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[Saberus]

when pc games easily get into the 120+ FPS range was really hoping 60 would be the norm this gen. Really disappointing.

4k 60fps and RT in a console?...hahahhahaa... your being funny correct? PC's can't do that yet, soon they will but not now.. so maybe if they lower the resolution and use some new kind of reconstruction method. or just turn off the RT effects, seems like most Sony first party games will have a feature like this. 30/60

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Out of context gotchas strike again!

 

[Azurro]

I never said that. Get your facts straight. I haven't even seen HFW gameplay. Don't start that shit again.

Oh, look, it's the expert, Mr. "Horizon Zero Dawn on PC will look better than Forbidden West on PS5". Hey man, how is it going?

On topic, the game looks incredible. The assets are not too above what PS4 can do, but all the stuff happening on screen elevates it significantly, as well as the improved animation and lighting. Can't wait to get it.

 

[VFXVeteran]

I've insulted you? Not seeing it. I didn't argue it down, I asked you what PC is required to hit those targets on the specific game we were arguing about, which was also asked in the post you were replying to. You were evading the argument I was making about consoles punching above their weight which can be proven by comparing them to their PC equivalent parts. Which of the criteria you listed for a game being next-gen isn't met by this game, btw?

I'll tell you what I see.

1) The RT reflections are used very sparringly. It's not on every shiny surface and it makes the scene look odd. You got some surfaces using SSR and some using Cubemaps.

2) Ratchet doesn't even have real fur. Not in cinematics and certainly not while controlling the main hero.

3) The transitions to worlds isn't happening "instantly". It actually takes a couple of seconds (just a nitpick).

4) A lot of the particles and destruction disappear way too quickly. That shows the PS5's lack of bandwidth and storage to hold those things in memory longer.

5) The FX don't appear in reflections.

6) There is PBR of shaders but we've seen that all last gen.

Overall it's not doing anything new accept the fast load times. Graphically it's par for the course with some great art direction. One thing I hope you guys can take away from this though is how clean the image looks in native 4k. That alone should give you stricter requirements that your games not use any kind of checkerboard rendering. It truly takes away from the quality of the render.

 

[Airbus Jr]

I love seeing Explosive Zombie and VFW arguing each other like a pair of lover

So sexy, you guys are so made for each other waiting for your vids on brazzers

 

[jaysius]

It's so simple to fake this "dimension shifting" that they're showing in the latest gameplay, it's just another part of the map, it's simply displayed differently, to make it appear as another entirely different map.

I love R&C but I'm finding it hard to be sold an entirely new system based on this gameplay video.

It's good that it hasn't changed at all, but there's always room for IPs to EVOLVE a little, again this "dimension shifting" is just a clever programing trick to appear like you're loading into a different map with the POWER OF SSD.

Even in this over rehearsed section, there's still some noticeable slow down, if they can't make their bite of gameplay flawless and this is their showcase, this isn't encouraging for the rest of the product.

 

[Max_Po]

It's so simple to fake this "dimension shifting" that they're showing in the latest gameplay, it's just another part of the map, it's simply displayed differently, to make it appear as another entirely different map.

I love R&C but I'm finding it hard to be sold an entirely new system based on this gameplay video.

It's good that it hasn't changed at all, but there's always room for IPs to EVOLVE a little, again this "dimension shifting" is just a clever programing trick to appear like you're loading into a different map with the POWER OF SSD.

Even in this over rehearsed section, there's still some noticeable slow down, if they can't make their bite of gameplay flawless and this is their showcase, this isn't encouraging for the rest of the product.

Patheic. .. ...


The "franchise" has been the same since 2002. Try coming up with something better.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

I love seeing Explosive Zombie and VFW arguing each other like a pair of lover

So sexy, you guys are so made for each other waiting for your vids on brazzers

I think he's a good poster and a good guy, I like it when he posts more technical posts but his frustrations humanize him as well. He should know I don't mean any harm, I was one of the few people to tell him he should do a video series on the visuals of PS5 games as they release. Sometimes I push too hard but my posts are always about the potential insight he can give us instead of getting dragged into more petty squabbles. It happens to all of us, though, professional or not.

 

[MastaKiiLA]

It's so simple to fake this "dimension shifting" that they're showing in the latest gameplay, it's just another part of the map, it's simply displayed differently, to make it appear as another entirely different map.

I love R&C but I'm finding it hard to be sold an entirely new system based on this gameplay video.

