in a month but it's still one that you should wait for a sale to buy.
You can go back to arguing about why Sony shouldn't be making more money with PC ports now.
You can go back to arguing about why Sony shouldn't be making more money with PC ports now.
PaintTinJr
Member
I'm still playing sack boy most days - with the family - as my youngest wants us to rinse the game completely, so it is certainly a game that deserves a big audience in my book and is a lot of fun with plenty of 3D platforming challenges.
Even though it looks great and the load times are quite small - on PS5 at least - and the original music scores and reworked chart music is expertly used, the game does still look like it could have been made in PS4's dreams, and with the PS4 hardware having struggled to ever be next-gen compared to a Core i3 and a nvidia GTX 660 (at £500), there really isn't anything other than business reasons why any of these cross-gen or PS4 gen games couldn't be ported to run at 1080p60 or better on lots of PCs.
That's really a legacy of the PS3 loss leading hardware strategy having real competition against the Wii/360 to nearly ruin Sony. Cerny had very little budget/options to deliver a profitable day-one PS4 better than what he did, and the technical argument for putting all PS4 exclusives on PC at day-one could have been made back in 2015, IMO.
With the new generation having set the hardware bar much higher with a dedicated decompression unit like a RTX IO card, a 5.5GB/s raw nvme SSD read speed and graphics card fill-rate and compute above a PC with a 6 core, Core-i5 with RTX 3060 - costing £1,000 or more - and with chip shortages getting worse the same argument is unlikely to be equally made for cheap £500 PCs outclassing the PS5 for 5years, at least. So if this trend of delivering PS exclusives to PC continues for PS5 exclusively designed software, then PS5 gamers should rightfully be wondering : why are Sony selling me a bespoke console? If the answer is merely that PS5 offers more bang for the price - and they just want more profits - I think that short-term strategy will damage PlayStation massively. If the answer is that they can deliver a prebuilt PS5 PC - that can run Windows/Linux too - that is profitable hardware and fit a huge price gap in the market, while shortages for GPUs persist - and maybe if this is the last PlayStation, so being used to transition PlayStation to be a PC brand - then that would make a lot more sense.
Even though it looks great and the load times are quite small - on PS5 at least - and the original music scores and reworked chart music is expertly used, the game does still look like it could have been made in PS4's dreams, and with the PS4 hardware having struggled to ever be next-gen compared to a Core i3 and a nvidia GTX 660 (at £500), there really isn't anything other than business reasons why any of these cross-gen or PS4 gen games couldn't be ported to run at 1080p60 or better on lots of PCs.
That's really a legacy of the PS3 loss leading hardware strategy having real competition against the Wii/360 to nearly ruin Sony. Cerny had very little budget/options to deliver a profitable day-one PS4 better than what he did, and the technical argument for putting all PS4 exclusives on PC at day-one could have been made back in 2015, IMO.
With the new generation having set the hardware bar much higher with a dedicated decompression unit like a RTX IO card, a 5.5GB/s raw nvme SSD read speed and graphics card fill-rate and compute above a PC with a 6 core, Core-i5 with RTX 3060 - costing £1,000 or more - and with chip shortages getting worse the same argument is unlikely to be equally made for cheap £500 PCs outclassing the PS5 for 5years, at least. So if this trend of delivering PS exclusives to PC continues for PS5 exclusively designed software, then PS5 gamers should rightfully be wondering : why are Sony selling me a bespoke console? If the answer is merely that PS5 offers more bang for the price - and they just want more profits - I think that short-term strategy will damage PlayStation massively. If the answer is that they can deliver a prebuilt PS5 PC - that can run Windows/Linux too - that is profitable hardware and fit a huge price gap in the market, while shortages for GPUs persist - and maybe if this is the last PlayStation, so being used to transition PlayStation to be a PC brand - then that would make a lot more sense.
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mansoor1980
Gold Member
sackboy?
SSfox
Member
Anyway very disappointed on Sony. Not bringing full bc to ps5 to the loyale playstation fans, but they definitely have time to port ps games to PC.
Gotta give it to ms here with bc, Xbox fan can play all Halo games on Xbox series, but the playstation fan who want to play old GOW games on ps5 can go fuck himself, the new leaders at playstation have no honor or dignity.
Gotta give it to ms here with bc, Xbox fan can play all Halo games on Xbox series, but the playstation fan who want to play old GOW games on ps5 can go fuck himself, the new leaders at playstation have no honor or dignity.
yurinka
Member
PS5 is full BC with PS4 and has more PS2 games than MS has OG XBox games. Can't emulate PS3 because it's technically impossible with like half of its catalog including many of its most popular games.
We have a total of zero facts to back the claim that this Steam project is Sackboy. Even if it's a Sumo game, which there is only the weak fact of having a folder named sumoqa, Sumo has many studios so it can be another game. And even if it's Sackboy, to have a Steam depot only means they are developing it so we have no idea which year is going to be released.
