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Ratchet & Clank Rift Apart Day 1 Patch Adds Performance and Performance RT Modes

elliot5

Member
Actually, you are setting up yourself here. Wait for until the 8 where the review lift. You will have more footage and screen shot to look at.
Also, yes these 2 shot is kinda subpar compare to the direct screen grab from the state of play and it was not form Insomniac. I don't know how this guy screen cap this. Trust me, I don't know how you still doubt Insomniac when we have direct screen grab from sop.
I'm not doubting Insomniac... I've seen and played their work on PS5. There will always be ideal lighting conditions and levels they show in marketing material. There will be other areas, too. Even if fidelity mode looks gorgeous (it will, I've seen state of play and the hands off previews) it's not looking like the bullshots.

The point is in game cinematics are not gameplay. They may transition neatly and that's great. It doesn't mean the cinematics graphics are what you're getting when actually playing.
 
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THEAP99

Banned
I'm not doubting Insomniac... I've seen and played their work on PS5. There will always be ideal lighting conditions and levels they show in marketing material. There will be other areas, too. Even if fidelity mode looks gorgeous (it will, I've seen state of play and the hands off previews) it's not looking like the bullshots.

The point is in game cinematics are not gameplay. They may transition neatly and that's great. It doesn't mean the cinematics graphics are what you're getting when actually playing.
in-game cut scenes use the same exact assets and quality as gameplay dude. only difference is the lighting is more controlled obviously as it's a cut scene. whereas gameplay the lighting may be in non-ideal conditions at the time. chances are that the "bullshot" was taken in photo mode
 
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HotPocket69

Banned
Those two screen shots are all I needed to see to make me cancel my preorder of the special edition and I hope all of you do the same. Seems like Insomniac really dropped the ball here. Really tired of Sony pulling this shit on a regular basis with visuals. I bought this system to go to other worlds, not be stuck with decade old visuals. First the cross gen bs and now this. I just can’t take it anymore. I just can’t.
 

elliot5

Member
in-game cut scenes use the same exact assets and quality as gameplay dude. only difference is the lighting is more controlled obviously as it's a cut scene. whereas gameplay the lighting may be in non-ideal conditions at the time. chances are that the "bullshot" was taken in photo mode
Photo mode lets you change lighting and post processing (in spider man especially). And the assets aren't the same as gameplay.

This was what I first could find when trying to pull up a reference regarding Spider-Man swapping in higher quality assets in photo mode.


You can see his suit is higher detail in photo mode.

Now, yes, this wasn't the PS5 version bc it was discussed in spring 2020, but I'd be highly surprised if the gameplay model in remastered is the EXACT SAME. It's a waste of processing power to use the same models when they're taking up less screen space, I don't see why Insomniac would go that route. They swap out/transition the model extremely quickly when cutting into cinematic cutscenes. All games do.

I can't find a discussion around SM:MM on PS5 gameplay vs photo mode for better reference but if anyone has that they can share I'd like to read more.
 
Photo mode lets you change lighting and post processing (in spider man especially). And the assets aren't the same as gameplay.

This was what I first could find when trying to pull up a reference regarding Spider-Man swapping in higher quality assets in photo mode.


You can see his suit is higher detail in photo mode.

Now, yes, this wasn't the PS5 version bc it was discussed in spring 2020, but I'd be highly surprised if the gameplay model in remastered is the EXACT SAME. It's a waste of processing power to use the same models when they're taking up less screen space, I don't see why Insomniac would go that route. They swap out/transition the model extremely quickly when cutting into cinematic cutscenes. All games do.

I can't find a discussion around SM:MM on PS5 gameplay vs photo mode for better reference but if anyone has that they can share I'd like to read more.

That's a much better answer than those that claim it was done on a render farm. I don't think they would put "captured on PS5" if it didn't come from the hardware. Heck I remember they even distinguished the dev kits from the actual console with Godfall.
 

Vick

Member
Photo mode lets you change lighting and post processing (in spider man especially). And the assets aren't the same as gameplay.

This was what I first could find when trying to pull up a reference regarding Spider-Man swapping in higher quality assets in photo mode.


You can see his suit is higher detail in photo mode.

Now, yes, this wasn't the PS5 version bc it was discussed in spring 2020, but I'd be highly surprised if the gameplay model in remastered is the EXACT SAME. It's a waste of processing power to use the same models when they're taking up less screen space, I don't see why Insomniac would go that route. They swap out/transition the model extremely quickly when cutting into cinematic cutscenes. All games do.

I can't find a discussion around SM:MM on PS5 gameplay vs photo mode for better reference but if anyone has that they can share I'd like to read more.
Wasn't that, regarding those two suits, a known bug later addressed?

Assets do not change in Photo-Mode:

ggu9rqF.png


oF2q9eq.png







And this is the PS4 version, not the Remaster.
 

