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[Tom Nook]

Mad Max, The Revenant, The Dark Night Rises

LOL indeed

2 of the films are based on popular franchises and the other is because of Leo.

 

[Feel the Swift]

An actor being in a few box office hits doesn't make them bankable stars. You don't become a bankable star unless you carry an original IP poorly reviewed movie like ScarJo did with Lucy.

Well he was the lead roles in the first two and the main villain in the third. Also didn't know you set the definition for bankable star. There's a reason I said recently anyways.

 

[Inferno313]

Mad Max, The Revenant, The Dark Night Rises

LOL indeed

hahaha

ok dude

 

[kswiston]

Scarlett Johansson was cast in GitS because she is the Black Widow, and Lucy made Jason Bourne money. She's currently the most viable female action star out there. I don't think that anyone is denying the logic in casting SJ.

She could just say that the character wasn't explicitly Asian/Japanese in this version based on the script she got when she was approached, and that she was interested in the part. She's currently the most visible female action star in the world. I don't think it would be hypocrisy to say that Asian American actresses have a tough time getting roles, while saying that this particular role went to her instead of an unknown of Japanese actress because she is a big, worldwide name. She doesn't need to sidestep the issue, although I can see how it would be an awkward one to address.

 

[Feel the Swift]

People saw all those movies purely because of Tom Hardy. Yup.

So the production team just randomly chose him for no reason to fit the roles?

2 of the films are based on popular franchises and the other is because of Leo.

Mad Max hasn't been popular in the mainstream for awhile though. I still think he was chosen for the other two roles for good reason.

hahaha

ok dude

Anyways I'm out, GAF dismissing comments like they know everything once again. That was an easy ignore.

 

[geestack]

You realize change takes time? Women of color won't get a landslide of roles after this movie. Of course not. But the idea is to show audiences that women can be badasses in action movies as well.

Twenty years ago this movie wouldn't have happened. Absolutely no way would it ever be greenlit. We've come a long way where a major action release can star a woman and it's not instantly condemned.

In twenty more years, it might be commonly acceptable, which helps women of color. As more movies with female leads are successful, audiences become accustomed to it and the risk in making those movies becomes lower. This means more roles for all women, including women of color.

The issue here is not with ScarJo. It's not with the director. It's not with whoever did casting. It's not with the investors or the board of directors who would have rejected an Asian actress. All of these people are simply reacting to the problem in a rational way.

The problem is that people who watch movies in America (and Europe, to some extent) subconsciously are less likely to want to see a movie with an Asian female lead (or Asian male for that matter). People like to watch films where they can connect with the actors and actresses and America's Asian population is relatively tiny compared to other races. Obviously it's easier to connect to someone you can relate with better. This means race does play a factor. That's an innate part of humanity. You can't change it.

What you can do is minimize it. Go to a theater for a movie with a black lead and you're going to see a disproportionately higher amount of black people there. Same with Asian. Or Indian. Same with women. It's true for a white lead as well, though likely not nearly as much. White leads are more accepted. We know that. Minorities are ok with white leads because they've been so exposed to them.

This can work in inverse as well. It can work with gender too. But the process is slow. It takes a long time. You need to change the way an entire country thinks by slowly showing the audience that this different thing is ok. You can't force the issue. It will never work that way. The industry would collapse completely before it worked or (more likely) the people pushing it would go out of business and would be replaced by people without the same desire for social equality.

It takes time. This movie is a step in the right direction. But it's not going to take us to the finish line. That doesn't mean ScarJo is wrong. It's still a victory. It's just not the victory.

this is argument is always used to tell people of color to wait their turn. gotta get the white people eating first, then the others can feast on the scraps.

 

[lightskintwin]

Mad Max, The Revenant, The Dark Night Rises

Tom Hardy had little if anything to do with The Revenant's success. That was a Dicaprio Led film. He had nothing to do with The Dark Night Rises.

Now Mad Max could be an indicator of consistent performance as a bankable lead in big budget films but he hasn't put himself out there for us to know one or not if he's a bankable star like bankable stars have done.

 

[Inferno313]

So the production team just randomly chose him for no reason to fit the roles?

Anyways I'm out, GAF dismissing comments like they know everything once again.

We've gone over and come to a consensus on what exactly a "bankable star" is in this thread multiple times. It's not our fault you wanted to jump into the conversation without getting caught up.