It's good that it hasn't changed at all, but there's always room for IPs to EVOLVE a little, again this "dimension shifting" is just a clever programing trick to appear like you're loading into a different map with the POWER OF SSD.

Even in this over rehearsed section, there's still some noticeable slow down, if they can't make their bite of gameplay flawless and this is their showcase, this isn't encouraging for the rest of the product.

A few points. First of all, I don't think there was ever any slowdown in either gameplay demo. I think it's just the camera switching from the straight-on perspective through the portal, to a slightly lower angle when he enters the world. I might be wrong, as I'm not scanning the entire scene for every detail. I just tried looking for what was creating that weird hitch, and it looks to me like it's an abrupt camera shift. They should be able to smooth that out, by having the camera smoothly change to the new angle, instead of having it happen instantly. It's like closing one eye, and then the other. Your perspective changes very abruptly, but you're not really changing the speed of what you're seeing. Again, maybe I'm wrong.

Franchises can evolve, but what do you really want R&C to evolve to? The draw for me has always been the weapons, platforming, and destruction. I'm pretty sure the devs themselves tout these very features for the franchise, since day 1. Looks like they're hitting those same marks with this game. This isn't a game that gets updated yearly or anything. I don't know if there's been an excess of R&C gameplay either. It's kind of a unique game in that you don't really find the same experience anywhere else. So I'm fine with the delivering a tried-and-true formula for launch. Having a game of this quality around launch is a good thing, not a bad thing. You don't really get the revolutionary titles at launch, Nintendo being the rare exception.

In the end, it might not be your cup of tea, and that's fine. I just think your expectations might be a bit high, given the circumstances. What you're looking for will be coming in 2021. Holiday 2020 is going to be about banker games that provide next-gen visuals, but with proven gameplay mechanics. All IMO.

 

[eyesabitdull]

Wow. I can't believe you Sony guys are that excited over the looks of this game. You immediately call it "next-gen" worthy for what exactly? RT reflections and fast loading of levels? I can already see that the criteria for "next-gen worthy" must be it's only available on the PS5 so I guess that culls out pretty much every single 3rd party game coming in next-gen.

The game looks good though. Nice art style and I love the abundant FX (i.e. smoke, particles, etc..). It looks like it'll be fun to play.

God forbid we get excited at the first real look at what next generation games could look like

Is it the end game of what it might look like by the end of the next generation? No.

But it is an indication.

 

[longdi]

Im sure as an industry veteran, it irks VFX when she sees 'pixar quality' being thrown about.
Even i, a normal gamer, do not believe stills of RC looks anywhere near pixar levels. Something about how the models are lit and the density of the polygons, they still look flat if comparing to CGI from pixar

 

[Mr. PlayStation]

Good god this gamescom demo was just amazing to watch. It had the reveal trailer bits and the ps5 event extended gameplay bits all sandwiched together with no interruption. Even the hitches seen in the ps5 reveal event was all gone in the gamescom build.

 

[eyesabitdull]

Im sure as an industry veteran, it irks VFX when she sees 'pixar quality' being thrown about.
Even i, a normal gamer, do not believe stills of RC looks anywhere near pixar levels. Something about how the models are lit and the density of the polygons, they still look flat if comparing to CGI from pixar

I think it comes down to what era of Pixar you're referring to.

I don't think any video game will ever catch up to a modern day Pixar film ever because Pixar will improve upon the technology for their animated films with each iteration every year.

I believe when those who say "it looks like a Pixar film!" they're referring to Pixar films 10 - 15 years ago as a reference.

Which is, in a sense, understandable.

 

[JTCx]

I'll tell you what I see.

1) The RT reflections are used very sparringly. It's not on every shiny surface and it makes the scene look odd. You got some surfaces using SSR and some using Cubemaps.

2) Ratchet doesn't even have real fur. Not in cinematics and certainly not while controlling the main hero.

3) The transitions to worlds isn't happening "instantly". It actually takes a couple of seconds (just a nitpick).

4) A lot of the particles and destruction disappear way too quickly. That shows the PS5's lack of bandwidth and storage to hold those things in memory longer.

5) The FX don't appear in reflections.

6) There is PBR of shaders but we've seen that all last gen.

Overall it's not doing anything new accept the fast load times. Graphically it's par for the course with some great art direction. One thing I hope you guys can take away from this though is how clean the image looks in native 4k. That alone should give you stricter requirements that your games not use any kind of checkerboard rendering. It truly takes away from the quality of the render.