And even if it's Sackboy, it's coming soon they are Sumo Digital. They make 2nd party games, don't work on console hardware or firmware updates. It's a separate division and budget. And that other division and budget know that first proper PS3 emulation isn't possible in PS4/PS5 and that if they don't put more effort there is because most people don't give a shit and isn't a good business for them. If tons of people would play the PS2 games they have in PSN or PS Now for PS4 & PS5, or PS1 games they had in PSP/Vita/PS3, they would put more effort there. If they don't do it it's because there isn't enough interest from the players there.
Regarding the new leaders, they got their current position about a year before the PS5 release so the hardware was pretty much complete and being tested so weren't able to change it to include PS3 BC.
Yes, it's what Sony said and what they are doing.
They may release a few MP focused F2P/GaaS games day one or only a few months later on PC (as they did with Helldivers) but other than that they won't release all their games on PC and the ones ported will be released years later of their original PS release.
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winjer
Gold Member
Of course it's possible, but because the arquitecture is so weird, especially Cell, it makes it very difficult and expensive.
It's not worth it to go through so much trouble, when companies can just port the PC version for most games and call it a remaster.
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skit_data
Member
I think its entirely possible for a PS5 to brute force PS3 emulation, I managed to get Demon’s Souls running on my iMac from late 2013 via RPCS3 (it ran at like 20 fps with horrible dips though, probably because of not having enough CPU overhead). A PS5 with a Zen2 should easily be able to handle it with twice the amount of CPU cores and a much more efficient architecture.
If there is a will there is a way, but evidently there’s no will from Sonys side. Maybe because they plan on releasing their bigger titles as remakes or something.
Md Ray
Member
If Xbox One could emulate Xbox 360 games then PS5 can emulate PS3 games. The fact that RPCS3 is running smoothly on Zen 2 PCs further proves it, Sony just doesn't wanna do it.
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yurinka
Member
It would be impossible to emulate it properly without extra hardware (in fact Sony patented a physical add-on for BC pretty likely do to this, which doesn't mean they will release it commercially), here you have the RPCS3 developer and an Insomniac Sony ICE Team programmer mentioning it:
Without it they woud be able to emulate some games more than RPCS3 and better due to having access to the source code and hardware documentation, but SPUs emulation would still be limited and not achieving full speed which mean that around a third of the console's catalog that uses SPUs or rely more on them wouldn't be supported because it would have major issues or would run at a shitty perfomance. It would make more sense for them to remaster/remake the game for PS4/PS5 hardware or -for multiplatform games- to port the PC version.
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01011001
Banned
dude... you can play MGS4 on a PC with similar specs to the PS5 at better than original PS3 framerates and resolution upped to 1080p+... what are you talking about?
63% of all PS3 games are playable on RPCS3 already
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winjer
Gold Member
LOL. Very different things here.
The Xenon CPU is a somewhat traditional CPU.
Basically a triple core PPE, with SMT and VMX128.
The Cell CPU has only one PPE, that is not the real problem.
The issue is the SPEs.
If you pay attention to the whole video, you will find out that it's possible to emulate the SPEs. Something that rpcs3 has done for several games.
But having dedicated hardware would simplify things a lot. In the case on emulation on PC, there is no way AMD or Intel would add this hardware. Thus, it has to be done in software, the hard way.
But Sony owns the hardware on it's consoles, so they could add hardware to do this, and go the easy way. But this also has costs.
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CuteFaceJay
Member
All these PS games on 3090 LETS GOOOOO!
Md Ray
Member
Still doesn't change the fact that you can emulate SPEs with 8C/16T Zen 2 APU. See RPCS3.
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winjer
Gold Member
RPCS3 took years, and many man hours to get to where it's at. But even now, it's far from perfect.
The fact that the RPCS3 was able to get to this point in no way means, emulating Cell is as easy as emulations Xenon.
It just means that the RPCS3 team as put a lot of effort and talent into the project.
AV
We ain't outta here in ten minutes, we won't need no rocket to fly through space
"New" leaders? Playstation has had bad BC in everything after the original 60gb PS3 15 years ago.
01011001
Banned
and it also means that we know that at least 63% of all PS3 games can run on a Zen 2 CPU... these 63% is only counting games that are playable from start to finish without gamebreaking bugs btw. add a bunch of games on top of that that are playable but have issues
Md Ray
Member
That's right. Sony should be able to pull this off on PS5 with all the resources they've got, with even better results than the RPCS3 team delivered.
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winjer
Gold Member
Sony is a company, publicly traded, so they have to justify every investment they make.
Investing so much time and money on a project like this is not justifiable for Sony.
Especially when they can just sell all those PS3 games as remasters. And make even more money.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Nah, I coped with it. If Sony's happy with it and it helps them fork up some extra money for even better games then I'm cool with it.
yurinka
Member
There is no problem on emulating the PPE. In the video the RPCS3 developer says PS5 wouldn't be able to emulate SPUs (+ their related memory management) without adding a related hardware to its motherboard and Rob Wyatt, an Insomniac and ICE Team member programmer adds:
"Emulating the PS3 will be tricky. The most dificult thing of all would be the SPUs, to this day -over 15 years later - they are in a class of their own. Sustained sincle core performance on a SPU is still higher than most anything in the market today.
