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June 2014 NPD (U.S. Hardware) Predictions - Closes July 15th

SFenton

Member
I've said it before, I'll say it again. I really don't think price is the issue with the Xbone anymore. What if the consumer largely just isn't interested in the product, at least over the competition?

I agree with this, even with XB1 as my primary/favorite console of the moment. Games will change it. Hardware differences are ingrained in people's minds now. A vast enough price difference would turn the tide, but, as we know, there isn't one.

Satya's commitment to the Xbox as noted in the employee e-mail earlier gives me hope that they're gonna damn well try to do well this gen, so sales don't particularly bother me all too much, I suppose.
 
I don't think a single month has come and gone where they weren't projecting the Xbone to sell the most (before changing their numbers after NPD info is released.) So, uh...

Actually, that was just March.
All of the other months they had the PS4 in the lead by time NPD came out though they had April as closer that what it was in NPD....

And even in March they only had X1 as very slightly ahead by time NPD came out...
Like I said, they are not ACCURATE numbers, they just give a good INDICATION.
 

SDCowboy

Member
I agree with this, even with XB1 as my primary/favorite console of the moment. Games will change it. Hardware differences are ingrained in people's minds now. A vast enough price difference would turn the tide, but, as we know, there isn't one.

Satya's commitment to the Xbox as noted in the employee e-mail earlier gives me hope that they're gonna damn well try to do well this gen, so sales don't particularly bother me all too much, I suppose.

Mhm, unless MS significantly cuts the price to the the point where people are willing to overlook the power and perception difference, I don't think sales are going to stack up. Being the same price as the more powerful console with far more players and a better consumer image, isn't going to cut it, IMO.
 
I forgot that it was 5 weeks, but still think the numbers will be lower than last month.

PS4's numbers were high last month mostly because of Watch Dogs (it had exclusive marketing & content). And on top of that it had MLB: The Show release, alongside some other multiplatform games like Wolfenstein.

In June, hardly any noteworthy games were released, so the sales will be much slower.

Also, I somewhat follow VGC numbers, and while they are not exactly accurate on thier numbers, they give a fairly accurate Indication of how well each of the consoles are doing, and thier sales numbers for June are much lower than their numbers for May.

At best I think PS4 will match last month's numbers (thanks to the extra week), but I personally think they will be a little less.

....going to adjust my numbers for the extra week though....

Welp.
 
Actually, that was just March.
All of the other months they had the PS4 in the lead by time NPD came out though they had April as closer that what it was in NPD....

And even in March they only had X1 as very slightly ahead by time NPD came out...
Like I said, they are not ACCURATE numbers, they just give a good INDICATION.

just stop buddy, they're worse than the GAF averages usually
 
I think some people are in for a rude awakening if they think people are going to go out in droves to buy the XB1 over a collection of remasters just because its Halo.
 
I think some people are in for a rude awakening if they think people are going to go out in droves to buy the XB1 over a collection of remasters just because its Halo.

Pretty much this.

I'm a huge Halo fan and have an obscene amount of playtime with the games. I even really enjoyed Reach and Halo 4 (16 and 12 days playtime in multplayer respectively).

With Destiny hitting this year, I have zero interest in the remastered collection. If I already owned an XB1 I'd be excited. But it's not tempting me to buy in to the console.
 
You actually make several salient points up until the chartz part. Chartz legitimately make up numbers based on no inside information or retail insight. They consistently do worse than a bulk of gaffers who guess numbers every month.

But yes I have wondered myself how much of a positive effect Watch Dogs had on PS4 in May and if perhaps we'll see a decline from whatever boost it gave. Also curious if the Destiny bundle for PS4 has any effect

Interesting.....
How do you know they make up numbers?
Just curious, because I honestly have no Idea where they gather their Info from.

All I know is that Michel Patcher seems to think that their numbers for older games & console sales info is fairly reliable, and I have also heard other People, such as a Dev. from Naughty Dog reference them...
 
Actually, that was just March.
All of the other months they had the PS4 in the lead by time NPD came out though they had April as closer that what it was in NPD....