Tom Hardy is a very talented movie star, but he doesn't open up films on his own.

 

[freeofgreed]

What on earth are you talking about? I'm not defending the casting at all. I've criticized it in this thread, and in many others. My posts in this thread have been an attempt to provide context and examination into why exactly these casting decisions get made. Not to justify them. To criticize a system requires an understanding of the why's and how's of said system.

"They should just cast an asian unknown" is an uninformed fantasy that doesn't understand the systemic issues at play, at all. THAT's the shit that won't change the state of diversity casting.

We all know why it's done, it's just that we don't find it an acceptable answer. And the solution very much is to hire asian actors, if not that then what is?

 

[John Kowalski]

I didn't even know Tom Hardy was Bane until like two weeks ago.

 

[Feel the Swift]

Tom Hardy had little if anything to do with The Revenant's success. That was a Dicaprio Led film. He had nothing to do with The Dark Night Rises.

Now Mad Max could be an indicator of consistent performance as a bankable lead in big budget films but he hasn't put himself out there for us to know one or not if he's a bankable star like bankable stars have done.

Fair enough. I think he does a great job. Maybe after a couple more he will stick.

 

[Setsuna]

Mad Max, The Revenant, The Dark Night Rises

LOL indeed

Tom Hardy was in the revenant?

FITZGERALD WAS TOM HARDY?

 

[Lebron]

So the production team just randomly chose him for no reason to fit the roles?

lol that doesn't make them bankable. By your logic, Michelle Rodriguez and Zoe Saladana are some of the most bankable stars out there.



But you ran on off from the court with hurt feels, so whatever.

 

[Deepwater]

We all know why it's done, it's just that we don't find it an acceptable answer. And the solution very much is to hire asian actors, if not that then what is?

1. Asian Actors/Actresses are unknown because people don't cast them
2. People complain about this
3. Critics retort "do you expect studios to just cast unknown people? That doesn't help the situation!"
4. See #1

 

[kswiston]

Tom Hardy had little if anything to do with The Revenant's success. That was a Dicaprio Led film. He had nothing to do with The Dark Night Rises.

Now Mad Max could be an indicator of consistent performance as a bankable lead in big budget films but he hasn't put himself out there for us to know one or not if he's a bankable star like bankable stars have done.

Tom Hardy stars in a lot of films, many of which don't even get wide releases. I think that in itself is an indication of box office draw. He gets roles because he is a competent actor with a lot of diversity (he can do physical roles as well as roles that rely more on dialogue). No shame in that.

 

[Inferno313]

We all know why it's done, it's just that we don't find it an acceptable answer. And the solution very much is to hire asian actors, if not that then what is?

It's on the studios to hire asian actors, but it's also on us as film fans to support asian actors so that studios take note. When a quality american film with an asian lead like Kumiko, The Treasure Hunter comes out. You should do your best to make it a priority to give that film your money.

 

[GuitarAtomik]

Mad Max, The Revenant, The Dark Night Rises

LOL indeed

Lol come on.

The Revanant: Stars Leonardo DiCaprio and 90% of marketing focused on him alone surviving in the wilderness.

The Dark Knight Rises: Is a Batman movie (the third of which) and Hardy is unrecognizable, has a mask on for 99% of it and does a voice that's unrecognizable. I'd bet most people who saw that movie have no clue that was Tom Hardy and sure as hell didn't go see it because of him.

Mad Max: This is your best ammunition and yet the movie would have been more accurately titled Furiosa: ft Mad Max. Dude is practically a supporting character in that movie with probably a page worth of dialogue.

 

[freeofgreed]

It's on the studios to hire asian actors, but it's also on us as film fans to support asian actors so that studios take note. When a quality american film with an asian lead like Kumiko, The Treasure Hunter comes out. You should do your best to make it a priority to give that film your money.

Regardless of who was in it an art house film like that was never going to do numbers. Even ScarJo's own art house film Under the skin didn't do well. Small scale films like this won't increase Asian visibility. Big budget films will. Criticism like this is what will ultimately push studios to hire more minorities.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/oscarssowhite-spurs-diversity-casting-boom-872005

 

[lightskintwin]

Tom Hardy stars in a lot of films, many of which don't even get wide releases. I think that in itself is an indication of box office draw. He gets roles because he is a competent actor with a lot of diversity (he can do physical roles as well as roles that rely more on dialogue). No shame in that.

