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[31GhostsIV]

Like people have said I think maybe Boris didn't actually want to win, he was doing this as a popularity contest and when leave lost he could use it as a jumping board into PM in a few years.

That or he wanted Cameron to do the hard work, fail and then he can step in and save it all. Now he has to do the hard bit he might not be so keen.

Or maybe his position is just to contrast with Farage's victory pose attracting derision.

Either way those fuckers have screwed us over for their own power.

I've been saying from the outset, we didn't get the referendum we deserved. We deserved clear facts and information, not the party political shit show we got. Too much media focus on Tory infighting, not enough quality journalism weighing up the facts and possible repercussions.

That said, in a country where obvious asshole Rupert Murdoch still has so much media control (somehow even after the phone hacking scandal) this doesn't surprise me.

 

[Audioboxer]

Worked pretty well 80 years ago without social media too. Not buying it.

Sure, but there's a lot of otherwise "sane" people these days that run around with dumb as fuck opinions. Hence some of the regret after voting the other day. Social media plays it's part in that, especially on FB with family/friends and "group think".

 

[Napoleonthechimp]

Same here. I was born of the EU and its being taken away from me. It really sucks.

I don't know about you but I'm leaving England.

I can't forgive the total fuckwits here for this.

 

[Frosty Droid]

Scotland's Future

Even better, however, a Scotland within the EU (while England and the City of London will be out) will be in a position to offer an ideal English speaking location for international and domestic investment houses, banks, fund managers and other financial institutions who require to have a place within the EU for regulatory reasons. Edinburgh (or Scotland’s other cities) would become an ideal alternative to London, offering all the attractions of a settled and secure life, bearing in mind that the Republic of Ireland will be the only alternative English speaking nation in the EU. What’s more Scotland will, through the Court of Session, be able to offer parties in Scotland the opportunity to take their cases to the European Court of Justice for important rulings on EU law and its implications for businesses; and Scotland could see the relocation of many highly skilled EU practitioners who wish to practice here. Pursuing EU law issues through London’s High Court will no longer be an option. Last week more than 100 London based EU lawyers registered as solicitors in the Republic of Ireland to safeguard their right to practice EU law. Why not in Scotland?

Scotland will have to set up a domestic central bank and adopt the Euro, that seems beyond question: but this is hardly much of a requirement given the position we have now reached. Scotland has an immense opportunity now, if it is properly negotiated and candidly explained by the Scottish Government to the Scottish People; and while Government would have to be honest and frank about the many challenges Scotland will face in the early days of being a new nation, I believe that is now the only decent option which Scotland has. There is no intellectually honest way to justify a cowering acceptance of England’s negative and self destructive decision, and ‘play along’ for the sake of things.

 

[kiguel182]

Merkel has her own issues (AfD and the refugee crisis), she doesn't need another big problem.

True. And I'm betting a lot of the EU exports to the UK come from Germany.

Still, if she keeps them that close it might fuel the fire for other countries to leave or for countries to feel it's not fair to them for the UK to leave and still keep a lot of benefits.

 

[Zoink]

As someone who voted remain (I was swaying either way till I actually voted), I feel kinda worry for the future of the EU if/when we do leave. Someone is going to have to make up a hell of a shortfall in contributions - this is calculated from wiki 2014 numbers, I couldn't find anything more recent:

net contrib (million Euros)​

Germany 17,658.50
France 7,488.60
United Kingdom 7,087.60
Netherlands 6,358.30
Italy 5,193.40
Sweden 2,603.30
Austria 1,296.90
Denmark 995.90
Finland 842.20
Ireland 87.50

These are all the contributors, everyone else takes out more than they put in. I guess Germany would have to pay a few billion more and the rest shared between France/Netherlands and Italy, but those are going to be pretty hefty %age budget increases.

 

[twobear]

Merkel saying different things to other EU members...wow it's almost like the EU is a Union of different states and not some monolithic faceless entity issuing diktats from on high. Who would have thought?

 

[Dorsal Axe]

You know what really grinds my gears? The attitude which goes a bit like this...

"The decision has been made, the country wants out and that's democracy, end off. Now we should all just accept it, come together, roll our sleeves up and make this thing work."

To which my response is:

1. Democracy and freedom of expression encompasses a right to disagree and to peaceful protest.
2. Almost half of the country did NOT want this at all.
3. For the 48% who did not want this and saw through the lies and empty promises, why the fuck should they be responsible for making it work? It was clear as day that the Leave campaign had no plan and Remainers voted accordingly but now we should be all 'tally ho, let's pick up the pieces'. No. Johnson, Gove, Patel et al, and by extension everybody who voted for this shitstorm, are accountable. They are the ones who should explain how we move forward, rather than simply go to ground as most of them have done today.