And even in March they only had X1 as very slightly ahead by time NPD came out...
Like I said, they are not ACCURATE numbers, they just give a good INDICATION.

I'm pretty sure it's the norm, not the exception. Here's April's (April 06 - May 3rd, so not absolutely perfect) information (before they changed it multiple times and it still isn't right.)

4yC4d4K.png


Their numbers:
XB1 - 239k
PS4 - 221k

Actual numbers:
PS4 - 199k
XB1 - 115k
 
Amazes me people largely believe the PS4 will be beating out the XB1 still.

Really? It's price-cut month, there is always a boost with price cuts.
 
Interesting.....
How do you know they make up numbers?
Just curious, because I honestly have no Idea where they gather their Info from.

All I know is that Michel Patcher seems to think that their numbers for older games & console sales info is fairly reliable, and I have also heard other People, such as a Dev. from Naughty Dog reference them...

http://www.wired.com/2008/06/why-we-dont-ref/

There’s been a bit of discussion in the comments sections of certain Game|Life posts about why we don’t use the sales-tracking website ******** for any serious discussion of game industry business, but Gamasutra’s Simon Carless has explained all of the site’s problems in detail.

In short, Carless verifies that ******** numbers are based mostly on rough guesses, not hard data. He points to the site’s treatment of Iron Man for the PlayStation 2, which VG Chartz had pegged at 53,000 copies — until NPD’s data came out with the game selling 130,000 copies. VG Chartz then edited its entry to a number closer to the NPD figure.

The site’s founder even admits to Carless that VG Chartz’ Metal Gear Solid 4 European sales numbers, which it breathlessly reported as hard fact in press releases to media outlets including Wired.com, were entirely invented: "It was based on first day Japan sales, first day America sales, and from that projecting for Europe / others which we didn’t get direct day 1 for."

As Carless summarizes, smart people projecting sales using all the publicly-available data is an interesting experiment, but the fact that other news outlets like the New York Times, Fortune, and Forbes are reporting these numbers as hard data is not a good thing.

For more

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/...*****_Does_And_Doesnt_Do_For_The_Game_Biz.php
 

SDCowboy

Member
Amazes me people largely believe the PS4 will be beating out the XB1 still.

Really? It's price-cut month, there is always a boost with price cuts.

Who said there won't be a boost? There's a long way to go from ~70k though. Also, have you seen the rankings on Amazon, just as an example?
 

Mr Moose

Member
Amazes me people largely believe the PS4 will be beating out the XB1 still.

Really? It's price-cut month, there is always a boost with price cuts.

I wasn't aware of any price cuts, unless you mean the Kinectless Xbox One (that's not a price cut). It should help with sales, but I doubt it will make a massive difference overall.
 
Interesting.....
How do you know they make up numbers?
Just curious, because I honestly have no Idea where they gather their Info from.

All I know is that Michel Patcher seems to think that their numbers for older games & console sales info is fairly reliable, and I have also heard other People, such as a Dev. from Naughty Dog reference them...

We've had this argument a million times on GAF. There is a reason it is banned. You'll do well to not bring it up on the forum. I also think it may help your guesstimate for NPDs if you ignore them.

For what it's worth. Their old numbers are accurate because they frequently revise numbers after real results are released.
 
Amazes me people largely believe the PS4 will be beating out the XB1 still.

Really? It's price-cut month, there is always a boost with price cuts.

There are plenty of indications that the kinectless SKU has not led to MS winning June

There's no hard evidence XB1 lost June but there's quite a bit of telltale signs


I do however think a boost of the XB1 is highly likely as my predictions on page 1 of this thread indicate

If it has any, it'd be a negative effect, from people deciding to preorder rather than buy one this month. September should be interesting, though.

Didn't see your comment originally. I was thinking that the destiny bundle might cause a negative effect on June PS4's sales just as Watch Dogs giving PS4 a boost in May might represent a drop in June.
 