To an extent. But in the Big Leagues of Hollywood, that's not a bankable star otherwise, Samuel L. Jackson would be the biggest bankable star on the planet.

 

[H.Cornerstone]

Clooney is not a bankable star . Tom Cruise, Will Smith, and Tom Hanks are noticeably missing.

Yes you are right about Cruise and Hanks, DiCaprio and Lawrence

Going to disagree with Will Smith, he was at one point, but I don't think he is anymore.

I don't think Tom Hardy is yet.

So based on names so far:

Tom Hanks
Tom Cruise
Matt Damon
Denzel
Brad Pitt
and ScarJO
Jennifer Lawrence

 

[SeanC]

Mad Max, The Revenant, The Dark Night Rises

LOL indeed

Mad Max is your best one here but even Mad Max wasn't a huge BO hit. It had legs because of word of mouth over some weeks that helped sustain it, not because of Tom Hardy. It still only debuted a distant #2 behind Pitch Perfect 2 domestically.

Tom Hardy is a name, one casting loves because he's got range and good at his job, but he's not a bankable star. Those are two different things.

To stay on track: Scarjo is absolutely a bankable star. She just needs a franchise, maybe Ghost in the Shell is it.

 

[lightskintwin]

Yes you are right about Cruise and Hanks, DiCaprio and Lawrence

Going to disagree with Will Smith, he was at one point, but I don't think he is anymore.

I don't think Tom Hardy is yet.

So based on names so far:

Tom Hanks
Tom Cruise
Matt Damon
Denzel
Brad Pitt
and ScarJO
Jennifer Lawrence

LOL Once again this nonsense about Will Smith. I can list you movies with almost all of those actors you named who have movies that not only bombed but didn't come close to recouping their production budgets.

Current Will Smith looks bad because he went from eight $100M+ domestic films in a row to having a bunch of underperformers in a row. MIB3 made a ton of money but the finance side of it was Sony Pictures being Sony Pictures. As such it is unfairly discounted. Everything else since Seven Pounds was low key, up until Suicide Squad blew up.

Everything after Seven Pounds. He took a 3-year hiatus and came back.

2012 Men in Black 3 - Production Budget 215 million Box Office - $624 million
2013 After Earth - Critically panned. Production Budget 130 million – $135 million Box Office - $243.8 million
2015 Concussion Production Budget - $35 million Box Office - $48.6 million
2016 Suicide Squad* Critically panned Production Budget - $175 million Box Office - $745.6 million
2016 Collateral Beauty** Critically panned Production Budget - $36 million Box Office - $82.7 million


*Obviously Will Smith's involvement in Suicide Squad didn't hurt it, but it' difficult to quantify how much he helped it given the almost guaranteed success of DC/Marvel big bugeted superhero films right now, so they're not great indicators of bankableness but is still part of a trend of Will's consistentsy.

**Movie is still in theaters in different parts of the world.

Will Smith is still one of Hollywood's most consistent performers and bankable stars even in awful movies.

 

[Inferno313]

Regardless of who was in it an art house film like that was never going to do numbers. Even ScarJo's own art house film Under the skin didn't do well. Small scale films like this won't increase Asian visibility. Big budget films will.

Both are important. Scarlett Johansson is who she is today because of a small-scale film called Lost in Translation. Small scale films get actors parts in larger scale films. Jennifer Lawrence, Scarlett Johansson, Alicia Vikander. These successful white actresses we've talked about in this thread all got to where they are due to roles in smaller films. Support diversity in small films if you want diversity in big films. It's important to be vocal online, but you have to take action if you want to enact change.

 

[watermelons]

This shouldn't be a "controversy" because the name "Mokoto" is an alias and she's a fucking cyborg. Her body isn't her original body.

 

[freeofgreed]

This shouldn't be a "controversy" because the name "Mokoto" is an alias and she's a fucking cyborg. Her body isn't her original body.

And??? the body she's in and the body the film adaptation is based on is that of an asian woman.