In short, why should half the country accept a mistake the other half made with a smile on its face and be just as liable for fixing it? To paraphrase Full Metal Jacket: we're paying for it, you eat it.

It's typical bullying behaviour. "Oh I just fucked things up for you. But now you should be the bigger man and suck it up."

lol nooope. The people who made their beds can lie in them. The rest of us are looking out for ourselves from now on (we don't have any choice but to now).

 

[Jimbob Smalls]

You mean exactly like how the Cabinet meets and decides things before the rest of government?

Come on, not holding meetings with every single member of a particular body is just common sense.

You don't see anything wrong with what you typed?

 

[Audioboxer]

Scotland's Future

clap.gif

 

[Beefy]

Although the whole situation is fucked up, and i feel sad for all the young people who will now have to suffer, on the other side, i'm kinda glad that all the benefits the UK got all this time is gonne now. The UK always lived above everyone else in the EU, like you are so special, everything had to be like you wanted, how do you think the the rest of the EU felt all the time?

It's no wonder everyone wants you now out as soon as possible. There are no special treatmenst anymore, it's done.

edit: all the young people who voted Remain, should just come and live in the EU with us, in a Union, like brothers and sisters.

I and many other young people are screwed. Many of us are too poor to move abroad.

 

[Spring Drive]

.

 

[UnblessedSoul]

I really despise Juncker, he is doing no favors for the eu at all.Saying exit quickly is like throwing the doll out of the pram. They need to be opening and more understanding, pledge to change, understand our fears and offer an alternative along with saying they would like UK to remain in the EU. Taking the hard line will mean the beginning of the end of the EU.

 

[DjRalford]

As someone who voted remain (I was swaying either way till I actually voted), I feel kinda worry for the future of the EU if/when we do leave. Someone is going to have to make up a hell of a shortfall in contributions - this is calculated from wiki 2014 numbers, I couldn't find anything more recent:

net contrib (million Euros)​

Germany 17,658.50
France 7,488.60
United Kingdom 7,087.60
Netherlands 6,358.30
Italy 5,193.40
Sweden 2,603.30
Austria 1,296.90
Denmark 995.90
Finland 842.20
Ireland 87.50

These are all the contributors, everyone else takes out more than they put in. I guess Germany would have to pay a few billion more and the rest shared between France/Netherlands and Italy, but those are going to be pretty hefty %age budget increases.

I think the latest one had us 2nd net with around 6billion.

 

[Boy Wander]

I don't know about you but I'm leaving England.

I can't forgive the total fuckwits here for this.

Good luck with your future endeavours. Where are you going to?

 

[oti]

You know what really grinds my gears? The attitude which goes a bit like this...

"The decision has been made, the country wants out and that's democracy, end off. Now we should all just accept it, come together, roll our sleeves up and make this thing work."

To which my response is:

1. Democracy and freedom of expression encompasses a right to disagree and to peaceful protest.
2. Almost half of the country did NOT want this at all.
3. For the 48% who did not want this and saw through the lies and empty promises, why the fuck should they be responsible for making it work? It was clear as day that the Leave campaign had no plan and Remainers voted accordingly but now we should be all 'tally ho, let's pick up the pieces'. No. Johnson, Gove, Patel et al, and by extension everybody who voted for this shitstorm, are accountable. They are the ones who should explain how we move forward, rather than simply go to ground as most of them have done today.

In short, why should half the country accept a mistake the other half made with a smile on its face and be just as liable for fixing it? To paraphrase Full Metal Jacket: we're paying for it, you eat it.

This is something you, the UK, have to figure out (or live with) yourselves. Can you imagine what would happen if Merkel just said "Nein, we don't care about the referendum, you'll stay"? It was Cameron who decided to hold this referendum, it was the government who though a simple majority was enough. What you think of your government or of Cameron is up to you. The rest of EU (and the world) just wants to get clarity as soon as possible.

 

[Arksy]

60? Im fine with that. Many haven't even retired at 60.

Our local news had a 99 year old man voting Leave though, which is a little on the ridiculous side, don't you think?

No, not at all. Do you also think that it's ok to strip terminally ill people of the vote as well?

 

[KingSnake]

It amazes me to see that there are still a lot of Britons who don't understand what EU is. EU's purpose is the well being of its members. UK is (soon to be) no longer a member. UK's well being is no longer our concern. We have some common trade and strategic interests, but those won't be put above the existence of EU.