Breh, PBR is here to stay its not going anywhere. Its now the standard. All next gen games moving forward is going to be using PBR, unless there some new shit I'm not aware of. Next gen is going to be all about pushing resolution, framerate, lighting, asset streaming, more complex rigs and animations and most in the 3D community will agree. All current gen games can push hundreds and hundreds of blendshapes right now and with next gen theres possibilities of even more, imagine that. You can already see the improved animations in this demo, the line between game/film animation gets blurry year after year. So yeah people arent far fetched when they say "pixar" levels. Now if you'll excuse me, i gotta finish up some proxy meshes for upcoming tv show. Yeah, im flexing.

 

[Rentahamster]

So glad it was real. I'm so excited for this game.

 

[longdi]

I think it comes down to what era of Pixar you're referring to.

I don't think any video game will ever catch up to a modern day Pixar film ever because Pixar will improve upon the technology for their animated films with each iteration every year.

I believe when those who say "it looks like a Pixar film!" they're referring to Pixar films 10 - 15 years ago as a reference.

Which is, in a sense, understandable.

Until games start having hires RT, imo even 10 years old pixar CGI still look better.

Something about games lighting look dull and flat, even in photo mode.

for VFX to correct me

 

[Danjin44]

I don't think any video game will ever catch up to a modern day Pixar film ever because Pixar will improve upon the technology for their animated films with each iteration every year.

Mostly because there no game running behind CGI movies, they have full control over what they want to show you, they don't even need worry about the animation looking good in all direction.

 

[Orpheum]

I'm so glad we're fighting nefarius again. best villain in the entire franchise

 

[eyesabitdull]

Until games start having hires RT, imo even 10 years old pixar CGI still look better.

Something about games lighting look dull and flat, even in photo mode.

for VFX to correct me

Oh I don't disagree!

I merely said I can understand, in a sense, where it's coming from.

It won't be 1:1 to any Pixar film - but it has this sense that it "feels and looks" like one.

 

[tusharngf]

Raytracing looks little off in the demo.

 

[nowhat]

Mostly because there no game running behind CGI movies, they have full control over what they want to show you, they don't even need worry about the animation looking good in all direction.

There's also the render farms doing all the hard work... even without the game part, the amount of computing power available for any given frame is just incomparable.

But while I'm hesitant to use a term like "this looks like Pixar", the demo here looks very much like a CGI cartoon, I don't think there's any way to deny that.

 

[SlimySnake]

Ah i see TheGreatWhiteShark is here, and he can't see my posts because I'm on his ignores list

Me too!!!

 

[SlimySnake]

when pc games easily get into the 120+ FPS range was really hoping 60 would be the norm this gen. Really disappointing.

this game is native 4k 30 fps. expect it to have a performance mode that runs at 1440p 60 fps or 1080p 60 fps at worse.

the zen 2 cpu will not be a bottleneck like the jaguars were last gen and downgrading the resolution by half should easily afford them to render at twice the framerate.

out of the five big AAA PS5 first party games shown, three have had 60 fps modes confirmed. spiderman, demon and gt7. 60 fps ratchet should be easily doable at 1440p if their engine is able to get an open world game running at 4kcb 60 fps.

 

[Kenneth Haight]

Best thing shown on ONL by far. Why were the giving awards to Watch Dogs Legion And Star Wars Squadrons? They’re not even out....... embarrassing that whole awards bit.

 

[longdi]

this game is native 4k 30 fps. expect it to have a performance mode that runs at 1440p 60 fps or 1080p 60 fps at worse.

the zen 2 cpu will not be a bottleneck like the jaguars were last gen and downgrading the resolution by half should easily afford them to render at twice the framerate.

out of the five big AAA PS5 first party games shown, three have had 60 fps modes confirmed. spiderman, demon and gt7. 60 fps ratchet should be easily doable at 1440p if their engine is able to get an open world game running at 4kcb 60 fps.

I wish amd have similar tensor cores special sauce. It would have made 4kdlss/60 much possible throughout next gen

 

[nowhat]

Best thing shown on ONL by far. Why were the giving awards to Watch Dogs Legion And Star Wars Squadrons? They’re not even out....... embarrassing that whole awards bit.

Yeah, the awards were super weird - I haven't watched Gamescom streams before, has this always been a thing? They seemed so out of place and strange (like, best PS game, Cyberpunk - what?)