 

[Imm0rt4l]

peak white feminism

 

[Nepenthe]

Stars are not a guarantee of success. They're collateral for studio heads against stock holders in case a film bombs. We live in an era of unprecedented reliance on existing properties and nostalgia, as well as extreme media saturation where everything competes with our attention, and subsequently the cult of personality around huge stars back in the day is nearly impossible to attain and far less meaningful. We're never getting another Michael Jackson. Tom Cruise isn't America's darling anymore. People don't care when they can pass the time on YouTube.

Fact is, when people go to the theater they want to see stuff they either read or watched on TV forever ago communicated with a big Hollywood budget, or they just want to see cool-ass shit like explosions or dinosaurs or robots; give a damn about a "star." Like, who was a fan of Harry Potter but wasn't going to see it because some unknown British kids were headlining it? It's fucking Harry Potter, the biggest fictional book series of all time. Subsequently, Gerard Butler isn't magically saving these godawful Egyptian and Greek God films with his presence. Then you've got genres like horror. Pretty sure ScarJo would love to have been in a film with the box-office-to-budget ratio as Blair Witch or Paranormal Activity.

On top of that, it's not like stars are made in a lab and come out being automatically known by everyone. ScarJo was once a nobody. The only way to make a star is to initially cast them in a prominent role. To say there's no bankable stars of a particular race is an inherently self-sustaining problem and thus inherently racist- as well as an admittance of what minorities suspected that white people just lack the faculties to empathize with anyone who doesn't look like them- if you're not going to give the same initial chances to minority actors as you would white actors and actresses.

Ghost in the Shell is going to succeed or fail based upon the marketing, its writing, word of mouth, and in general whether or not people give a damn about the property in this day and age. ScarJo has no control over any of that.

 

[Deepwater]

Both are important. Scarlett Johansson is who she is today because of a small-scale film called Lost in Translation. Small scale films get actors parts in larger scale films. Jennifer Lawrence, Scarlett Johansson, Alicia Vikander. These successful white actresses we've talked about in this thread all got to where they are due to roles in smaller films. Support diversity in small films if you want diversity in big films. It's important to be vocal online, but you have to take action if you want to enact change.

Or you can expect both at the same time?

Your argument lies upon the premise that Hollywood is a meritocracy where we have decades of facts pointing to the contrary.

 

[Frozenprince]

People really still think that Hollywood banks on big budget stars anymore? It's being proven more and more that good marketing and ability to sell your product matters way more than attaching a face too it. Unlike 30 years ago, you don't need a known name on something to have people go "oh he's in it, we have to see it".

Cut a good trailer and throw posters and billboards everywhere and people will see it. This argument that you need to be a "name" is the cheapest way to stop any further attempts at inclusivity, it's been used for almost 100+ years now ever since the Hollywood code was established.

Enough is enough. Hollywood won't change on its own, people need to boycott shit like this if it's ever going to sink in.

 

[jett]

So instead of bombas or super bombas, you want Omega bombas?

You wouldn't even recoup costs in China.

Yes, that's a strange argument the dude is trying to make.

It's unfortunate there are no Asian actors, male or female, that can carry a movie in the western world. Jackie Chan is the only one that attained that kind of status among mainstream audiences. He obviously ain't Asian American tho.

How do you fix this situation? I can't say. Even thinking beyond what could be considered a bankable star, I'm having a hard time thinking of Asian American actors overall.

According to this, the name of Johansson's character in Ghost in the Shell is "Major Mira Killian": https://www.amazon.com/dp/1683830008/?tag=neogaf0e-20

Mira Killermonger was too much, I guess.

 

[Inferno313]

Or you can expect both at the same time?

Your argument lies upon the premise that Hollywood is a meritocracy where we have decades of facts pointing to the contrary.

My argument lies on the fact that Hollywood is risk-adverse and won't cast an unknown lead in an unknown property and that the problem lies deeper than this one film, and is a systemic problem in which asian women get increasingly fewer opportunities, and in which the audience is complicit for not supporting the few opportunities that they do receive.

I'm out now, though. Too many folks are trying to join in on this conversation at the current page, and not reading the entire thread.

 

[Frozenprince]

Star pieces are selling less and less, I mean shit look at that Brad Pitt saves China movie.

You think that shit will make its money back?

 

[Nepenthe]

People really still think that Hollywood banks on big budget stars anymore? It's being proven more and more that good marketing and ability to sell your product matters way more than attaching a face too it.

"You need to see the new Godzilla film! Godzilla used Atomic Breath down the throat of another kaiju! It was fuckin' awesome!"