It's not about punishment, it's about survival.

 

[twobear]

You don't see anything wrong with what you typed?

Not some silver bullet that would render the entire argument pointless, no.

 

[SymbiantXenos]

As somebody from England I'd wholeheartedly support an indyref 2 for Scotland.

As people say, that's democracy.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

No, not at all. Do you also think that it's also ok to strip terminally ill people of the vote as well?

If death is a certainty within say a couple of years, absolutely.

Why should they have a vote?

 

[kaizoku]

its sad that there are those who sniff blood and see this as an opportunity to break the EU up which will no doubt lead to finger pointing and war somewhere down the line, particularly with Russia looking aggressive.

Still feel like it might not happen.

There was a clause in the referendum that it wasn't a legally binding referendum, but what a fucking clusterfuck.

 

[Joni]

I really despise Juncker, he is doing no favors for the eu at all.Saying exit quickly is like throwing the doll out of the pram. They need to be opening and more understanding, pledge to change, understand our fears and offer an alternative along with saying they would like UK to remain in the EU. Taking the hard line will mean the beginning of the end of the EU.

They said all of that before the referendum. It still came. The EU just wants to follow the democratic results, the UK seems to have trouble with that. The Greeks had that issue as well with their referendum.

 

[StNd]

As someone who voted remain (I was swaying either way till I actually voted), I feel kinda worry for the future of the EU if/when we do leave. Someone is going to have to make up a hell of a shortfall in contributions - this is calculated from wiki 2014 numbers, I couldn't find anything more recent:

net contrib (million Euros)​

Germany 17,658.50
France 7,488.60
United Kingdom 7,087.60
Netherlands 6,358.30
Italy 5,193.40
Sweden 2,603.30
Austria 1,296.90
Denmark 995.90
Finland 842.20
Ireland 87.50

These are all the contributors, everyone else takes out more than they put in. I guess Germany would have to pay a few billion more and the rest shared between France/Netherlands and Italy, but those are going to be pretty hefty %age budget increases.

For Belgium, this would mean an extra € 350M that we have to pay (newspaper here in Belgium a couple a days ago). I have no idea about other countries.

 

[DjRalford]

If death is a certainty within say a couple of years, absolutely.

Why should they have a vote?

Because it's their human right?

Jesus Christ some people on this board!

 

[Linkyn]

.

I love it.

I really despise Juncker, he is doing no favors for the eu at all.Saying exit quickly is like throwing the doll out of the pram. They need to be opening and more understanding, pledge to change, understand our fears and offer an alternative along with saying they would like UK to remain in the EU. Taking the hard line will mean the beginning of the end of the EU.

Try looking at it from the other side. Right now, the future of the UK and the EU are quite nebulous, and as long as there are no clear signals (which Cameron's resignation announcement really did not help with), 28 countries and, by extension, 500 million people are in political limbo. The exit negotiations are going to draw a lot of resources, and with Britain's role in Europe uncertain, legislative and executive capabilities at the European level may be seriously hampered, which is incredibly undesirable because of ongoing financial and foreign issues that need to be dealt with.

 

[Tak3n]

That has to be a joke.



Fair enough. I think you're right, it's not fair of me to vote for something that won't impact me because I'll be dead

But then I'm not a self centred cunt, so that's just me...

you would of spent you life contributing to society, then to be told to fuck off you don't matter...Fuck it lets just euthanize people when they get to 60, then the young can have the whole world how they want

and ergo, their taxes paid for your schooling, and lots of other stuff but you are right...how selfish of them

 

[kharma45]

If death is a certainty within say a couple of years, absolutely.

Why should they have a vote?

You could die tomorrow, why should you get a vote?

You can't start stripping terminally ill people of their right to vote. That's simply disgusting.

 

[Boy Wander]

It amazes me to see that there are still a lot of Britons who don't understand what EU is. EU's purpose is the well being of its members. UK is (soon to be) no longer a member. UK's well being is no longer or concern. We have some common trade and strategic interests, but those won't be put above the existence of EU.

It's not about punishment, it's about survival.

There are a lot of people living in EU member states who know jack about the EU. So what?

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

so what does that make the EU then? you are saying punish those who dare to question our authority! that will not end well

I thought the EU was all about tolerance, and now you want to nail us to the mast for wanting out

There is no punishment here. No one can force the UK to do anything. It's not punishment when someone offers you terms you don't like on a negotiation that you requested.

 

[chadskin]

The EU doesn't need to and won't "punish" the UK.

The Norway model is punishment enough to those that voted Leave.

 

[SuperSah]

This referendum has become a game of hot potato.