ERMint13

Member
Interesting.....
How do you know they make up numbers?
Just curious, because I honestly have no Idea where they gather their Info from.

All I know is that Michel Patcher seems to think that their numbers for older games & console sales info is fairly reliable, and I have also heard other People, such as a Dev. from Naughty Dog reference them...

As quoted below it's just about as reliable as the guys that throw guesses out here. They do try to follow sales trends but they are just guessing the same as most here.

Chartz would have been ranked 141 out of 163 last month. I wouldn't put much stock in that site.

Anyway here is my go at it. First time.

[PS4] 213k
[XB1] 175k
[WiiU] 87k
[3DS] 75k
[X360] 40k
[PS3] 40k

Some guys have PS4 at close to 100k advantage this month. If PS4 does even 50K more it has to get someones attention at Microsoft.
 
I'm pretty sure it's the norm, not the exception. Here's April's (April 06 - May 3rd, so not absolutely perfect) information (before they changed it multiple times and it still isn't right.)

Ouch!

Well looks like my memory is a bit fuzzy then :p

Either Way, I mostly just go there for the big bar char at the top. Their cumulative console sales data is usually fairly close because they adjust their numbers each month to make them more and more accurate.

I think I compared Sony's PS4 numbers to their's back when Sony announced 3M, and 7M sold, and they were very close.
 
Amazes me people largely believe the PS4 will be beating out the XB1 still.

Really? It's price-cut month, there is always a boost with price cuts.
Why wouldn't it? There are reasons other than price why PS4 is consistently outselling the XBO globally.

Well here we go...

[PS4] 218K
[XBO] 121K
[WiiU] 132K
[3DS]80K
[PS3] 63K
[360] 85K
[Vita] LOL-K

XBO had a price cut but no new exclusive software to push along with it. WiiU has MK8 to help boost its numbers. I'll actually be legit shocked if WiiU doesn't outsell XBO for June NPD. I think it goes that June is usually stronger than May so I'll just be modest w/ my PS4 #s.
 
We've had this argument a million times on GAF. There is a reason it is banned. You'll do well to not bring it up on the forum. I also think it may help your guesstimate for NPDs if you ignore them.

For what it's worth. Their old numbers are accurate because they frequently revise numbers after real results are released.

ok, thanks.
Think I learned my lesson about mentioning them on here.
 

DayEnder

Member
I've said it before, I'll say it again. I really don't think price is the issue with the Xbone anymore. What if the consumer largely just isn't interested in the product, at least over the competition?

I agree with this. Price, although it can be important, definitely isn't the only factor in a purchase decision.

My first GAF NPD prediction:

[360] 54,000
[3DS] 97,000
[PS3] 46,000
[PS4] 207,000
[WIU] 133,000
[XB1] 138,000
 

Thanks, good read.

Sounds like they take market sales samples, and then extrapolate those numbers to come up with what is basically more or less an educated guess rather than solid numbers.

Also Interesting to hear how their sale estimates for bigger games are usually a bit closer than smaller games which can be over 100% off the actual numbers, ouch!
Guess I won't be referencing them again...
 
Target selling Kinectless Xbox One for $399 with $50 gift card starting July 20



I know It's only one retailer, but maybe Xbox One didn't do that good in June?

I posted about this a page or two back, but if you upgrade to XB1 (from PS3/360 only?), Microsoft will give you a $75 rebate. I wonder if this will still be applicable with this Target deal. If it is, you can essential get an XB1 for $274.99 (Plus tax).
 

Chobel

Member
I posted about this a page or two back, but if you upgrade to XB1 (from PS3/360 only?), Microsoft will give you a $75 rebate. I wonder if this will still be applicable with this Target deal. If it is, you can essential get an XB1 for $274.99 (Plus tax).

Wario64 said it is.

@Wario64
If you're one of the lucky people to have that $75 XBL credit with purchase of Xbox One, that's pretty much $125 in free money in some form
 
Huh. While this is a fantastic deal, I can't imagine the NPD results going Microsoft's way this month. They wouldn't be having deals such as this now. Maybe if it were closer to the holidays, but not now.
Yeah it's pretty sad to be honest; I've never seen a console drop in price so quickly after launch that was successful. And altho this isn't an actual "price drop", I've never seen a console get so many deals this early in its life-cycle that was successful.