 

[DavidGzz]

Very nice! Never been into these games but it's great to see the step up in graphics!

 

[sinnergy]

Raytracing looks little off in the demo.

It looks that it’s off. To be honest . Has it been downgraded or a bug?

 

[Rea]

A lot of the particles and destruction disappear way too quickly.

Thank god it disappeared quickly, if not, it will look more messy than it already is.

 

[Rea]

I think he's a good poster and a good guy, I like it when he posts more technical posts but his frustrations humanize him as well. He should know I don't mean any harm, I was one of the few people to tell him he should do a video series on the visuals of PS5 games as they release. Sometimes I push too hard but my posts are always about the potential insight he can give us instead of getting dragged into more petty squabbles. It happens to all of us, though, professional or not.

VFXVeteran guy is a cool guy, he is knowledgeable and smart. But only when he can remove his ego and PCMR fanboyism. And the amount of downplaying the Sony's studios are ridiculous. I don't know why he hates them so much.

 

[mcjmetroid]

It looks like Ratchet and Clank... So meh from me I'm afraid.

Looks nice though but not really a next gen feeling game to me. Guess it would help if I was a big fan of their games or any Imsoniac games for that matter.

Something about their games never clicked with me.

 

[TonyK]

when pc games easily get into the 120+ FPS range was really hoping 60 would be the norm this gen. Really disappointing.

Easily? What games, resolution o level of detail? Because I play on PC at 4K and I must cap almost all AAA games to 30fps to play them smoothly.

I understand you can play Overwatch or Destiny at 120fps, but something like Red Dead Redemption II or Assassin's Creed Odyssey at native 4K don't sustain 120fps in any master race PC, imagine on a peasant Pc.

However, I totally agree that in this gen games should offer at least two options: 4k30fps and 2K60fps, even 1080p120fps for those than prioritize responsiveness over graphic fidelity.

 

[Stooky]

Until games start having hires RT, imo even 10 years old pixar CGI still look better.

Something about games lighting look dull and flat, even in photo mode.

for VFX to correct me

I doubt know about old pixar. Current Pixar no way

 

[Cyborg]

4K videos/screens wauw! Looks so good! Can't wait.

 

[DGrayson]

I really dont understand why in this Rachet and Clank thread half of the posts are talking about Halo and Microsoft.

Fucking hell its embarrassing.

Everyone get back on the actual topic or thread will be locked and users will be banned.

 

[Md Ray]

to close this out, are you honest enough to admit that you couldn't get gameplay screengrabs where ratchet is moving in any direction but forward that there is not significant blur?
its not like I asked you to re-invent the wheel. just a test for your eyes because you trolled me about my 30fps blur comment, remember?

so what's it gonna be?

I've already said this. They've added lots of post-processing effects to give it that CG-look. Without them, it would look flat and bland. I suggest you educate yourself a thing or two about the depth of field, motion blurs, and how it works my friend. The game's using very high-quality camera motion blur as well as per-object motion blur. So, of course, any character movement is going to show trails in still shots due to per object MB. And camera movement will show every object to leave trails in still shots due to camera MB. That's how it works in real life.

Motion blur in RL:

A very good e.g. of motion blur in action:

A very good e.g. of DoF in action:

Water, grass and the tree on left, and the building in the bg are out of focus, even Ratchet's feet are out of focus. What is in focus is the enemy you're shooting, and the particles coming out of your gun. This adds depth to the scene.

 

[seanoff]

I doubt know about old pixar. Current Pixar no way

Yes. But Pixar can spend hrs processing a frame with a farm of processing power. Not 1/30th or 1/60th of a second on a cpu and gpu.

according to slashfilm.com Pixar have a server farm with 3000 and up to 5000 blades After hrs when they can add workstations to mix. According to Pixar science behind Pixar they are taking 24 hrs a frame. The frame rate whores here would find that difficult

 

[Md Ray]

I really dont understand why in this Rachet and Clank thread half of the posts are talking about Halo and Microsoft.

I'm sorry. I will refrain from doing that.

 

[TonyK]

I've already said this. They've added lots of post-processing effects to give it that CG-look. Without them, it would look flat and bland. I suggest you educate yourself a thing or two about the depth of field, motion blurs, and how it works my friend. The game's using very high-quality camera motion blur as well as per-object motion blur. So, of course, any character movement is going to show trails in still shots due to per object MB. And camera movement will show every object to leave trails in still shots due to camera MB. That's how it works in real life.