"Yeah, but who's in it? Bryan Cranston? Maybe."

- is a conversation that did not happen anywhere on this planet when the movie came out.

 

[PSqueak]

"You need to see the new Godzilla film! Godzilla used Atomic Breath down the throat of another kaiju! It was fuckin' awesome!"

"Yeah, but who's in it? Bryan Cranston? Maybe."

- is a conversation that did not happen anywhere on this planet when the movie came out.

Real conversations that DID happen however were along the lines of "Bryan Cranston should have been in the movie way longer", so there is that.

 

[watermelons]

And??? the body she's in and the body the film adaptation is based on is that of an asian woman.

We don't know that. The race of her current, mass produced body is ambiguous. It's the same model as the puppet master's host body and looks exactly the same, except for having a different hair color.

NSFW
http://womenwriteaboutcomics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/gits29.png

 

[lightskintwin]

Star pieces are selling less and less, I mean shit look at that Brad Pitt saves China movie.

You think that shit will make its money back?

It honestly depends on the film. I think there's a trend of big budget blockbusters or well-known IP adaptations needing them less and less.

 

[freeofgreed]

We don't know that. The race of her current, mass produced body is ambiguous. It's the same model as the puppet master's host body and looks exactly the same, except for having a different hair color.

NSFW
http://womenwriteaboutcomics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/gits29.png

The setting very obviously takes place in Japan. Judging by the names of various characters and if her purpose was to blend in then it's easy to assume that her body is also that of a Japanese woman. And there's no indication either that her original body wasn't also Japanese.

The whole she's a cyborg who may not be Japanese was also a poor argument that seemed like a stretch to justify this casting.

 

[Nepenthe]

Real conversations that DID happen however were along the lines of "Bryan Cranston should have been in the movie way longer", so there is that.

True, but that's because the role's size was a waste for him considering how much he's probably worth. But let's go back to that amazing Comic-Con trailer we got. No human being with real emotions and love of monster movies asked about casting after hearing Godzilla roar. The ending scene of the Comic-Con teaser alone could've been the only visual in the trailer and people would've been hyped.

 

[kswiston]

LOL Once again this nonsense about Will Smith. I can list you movies with almost all of those actors you named who have movies that not only bombed but didn't come close to recouping their production budgets.



Everything after Seven Pounds. He took a 3-year hiatus and came back.

2012 Men in Black 3 - Production Budget 215 million Box Office - $624 million
2013 After Earth - Critically panned. Production Budget 130 million – $135 million Box Office - $243.8 million
2015 Concussion Production Budget - $35 million Box Office - $48.6 million
2016 Suicide Squad* Critically panned Production Budget - $175 million Box Office - $745.6 million
2016 Collateral Beauty** Critically panned Production Budget - $36 million Box Office - $82.7 million


*Obviously Will Smith's involvement in Suicide Squad didn't hurt it, but it' difficult to quantify how much he helped it given the almost guaranteed success of DC/Marvel big bugeted superhero films right now, so they're not great indicators of bankableness but is still part of a trend of Will's consistentsy.

**Movie is still in theaters in different parts of the world.

Will Smith is still one of Hollywood's most consistent performers and bankable stars even in awful movies.

You forgot Focus, which also did well for what it cost. I agree that he is well above average for bankability, even if he's not the biggest star on earth any more.

After Earth and Concussion were the only films that might have lost money in the list above. After Earth wasn't him in a lead role. Concussion was buried by people's love of Football in the US. Even the studio started to back off in their level of promotion when the NFL made a fuss. It was cheap though, so any losses would have been relatively minor.

I think that Smith being one of the few likeable parts of Suicide Squad helped the film. Even if only to give them some non-garbage dialogue delivery to stick in those trailers. I don't know if that film's performance will do much for him going forward as you say.

 

[lightskintwin]

Stars are not a guarantee of success. They're collateral for studio heads against stock holders in case a film bombs. We live in an era of unprecedented reliance on existing properties and nostalgia, as well as extreme media saturation where everything competes with our attention, and subsequently the cult of personality around huge stars back in the day is nearly impossible to attain and far less meaningful. We're never getting another Michael Jackson. Tom Cruise isn't America's darling anymore. People don't care when they can pass the time on YouTube.