You technically could emulate it but at a way slower, unplayable performance.
Over a third of the catalog isn't playable in RPCS3, because these games use/rely on SPUs too much. SPUs (included in the SPEs) and their related memory management can't be properly emulated at playable performace in current top tier PCs.
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winjer
Gold Member
The RPCS3 team already has emulated them in several games.
It's slower than doing in hardware, of course. But it can run well enough on current PC hardware.
yurinka
Member
The games that are decently playable on current PC hardware are the ones who don't use SPUs or almost don't use them. There is over a third of the PS3 catalog still not properly emulated, not capable of reaching playable performance or getting crashes. And this is using certain Intel tech not available in AMD CPUs to emulate the SPUs, so not possible on PS5 because it doesn't have that tech. The RPCS3 dev and ICE Team programmer mention there it isn't possible to properly emulate PS3 with PS5 hardware.
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winjer
Gold Member
Really. 63% of all games released on the PS3 make no use of any of the SPEs?
usp84
Member
The worst thing is that it is the one game that needs a PC release.Almost every other Sony game is already 60fps on PS5 with great quality but Bloodborne is stuck at barely 30.
yurinka
Member
SPUs are included in SPE. The problematic ones are SPUs. And yes, many games don't use them at all or only make a very limited, traditional usage. Only a few games use them intensely on an optimized way to take full advantage of them. Very likely some of these 63% aren't playable due to other issues that over time will be fixed so the % of playable games will increase but most of them will continue as unplayable.
And the trick for decent performance is limited to some Intel CPUs, as of now not available for AMD CPUs.
CrimsonSquall
Member
I mean do you seriously think the people that would buy a PS5 from PC would just buy a couple old games and call it a day?
No it would obviously snowball into more and more games bought just for being in the ecosystem. Most games PS are known for arent even multiplayer so that was a random point.
winjer
Gold Member
You do realize that now only RCPS3 emulates SPUs, but that users can define how many threads can be assigned for SPUs and SPURs.
And RCPS3 is already emulating games that do use SPUs. Stop trying to make up arguments.
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OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
This is a good game. My girlfriend and I played it through co-op. It's up there with a good Mario game.
Gameplaylover
Member
Yes, most pc owners only get the games they can't play on pc.
Why, if they can get them cheaper, in better quality, without online costs, with mod support and with better control options on pc?
Self quote: "Why would a pc owner pay for online gaming or play 3rd party games in worse quality", but there are also several Sony exclusives with online components.
yurinka
Member
I don't make up arguments, I quoted the RCPS3 dev and ICE Team programmer several times (won't repeat it again, if you don't read it's your issue) and posted the video where they explain it what I'm saying (the quotes are from there).
The video explains why some games are properly emulated on PC, why others are only properly emulated on some Intel CPUs, why others aren't playable in RCPS3 and why current PS5 hardware won't be able to properly emulate SPUs unless they add extra hardware to its motherboard in a future reviion and put a lot of work into it.
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winjer
Gold Member
You are misinterpreting the devs.
From emulating SPUs is slow and difficult, to it's impossible and 63% of PS3 games don't use SPUs.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
I meant I just warned you via Discord to keep an eye on Bryank since I knew you guys were in the same channel
PropellerEar
Member
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CrimsonSquall
Member
Is there a statistic on that? Online pays for itself on playstation as ps plus gives u a bunch of games in a years time.as well. U aren’t just paying for online with ps plus
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jhjfss
Member
Bo_Hazem
Banned
I meant I just warned you via Discord to keep an eye on Bryank since I knew you guys were in the same channel
Yeah I'm an extreme Sony fanboy for various reasons beyond gaming, but healthy Sony is good Sony to me. If this pans out perfectly for them then good for them and us, if not they'll revert to their old methods.
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yurinka
Member
No, the RCPS3 dev says that to emulate them properly in PS5 Sony would need to add SPU hardware to its motherboard, the ICE Team+Insomniac dev says the SPUs sustained single core performance is higher than most anything in the market, and there are half a dozen of them. And this isn't the only problem, their related memory management and synchronization is a pain in the ass too for other reaons (like having less registers than PS3 etc).
PS3 games not taking advantage or even using at all SPUs is also known and mentioned in the video.
Guilty_AI
Member
Funny because i've been addicted to Beamng lately, one of these imagined PC only games.Imagined PC exclusives
Would i cry in forums if it got ported to consoles?
No, because thats dumb
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yurinka
Member
Learn to read, I explained it too much times and won't repead it again. The 'extra hardware' bit is for PS5 and is a sentence from the RPCS3 dev.
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PropellerEar
Member
Nobody wants that ported and you still squeezed a few tears.Funny because i've been addicted to Beamng lately, one of these imagined PC only games.
Would i cry in forums if it got ported to consoles?
No, because thats dumb
