Nobody is forcing her to play the Major. And she would have to be dense to be ignorant of the white washing that goes on in Hollywood and not understand how her whiteness plays a role in it.
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Scarlett Johansson talks sexism, sidesteps 'Ghost in the Shell' controversy
- Thread starter lightskintwin
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Nobody is forcing her to play the Major. And she would have to be dense to be ignorant of the white washing that goes on in Hollywood and not understand how her whiteness plays a role in it.
Matt Damon is easy to mistake for someone else, i keep confusing him with Mark Wahlberg, curiously the one time they were in the same movie did help lessen it.
Im sure cursing, blood and nudity would help too!
lightskintwin
Banned
Yeah, definitely agree with all that. People tend to forget the major reason African Americans have had any type of success is they had to circumvent the system and create and support their own starting with Blaxploitation films in the 70's. Where would a lot of Black actors be without Black films and TV shows, and Black filmmakers casting them.
H.Cornerstone
Member
With WIll Smith I was holding how poorly his movies did critically and on Rotten Tomatoes more than anything else.
Will Smith has only been in 10 fresh movies since Six Degrees of Separation nearly 25 years ago. Only two of those were over 80% (Six Degrees and Men in Black), and another two were over 70% (Enemy of the State and I Am Legend).
Audiences have never cared much about critical reviews of Will Smith films.
Valdfellgar
Banned
I knew I wasn't the only one! And my wife acted like I was insane!
My wife couldn't follow the departed because she though Damon, Wahlberg, and DiCaprio all looked the same in that film. I still make fun of her for it.
The best acting Will Smith has done was the Fresh Prince and The Pursuit of Happyness. He's not a good movie actor, but I'm glad he's successful despite being mediocre because white mediocrity seems to be the only thing that gets rewarded these days.
lightskintwin
Banned
You're making a general statement without adjusting different variables such as different eras, the types of film, and the differences between a mixed critical consensus to an awful critical consensus.
Nonsense. Will Smith is a good movie actor in the right roles, but more importantly, he has the "it factor" as a leading man that so many in Hollywood lack and is amongst the very short list as an actual bankable star. I can't even believe you then made a false equivalency and compared him to White mediocrity. Wow.
Jlaw is an oscar winning actress who people actually like/dislike for her personality. The Gits actress is coasting on her sex appeal and is usually a boring and passable actress.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
Seriously. ScarJo's acting in Her was terrible and all about coasting on her looks.
Maintenance
Member
lightskintwin
Banned
The controversy would still exist. This isn't occurring in an vacuum.
Maintenance
Member
There's always controversy, for anything. It isn't an on-off switch, so minimizing it is better than just saying fuck it.
BronsonLee
Member
EoT was also based on a light novel that nobody gave a fuck about
lightskintwin
Banned
LOL I feel you, it's just the Asian American representation issue isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
BronsonLee
Member
Sculli no
not like this
The Major
It isn't gonna matter because once we take over America all the movies are going to star us with Matt Damon as the sidekick
Haven't seen it but given the story, im sure her image had to do with the the casting. And Im not saying shes never put in a good performance in her career. But there's no comparison between the two.
Don't worry. No more action movie roles once she gets old.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
I understand this argument for other films and cases of whitewashing. But if the race of the character has no significance to defining that character, why does it matter?
The entire point of Ghost in the Shell is that the SHELLs that they inhabit can be any race, any gender as it's a world that blurs the boundaries and completely disintegrates those distinctions. Getting mad that the sleeve being inhabited isn't identifiably Asian in appearance is to ignore the entire point of this property.
Well Johansson is no Chastain or Mulligan. But I still find her well above Lawrence talent-wise. Who only isn't just mediocre actor but also seems like really obnoxious person. And Johansson seems to go after for more diverse and interesting roles, can't imagine Lawrence sticking around to do film like Under the Skin.
And I don't know how casting a japanese actor would make the movie better by default, while I agree that it's a missed opportunity to cast one in a Hollywood action film.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
lol. Maybe you should actually watch Her.
lightskintwin
Banned
Most people understand this but you realize it conveniently maintains the status quo as well and continues to exclude others, right?
Can you not understand Asian Americans feelings of not only can we not get cast as leads in any Hollywood original stories or Western adaptations of Western media, we can't even get cast in these adaptations of Asian media.
That's the issue, not whether or not Scarlett Johanssen's casting can be conveniently explained within the source material.
Revamping the setting a la Edge of Tomorrow wouldn't erase the problem but at least it wouldn't be so blatantly insulting as to use Asia and Asians as set decorations. We already know it's going to be set somewhere analogous to Hong Kong or Tokyo, which just makes everything even more aggravating.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
And I understand that anxiety. It stinks. But there needs to be an acknowledgement that for big budget, non-franchise films, a studio isn't going to risk going with an unknown because they need audiences to recognise a name to bring their attention to a project.
It's the same reason why Asian adaptations of Western properties feature all-Asian casts.
It would be great if there were Asian stars with that kind of name recognition in the west, but there simply isn't. So short of getting an IP whose director has name recognition like Cameron or Spielberg or Nolan, it likely won't happen.
Maybe if audiences flocked to more indie dramas that headlined Asian talent, we could get momentum behind an Asian name to the point where the confidence would be there for them to carry a film for a studio.
SuperStiltzkin
Member
I hate this argument because it's not like she's gonna be played by anyone other than Scarlett Johannsen if there's gonna be a sequel. They're not gonna switch shells. I'd rather they make her Maureen Kowalski instead of Motoko Kusanagi, Asian woman trapped in a white body.