Motion blur in RL:

A very good e.g. of motion blur in action:

A very good e.g. of DoF in action:

Water, grass and the tree on left, and the building in the bg are out of focus, even Ratchet's feet are out of focus. What is in focus is the enemy you're shooting, and the particles coming out of your gun. This adds depth to a scene.

I love per-object motion blur effect. In fact is one of the effects I feel more "next gen" (when used in this gen, I mean).

In fact, this effect is the one I miss more from the Horizon Zero Dawn port to PC. Characters, specially Alloy running, looks poor/old in movement because the lack of this.
Per-object motion blur (different from camera movement motion blur) gives a CGI look & feel to graphics.

 

[Md Ray]

Wow. I can't believe you Sony guys are that excited over the looks of this game. You immediately call it "next-gen" worthy for what exactly? RT reflections and fast loading of levels? I can already see that the criteria for "next-gen worthy" must be it's only available on the PS5 so I guess that culls out pretty much every single 3rd party game coming in next-gen.

The game looks good though. Nice art style and I love the abundant FX (i.e. smoke, particles, etc..). It looks like it'll be fun to play.

What's your point exactly?

 

[ZywyPL]

Not much new has been shown, but the shotty, that damn shotty! Insomniac surely knows how to make fun weapons. And it's confirmed to be a launch title along with Spider-Man, buying IG was undoubtedly one of Sony's best acquisitions ever.

 

[Zoro7]

Best example of what the next gen consoles are capable of SO FAR. Yet you will always get people hating.
I am super stoked that this is a launch window title. Hopefully that means Q1 2021.

 

[Rentahamster]

RE: Toy Story 1 quality - R&C comes really damn close. Hell, even Kingdom Hearts 3 did a great job on PS4.

 

[GymWolf]

The game looks gorgeous indeed

 

[bellome]

I'll tell you what I see.

1) The RT reflections are used very sparringly. It's not on every shiny surface and it makes the scene look odd. You got some surfaces using SSR and some using Cubemaps.

2) Ratchet doesn't even have real fur. Not in cinematics and certainly not while controlling the main hero.

3) The transitions to worlds isn't happening "instantly". It actually takes a couple of seconds (just a nitpick).

4) A lot of the particles and destruction disappear way too quickly. That shows the PS5's lack of bandwidth and storage to hold those things in memory longer.

5) The FX don't appear in reflections.

6) There is PBR of shaders but we've seen that all last gen.

Overall it's not doing anything new accept the fast load times. Graphically it's par for the course with some great art direction. One thing I hope you guys can take away from this though is how clean the image looks in native 4k. That alone should give you stricter requirements that your games not use any kind of checkerboard rendering. It truly takes away from the quality of the render.

 

[Shodan09]

It looks really good! The rift bits were quite disappointing in that they seem very short and linear, but that might have just been to show a variety of worlds for this demo. Hopefully there's more to that mechanic as that will wear thin quickly. Using them during normal gameplay to zip around the level is pretty cool but you don't need an SSD for that.

 

[INC]

VFXVeteran

What games you worked on dude?

 

[GymWolf]

Other than it being the only option, in what instance is 30fps better? Set your fanboyism aside. Why would you intentionally punish yourself? When given the option you are choosing to have half the information. Makes no sense.

And no shit it's my opinion. It's also shared by many people who enjoy playing games.

That cinematic feeling...i hope ND introduce a 24fps mode to get even more cinematic

Btw you can choose 60 fps in tlou remastered, i did the second run at 60 and it's much better (obviously)

 

[sendit]

It looks really good! The rift bits were quite disappointing in that they seem very short and linear, but that might have just been to show a variety of worlds for this demo. Hopefully there's more to that mechanic as that will wear thin quickly. Using them during normal gameplay to zip around the level is pretty cool but you don't need an SSD for that.

Care to explain? Unless you're loading all the data in to memory. You need an interface that can stream assets quickly to the VRAM.

edit. Nevermind, you are probably referring to the 'lasso portals'.

 

[Shodan09]

Care to explain? Unless you're loading all the data in to memory. You need an interface that can stream assets quickly to the VRAM.

edit. Nevermind, you are probably referring to the 'lasso portals'.

Well yeah, within the same level area you dont need to do that. The yellow portals are a few metres away from each other, basically like using the grappling hook in the arkham games.

Edit: just saw your edit, I should have made it clearer which portals I was talking about.