Fact is, when people go to the theater they want to see stuff they either read or watched on TV forever ago communicated with a big Hollywood budget, or they just want to see cool-ass shit like explosions or dinosaurs or robots; give a damn about a "star." Like, who was a fan of Harry Potter but wasn't going to see it because some unknown British kids were headlining it? It's fucking Harry Potter, the biggest fictional book series of all time. Subsequently, Gerard Butler isn't magically saving these godawful Egyptian and Greek God films with his presence. Then you've got genres like horror. Pretty sure ScarJo would love to have been in a film with the box-office-to-budget ratio as Blair Witch or Paranormal Activity.

On top of that, it's not like stars are made in a lab and come out being automatically known by everyone. ScarJo was once a nobody. The only way to make a star is to initially cast them in a prominent role. To say there's no bankable stars of a particular race is an inherently self-sustaining problem and thus inherently racist- as well as an admittance of what minorities suspected that white people just lack the faculties to empathize with anyone who doesn't look like them- if you're not going to give the same initial chances to minority actors as you would white actors and actresses.

Ghost in the Shell is going to succeed or fail based upon the marketing, its writing, word of mouth, and in general whether or not people give a damn about the property in this day and age. ScarJo has no control over any of that.

While I agree in general, I don't think you can fully discount Scarlett Johanssen's drawing power as a lead if the movie is a success and automatically assume the same would've occurred with an unknown.

 

[ZehDon]

Meh, there's no Asian actresses bankable enough to head up a movie with that budget. In fact, there's less than a handful of any race.

I think this says a lot, when the most expensive and highest grossing film of all time stars a male australian actor who was entirely unknown before he was cast, yet somehow we don't have an Asian actress "big enough" to carry an adaptation of the most famous and influential Anime films of all time. The casting on this film just bugs the shit out of me.

 

[lightskintwin]

You forgot Focus, which also did well for what it cost. I agree that he is well above average for bankability, even if he's not the biggest star on earth any more.

After Earth and Concussion were the only films that might have lost money in the list above. After Earth wasn't him in a lead role. Concussion was buried by people's love of Football in the US. Even the studio started to back off in their level of promotion when the NFL made a fuss. It was cheap though, so any losses would have been relatively minor.

I think that Smith being one of the few likeable parts of Suicide Squad helped the film. Even if only to give them some non-garbage dialogue delivery to stick in those trailers. I don't know if that film's performance will do much for him going forward as you say.

No idea how I forgot Focus. Thanks.

I think Will Smith isn't the biggest star on the planet anymore is because he's not leading in big budget blockbuster Action films as much, and more importantly, he's been in a lot of bad films as of recent.

For example, I think if Collateral Beauty was a good to great film, it could've easily grossed 200 million worldwide.

 

[H.Cornerstone]

LOL Once again this nonsense about Will Smith. I can list you movies with almost all of those actors you named who have movies that not only bombed but didn't come close to recouping their production budgets.



Everything after Seven Pounds. He took a 3-year hiatus and came back.

2012 Men in Black 3 - Production Budget 215 million Box Office - $624 million
2013 After Earth - Critically panned. Production Budget 130 million – $135 million Box Office - $243.8 million
2015 Concussion Production Budget - $35 million Box Office - $48.6 million
2016 Suicide Squad* Critically panned Production Budget - $175 million Box Office - $745.6 million
2016 Collateral Beauty** Critically panned Production Budget - $36 million Box Office - $82.7 million


*Obviously Will Smith's involvement in Suicide Squad didn't hurt it, but it' difficult to quantify how much he helped it given the almost guaranteed success of DC/Marvel big bugeted superhero films right now, so they're not great indicators of bankableness but is still part of a trend of Will's consistentsy.

**Movie is still in theaters in different parts of the world.

Will Smith is still one of Hollywood's most consistent performers and bankable stars even in awful movies.

Wow, I guess I just didn't realize with all the crappy movies he has been in his movies still do that ok. Seems like you are correct in that he is still bankable worldwide, even if not in the United States.

I rescind my opposition.

 

[Trojita]

Star pieces are selling less and less, I mean shit look at that Brad Pitt saves China movie.

Matt Damon sure is looking Brad Pitt these days.

 

[Deepwater]

Matt Damon sure is looking Brad Pitt these days.