Luckily the movie seems to be sticking with the ambiguous "Major."
eyeball_kid
Member
So why is Japan unable to create action movies credible and mainstream enough to make it big in the west? Import some Hollywood actors, give the lead to a Japanese woman. Is it lack of local production talent? Lack of budget?
I'd love to see a sequel to Lost in Translation where they meet up again.
I'd love to see a sequel to Lost in Translation where they meet up again.
lightskintwin
Banned
Asian Countries are much more homogenous than America, that's not a good analogy, not to mention that Hollywood big budget films are shown all over the world. Quit making this false equivalency otherwise, Denzel and Will Smith wouldn't be two of the biggest stars in Hollywood.
Everybody understands the machinations that put Scarlett Johanssen in a position to be the lead of this movie. This constant need to repeat it ad infinitum honestly comes across as distracting from the conversation, rather than actually engaging the heart of the issue and more importantly, look to fix this systemic issue. That is unless of course, you consider it an issue in the first place.
Language and American cultural dominance probably plays the biggest part.
Zoe
Member
Nobody wants to watch a big budget movie in Japanese.
GuitarAtomik
Member
Mostly budget. You'd see something bigger budget come out of China first (and we kind of do nowadays) but that's because their market is exponentially larger.
lightskintwin
Banned
That still has nothing to do with its success in the West, as you just noted Chinese films don't do well here regardless of their budget, on the rare times they're even shown here in wide availability in theaters.
Never seems to be a problem for white actors.
What are some recent, good Japanese action movies that are not anime or based on anime? I can only think of 13 Assassins, which is excellent.
Honestly I don't even understand your post. You want a Japanese studio to make action movies starring Hollywood actors? I don't think Japan cinema cares much about appealing to the west.
eyeball_kid
Member
I meant a movie in English, designed primarily as an export film to the west, but featuring local talent (plus some Hollywood actors to make it bankable). I mean wasn't that basically what happened with The Great Wall?
lightskintwin
Banned
English isn't their cultural language. You're basically asking why hasn't Japan whitewashed itself in their media in order to appeal to the West. Films in and of themselves are cultural products.
Zoe
Member
Why would they bother? They have a healthy industry that can survive on its own.
I want to say she means that she would never play a character who, script-wise, was written as a particular race other than "white" or "neutral/non-human," even if the source material had to be changed to accommodate that. Basically, no blackface or yellowface for her.
Positive, widespread media representation matters in the real world in terms of diversifying hiring standards in front of and behind the camera, talent pools, and giving marginalized groups and demographics positive role models and aspirations.
Race generally doesn't matter in most anime properties because most of them are coming from a homogenized Japanese context where everyone is the same race anyway, or in the case of properties like DBZ, the same "culture" where Goku may be an alien, but he's still "Japanese."
But ultimately, GitS is still ostensibly a "Japanese" property, and when adapted in a multicultural society like America where there's a context of minority exclusion from headlining major films even if their source materials are foreign, it's disingenuous to use the original context of cultural homogenity to balk at people understandably annoyed that a Japanese property isn't being headlined by a Japanese actor or actress in what could be a breakout blockbuster hit. It's a blatant Thermian argument that doesn't address the point people are really hammering at, and it's one that's self-defeating too, because if there's no reason for the Shells to be Japanese then there's no reason for them to be white either, and thus no reason to really defend the decision on the grounds of colorblindness.
I am somewhat pleased to see so many Asian Americans and Asians, in general, working behind the scenes in writing, directing, etc. It would be nice to see that impact on screen one day. While I'm a huge fan of foreign cinema it would be nice to see native English speakers get some shine because that is my reality. My reality is not Chow Yun Fat struggling to get through his lines.
eyeball_kid
Member
lol whitewashing itself? what? Because they would speak English? It's a chance to have Japanese actors in starring roles that they are getting passed on by Hollywood, and to build up their industry so that Japanese actors who want to make it big don't have to go to Hollywood and be stuck in the second and third tier.
She plays a more advanced Siri in Her. A voice only operating aystem AI.
lightskintwin
Banned
Yes, whitewashing itself. Conforming to the dominant culture. Asian Film Industries in India, China, S.Korea, Japan, etc... are thriving and self-subsisting without having to do that.
And that still doesn't address Asian American actors who can speak English Fluently and yet are underutilized by America in general, yet alone Asian adapted propreties.
Isn't the deeper problem the lack of consistent work for minority actresses? It's difficult for minority actresses to land these roles because they don't get consistent work in mainstream films to build a resume.
Johansson worked regularly in mainstream Hollywood films for years and then landed the role of Black Widow. She even co-starred in a big budget film 12 years ago (The Island).
Studios and those in charge of casting should take the blame.
Johansson worked regularly in mainstream Hollywood films for years and then landed the role of Black Widow. She even co-starred in a big budget film 12 years ago (The Island).
Studios and those in charge of casting should take the blame.
Zoe
Member
This, a million times.
lightskintwin
Banned
Did you even read the OP?
I think the problem is that the little steps is all Hollywood is willing to take and they are satisfied with stopping there. So this is good for white actresses who are given a chance like in the new Star Wars, Hunger Games, etc. However, this does not address the issue of PoC who are not getting roles. So good for the small steps, but keep pushing to take the next step and not settle for white actresses as part of the cast meaning a movie has solved the diversity issue.
This is a huge problem with the left recently. It's why we have Trump. You got Jill Stien calling out Democrat senators today for example.
All or nothing with a herd of cats will always get you nothing.
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