They're all throwing it back and forth trying not to hold onto it because nobody wants to trigger the process and move it forward.

It's evident that the Conservatives just wanted to do a referendum to tide people over and get on with the day. Now it actually happened, there is no plan in place and nobody has an utter clue what the fuck to do. This REALLY will not go well at all if rushed, or possibly if it goes ahead at all.

 

[Audioboxer]

If death is a certainty within say a couple of years, absolutely.

Why should they have a vote?

I love ye Miles but that is a bit harsh.

The bigger issue is we continue to routinely fail to get through to our older generations. It's one of the toughest things to do, but we need to keep trying.

Spoken from a psychologist in training, changing the mind once it's been wired the way it has for soo long in older folk is damn hard. You could say impossible for many. For those that are lost causes though that is where we need to stimulate and educate our younger generations not to "lulz vote" or not vote, and take it seriously.

 

[oti]

There are a lot of people living in EU member states who know jack about the EU. So what?

They didn't vote about leaving the EU?

The EU doesn't need to and won't "punish" the UK.

The Norway model is punishment enough to those that voted Leave.

Norway model would be the best outcome IMO.

 

[UnblessedSoul]

They said all of that before the referendum. It still came. The EU just wants to follow the democratic results, the UK seems to have trouble with that. The Greeks had that issue as well with their referendum.

It's not as simple as following the democratic results, there is huge turmoil in the Uk political landscape, during the campaign they were all mutes. "Getting on with it" is not a safe thing to say at all at this moment in time. Knee jerk reactions is what caused this in the first place. Staying calm is the best thing to do right now.

 

[Boy Wander]

They didn't vote about leaving the EU?

I'd be interested to see how many would,given the opportunity. Which the EU cartel will probably never give them.

 

[Tak3n]

The EU doesn't need to and won't "punish" the UK.

The Norway model is punishment enough to those that voted Leave.

I don't get why Europeans would want to come anyway, half the country just said they don't want you here...

 

[geordiemp]

As someone who voted remain (I was swaying either way till I actually voted), I feel kinda worry for the future of the EU if/when we do leave. Someone is going to have to make up a hell of a shortfall in contributions - this is calculated from wiki 2014 numbers, I couldn't find anything more recent:

net contrib (million Euros)​

Germany 17,658.50
France 7,488.60
United Kingdom 7,087.60
Netherlands 6,358.30
Italy 5,193.40
Sweden 2,603.30
Austria 1,296.90
Denmark 995.90
Finland 842.20
Ireland 87.50

These are all the contributors, everyone else takes out more than they put in. I guess Germany would have to pay a few billion more and the rest shared between France/Netherlands and Italy, but those are going to be pretty hefty %age budget increases.

To all the posters loving the UK punishment, the pain will be for all. Just wait until France has to pay 30-40 % more to EU, the protests and blockades, all those new members joining with cap in hand.

Its a mess for everyone, and anyone thinks otherwise is living in lala land.

 

[Beefy]

I don't get why Europeans would want to come anyway, half the country just said they don't want you here...

48% ( including myself) would welcome them.

 

[Napoleonthechimp]

Good luck with your future endeavours. Where are you going to?

Hopefully Scotland will get their independence and EU membership. I'd like then to head up there. It'll be the closest culturally to what I know only it'll be largely left leaning, and hopefully a member of the EU.

England as a country is done for me. At this point I don't even think Scottish people could hate the English as much as a lot of left leaning English hate the right wing English.

 

[Joni]

It's not as simple as following the democratic results, there is huge turmoil in the Uk political landscape, during the campaign they were all mutes. "Getting on with it" is not a safe thing to say at all at this moment in time.

None of that is a reason for the European Union to get the United Kingdom a better deal which kills the idea of the integration and changes that are needed.

 

[DrFurbs]

I really wish we could all pull together now and try make this work.

 

[RedSparrows]

You know what really grinds my gears? The attitude which goes a bit like this...

"The decision has been made, the country wants out and that's democracy, end off. Now we should all just accept it, come together, roll our sleeves up and make this thing work."

To which my response is:

1. Democracy and freedom of expression encompasses a right to disagree and to peaceful protest.
2. Almost half of the country did NOT want this at all.
3. For the 48% who did not want this and saw through the lies and empty promises, why the fuck should they be responsible for making it work? It was clear as day that the Leave campaign had no plan and Remainers voted accordingly but now we should be all 'tally ho, let's pick up the pieces'. No. Johnson, Gove, Patel et al, and by extension everybody who voted for this shitstorm, are accountable. They are the ones who should explain how we move forward, rather than simply go to ground as most of them have done today.