I've been getting them mixed up ever since Ocean's Eleven

 

[lightskintwin]

Wow, I guess I just didn't realize with all the crappy movies he has been in his movies still do that ok. Seems like you are correct in that he is still bankable worldwide, even if not in the United States.

I rescind my opposition.

Plus I missed the film Focus - 2015 Production Budget - $50.1 million Box Office - $159.1 million

Also as an example of people who you named, which I agree are bankable stars, but yet somehow didn't hold awful recent box office performance against them which Will Smith has NEVER had even if the film were critically panned.

Tom Hanks - 2016 - A Hologram for the King - Production Budget -$30 million Box Office - $7.8 million

Jennifer Lawrence - 2014 - Serena - critically panned Production Budget - $25–30 million - Box Office - $3.9 million

 

[Nepenthe]

While I agree in general, I don't think you can fully discount Scarlett Johanssen's drawing power as a lead if the movie is a success and automatically assume the same would've occurred with an unknown.

Of course you can't really determine whether or not Rinko would have the same effect on a film as Scarlett. In fact, I highly doubt ScarJo wouldn't bring in more all other factors of the film being equal. But that's not really the argument I'm making. The argument I'm making is that people are using the notion that a movie star is the number one reason people go to the movies anymore to explain why unknown Asian actors can't be cast for ostensibly Asian roles (lol), when anyone who has gone to the movies in the past decade probably intuitively knows that's a crock of shit, because they either went to the movies to see shit explode, see some nerdy shit like dinosaurs, robots, or comic book panels come alive through modern CGI tech, or they went to get scared by shaky camera work and jump scares of which a "bankable actor" need not apply for. And if people don't intuitively know that then Super Studies Man is here to save the day. Apparently stars are only worth an extra $3 million of revenue. That's what a film more likely to be headlined by ScarJo earns in like half an hour upon opening in America alone. It's peanuts. And this poll (not robust but I can't really find any polls or studies on the question I'm asking) shows that people go to the movies primarily if they're interested in the subject matter.

The reason we don't have any "bankable Asian stars" is because Hollywood just won't cast Asians in bankable roles to cultivate them into household names, and they do this because producers and the like use the outdated, racist notion that white actors are like honey to the flies of the public as collateral to position themselves as having done all they could to try and save a turd. "Don't look at me! I cast ScarJo! I did my job! I guess it's the audience's fault for not being interested in x, y, and z." And the stockholders nod their heads, and the result is we get the same shit over and over again, or we run into problems like this where people are scrambling to explain away why a Japanese property is starring a white woman in a multicultural society.

I think this says a lot, when the most expensive and highest grossing film of all time stars a male australian actor who was entirely unknown before he was cast, yet somehow we don't have an Asian actress "big enough" to carry an adaptation of the most famous and influential Anime films of all time. The casting on this film just bugs the shit out of me.

Unknown white actors and actresses have the luxury of existing alongside other factors for a movie's success, thus they can get cast as the stars of fucking James Cameron vehicles and no one cares. Unknown minority actors, instead, are the entire reason any given film will fail. Amazing, isn't it?

 

[Dark Ninja]

Leo could get a goddamn live action Beyblade movie greenlit if he agreed to star in it.

 

[Tinfoilhatsron]

This feels like the new way of tearing down feminism. Instead of celebrating the little steps and then working for more, we're turning on the little steps and criticizing them for not being big enough. We're attacking the people trying to take small steps.

Good for Scarlett Johansson for talking about the struggles she's faced. I wouldn't blame her for taking a role that was offered to her and that most women never have a chance at, I would blame the studios who aren't making many female-lead action movies and who chose to deny the role to a minority woman. Instead of criticizing Scarlett Johansson and trying to silence her, we should be focusing on lifting up her and minority women.

Two steps foward for women.

Two steps back for WoC.

The next time a big blockbuster comes up, a WoC might even be considered for one solid minute. Progress takes time. White women gotta eat first before the blacks, asians, and hispanics.

Like come on, I'm not even mad about Scarlett being in GitS but fuck this nonsense.

 

[CrunchyFrog]

that doesn't make her statements less hypocritical and self-serving

It wasn't her fault she got picked for the part, blame that on the production companies. You want her to apologize for being white and tear her paycheck writers a new one before the movie even comes out? I'm behind more diversity in cinema, but this wasn't SJ's fight to begin with, at least not right now.