NPD is going to put some folks on suicide watch.
 

AniHawk

Member
I posted about this a page or two back, but if you upgrade to XB1 (from PS3/360 only?), Microsoft will give you a $75 rebate. I wonder if this will still be applicable with this Target deal. If it is, you can essential get an XB1 for $274.99 (Plus tax).

...so i could get an xbox one for under $300 and still keep my 360 and its library?

that's pretty tempting. the xbox one has a library i'm interested in more than the ps4. at the same time i felt like i should get the xbox one used for shits and giggles. plus the games i want for either machine aren't going to be out yet for a couple of years, aside from sunset overdrive.
 
...so i could get an xbox one for under $300 and still keep my 360 and its library?

that's pretty tempting. the xbox one has a library i'm interested in more than the ps4. at the same time i felt like i should get the xbox one used for shits and giggles. plus the games i want for either machine aren't going to be out yet for a couple of years, aside from sunset overdrive.

I don't know how it works. I was under the assumption you send your old console as proof you're upgrading.
 

AniHawk

Member
It's a credit to spend on XBL not a rebate

well that would still mean sunset overdrive would be covered at least, plus one of those sweet sweet xbl games revealed at e3. it all factors into the cost.

i probably didn't get the promo code though.

I don't know how it works. I was under the assumption you send your old console as proof you're upgrading.

oh well in that case, bullshit unlocked.
 
well that would still mean sunset overdrive would be covered at least, plus one of those sweet sweet xbl games revealed at e3. it all factors into the cost.

i probably didn't get the promo code though.



oh well in that case, bullshit unlocked.

Don't take my word for it. Maybe it's as simple as typing in a console's bar code, especially if it's a 360, as it'd already be connected to an active XBL account.
 

AniHawk

Member
This might be more up your alley then. Open to everyone

Xbox One No Kinect with 12 Live & $100 gift card for $439

And then you could buy Sunset Overdrive with the gift card once Dell carries it

that's pretty good. unfortunately, stuff like ps+ and xbl gold have no value to me since i believe that multiplayer should be free.

the $40 would basically be tax where i live though. and i assume shipping can be free. really not a lot of mental gymnastics for this one. that's a good deal.
 
that's pretty good. unfortunately, stuff like ps+ and xbl gold have no value to me since i believe that multiplayer should be free.

the $40 would basically be tax where i live though. and i assume shipping can be free. really not a lot of mental gymnastics for this one. that's a good deal.

Presumably you could sell the 12 months of XBL on Gaf

Probably get $30 - $35 for it. It is a bit of hassle though
 
[PS4] 246K
[XB1] 120K
[3DS] 121K
[360] 71K
[WIU] 76K
[PS3] 45K

25% increase across the board for the longer month. Probably tweak them next week.

Edit: changed xbox.
 

Piggus

Member
Amazes me people largely believe the PS4 will be beating out the XB1 still.

Really? It's price-cut month, there is always a boost with price cuts.

Because all evidence points to that not happening. The only people buying are those that want their exclusives. Nobody else is going to pay the same price for a weaker system unless they simply don't know about the difference. But the fact of the matter is the average consumer isn't as dumb as gaf likes to believe.
 
[PS4] 246K
[XB1] 96K
[3DS] 121K
[360] 71K
[WIU] 76K
[PS3] 45K

25% increase across the board for the longer month. Probably tweak them next week.

If the real numbers are close to that, during a month where the XB1 gets a $100 price drop (technically a new SKU, as the launch SKU with Kinect is still $500), I don't know when (or if) XB1 will ever outsell the PS4 unless a major release like Halo 5 is coming soon. Then again, most thought Titanfall would do that for XB1. And I don't think any of the releases this fall (except for maybe Halo: Master Chief Collection) have system seller potential, not yet at least.
 
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