In short, why should half the country accept a mistake the other half made with a smile on its face and be just as liable for fixing it? To paraphrase Full Metal Jacket: we're paying for it, you eat it.

100% my attitude too, other than trying to be a bit friendlier than that It's not productive, ultimately, given the domestic political battle is about to be rejoined in earnest, but...

 

[Ashes]

I've been saying from the outset, we didn't get the referendum we deserved. We deserved clear facts and information, not the party political shit show we got. Too much media focus on Tory infighting, not enough quality journalism weighing up the facts and possible repercussions.

That said, in a country where obvious asshole Rupert Murdoch still has so much media control (somehow even after the phone hacking scandal) this doesn't surprise me.

Murdoch? You mean Daily Mail and DMGT. The Sun's readership and online presence isn't aimed at the more mature reader.

 

[Orniletter]

It amazes me to see that there are still a lot of Britons who don't understand what EU is. EU's purpose is the well being of its members. UK is (soon to be) no longer a member. UK's well being is no longer or concern. We have some common trade and strategic interests, but those won't be put above the existence of EU.

It's not about punishment, it's about survival.

This.

It's not like I hate the UK and wanted them to leave.
Nothing would have made me happier if a resounding "Stay !" had won and a pro European change had been triggered.

Instead, your decision has hurt us all and made our union weaker. The EU has to look out for it's own survival and "better than Norway's"-regulation (which the UK doesn't deserve in the first place) would go against that goal.

 

[Audioboxer]

Hopefully Scotland will get their independence and EU membership. I'd like then to head up there. It'll be the closest culturally to what I know only it'll be largely left leaning, and hopefully a member of the EU.

England as a country is done for me. At this point I don't even think Scottish people could hate the English as much as a lot of left leaning English hate the right wing English.

We don't hate bro, we just call people "wankers and cunts" to say hello. Up here we might throw a few punches, but we routinely offer the person we've just beaten up a cigarette afterwards and say "have a good night ya cunt".

 

[Crumpo]

You know what really grinds my gears? The attitude which goes a bit like this...

"The decision has been made, the country wants out and that's democracy, end off. Now we should all just accept it, come together, roll our sleeves up and make this thing work."

To which my response is:

1. Democracy and freedom of expression encompasses a right to disagree and to peaceful protest.
2. Almost half of the country did NOT want this at all.
3. For the 48% who did not want this and saw through the lies and empty promises, why the fuck should they be responsible for making it work? It was clear as day that the Leave campaign had no plan and Remainers voted accordingly but now we should be all 'tally ho, let's pick up the pieces'. No. Johnson, Gove, Patel et al, and by extension everybody who voted for this shitstorm, are accountable. They are the ones who should explain how we move forward, rather than simply go to ground as most of them have done today.

In short, why should half the country accept a mistake the other half made with a smile on its face and be just as liable for fixing it? To paraphrase Full Metal Jacket: we're paying for it, you eat it.

Hear, hear.

I'm expressing my democratic right to tell the leavers to clean up their own mess. I'm done with it.

 

[zpiders]

It amazes me to see that there are still a lot of Britons who don't understand what EU is. EU's purpose is the well being of its members. UK is (soon to be) no longer a member. UK's well being is no longer our concern. We have some common trade and strategic interests, but those won't be put above the existence of EU.

It's not about punishment, it's about survival.

What do you think of the EU's treatment of Greece? Pumping them full of dept and pretty much using the country as a refugee camp.

 

[UnblessedSoul]

None of that is a reason for the European Union to get the United Kingdom a better deal which kills the idea of the integration and changes that are needed.

This is not just about a better deal, it'ss about eu reforming into something better, as of right now UK is still part of the EU, only a non binding referendum has been made so far.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

you would of spent you life contributing to society, then to be told to fuck off you don't matter...Fuck it lets just euthanize people when they get to 60, then the young can have the whole world how they want

and ergo, their taxes paid for your schooling, and lots of other stuff but you are right...how selfish of them

Why are you resorting to ridiculous emotionally charged language? Why does not allowing people over a certain age to vote in any way mean euthanasia is on the cards?

And I'm paying for their pension, so they should respect that fact and accept their time has passed in influencing the future of the country.

You could die tomorrow, why should you get a vote?

You can't start stripping terminally ill people of their right to vote. That's simply disgusting.

If I die tomorrow, it will be from an accident so that doesn't impact a right to vote. Dying from cancer or another terminal illness is an entirely different story. You know you're dying, why should be allowed to you vote for something you won't be alive to live through?