HAL-01

Member
Those two screen shots are all I needed to see to make me cancel my preorder of the special edition and I hope all of you do the same. Seems like Insomniac really dropped the ball here. Really tired of Sony pulling this shit on a regular basis with visuals. I bought this system to go to other worlds, not be stuck with decade old visuals. First the cross gen bs and now this. I just can’t take it anymore. I just can’t.
Lmao people are so dramatic
 

THEAP99

Banned
Those two screen shots are all I needed to see to make me cancel my preorder of the special edition and I hope all of you do the same. Seems like Insomniac really dropped the ball here. Really tired of Sony pulling this shit on a regular basis with visuals. I bought this system to go to other worlds, not be stuck with decade old visuals. First the cross gen bs and now this. I just can’t take it anymore. I just can’t.
well i mean the other screenshots look real good. i just think it's that one area that looks flat. they literally showed that area in the state of play as well, so I am unsure why now after that you'd cancel.
 
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elliot5

Member
That's a much better answer than those that claim it was done on a render farm. I don't think they would put "captured on PS5" if it didn't come from the hardware. Heck I remember they even distinguished the dev kits from the actual console with Godfall.
Yeah I haven't said they're offline cgi cutscenes. They're clearly in engine live stuff, which is impressive in its own right. They're still making the assets and doing all the work to make it look that good. It's also why they are able to swap to cutscenes without transitions like god of war.

It's just like Returnal was "captured on PS5" in trailers when she is crash landing at the beginning of a loop or the start of the game. That may be "captured" and maybe even in engine, idk, but it's definitely not "in game".
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Those two screen shots are all I needed to see to make me cancel my preorder of the special edition and I hope all of you do the same. Seems like Insomniac really dropped the ball here. Really tired of Sony pulling this shit on a regular basis with visuals. I bought this system to go to other worlds, not be stuck with decade old visuals. First the cross gen bs and now this. I just can’t take it anymore. I just can’t.
??

Same area:

6gW6Pxw.gif


WKSSqlm.gif
 

GHG

Member
Has anyone figured out the source of those screenshots posted on the last page yet?

They are 2048x1152 .jpg images.

Anyone got any direct feed .png images?

I don't understand why we have to go through this same shite every time there's a new game release. Post direct feed high quality images and state your source or fuck off.
 
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Kangx

Member
Those two screen shots are all I needed to see to make me cancel my preorder of the special edition and I hope all of you do the same. Seems like Insomniac really dropped the ball here. Really tired of Sony pulling this shit on a regular basis with visuals. I bought this system to go to other worlds, not be stuck with decade old visuals. First the cross gen bs and now this. I just can’t take it anymore. I just can’t.
Not when they had the whole state of play a few weeks ago. 2 bad screen shots obviously tip you over. Sound logical to me. This post like a troll post instead of over reaction.
 
The url's would suggest they are from twitter but until he tells us who originally posted them then it will remain a mystery.

Even the HUD is pixelated and has artifacting ffs.

Reading through this tweet it says that more than just resolution is affected between the different modes.



It's possible that the screens look a little worse because they are from peformance mode instead of fidelity mode. But without that information from O OneTruth I don't know which one it is.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Yeah I haven't said they're offline cgi cutscenes. They're clearly in engine live stuff, which is impressive in its own right. They're still making the assets and doing all the work to make it look that good. It's also why they are able to swap to cutscenes without transitions like god of war.

It's just like Returnal was "captured on PS5" in trailers when she is crash landing at the beginning of a loop or the start of the game. That may be "captured" and maybe even in engine, idk, but it's definitely not "in game".
Cutscenes will always look better. Even realtime cutscenes. You can really up the detail and lighting quality because the GPU is freed up from running game logic. this was true last gen. it's true this gen.

the cinematic screenshot you linked will look the same on the PS5 during a cutscene. So captured on PS5 is true there and not dishonest.

atrmH3f.gif


a02de99d663f47ae87524cc19273d3ac1f427a77.gifv
 
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THEAP99

Banned
@JeremyEtcetera

Yeah, kinda surprisingly, CoD sp has some of the best faces out there, Farah looks incredible and ME authentic because Kurdish women really did a lot of fighting in wars there. Sigh… Modern Warfare is literally perfect game.

Those gifs are probably the fidelity mode. Maybe those screenshots are from performance mode?

But knowing B Bittermich I don't expect him to tell us where they came from.

The url's would suggest they are from twitter but until he tells us who originally posted them then it will remain a mystery.

Even the HUD is pixelated and has artifacting ffs.
They came from IMGUR this morning. I literally posted it at like 11 AM EST in one of these threads. It was clearly from someone with an early copy and there were many other images in that gallery. But it has since been deleted of course. The original came from reddit and here are some more images from that gallery




here are some more screenshots that were a part of the gallery

E3PKPQ_XoAIBscn

z-hkvQNM.png

E3PKO6aXEAIaVz8

E3OpdyFXoAAOPs2
 
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DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Okay, but let's not be so flippant that The Medium is "just split screen", as if split-screen and full-scene replacement and anything like this is "easy"...

RectangularImmediateAmethystinepython-size_restricted.gif


What R&C Rift Apart is doing could not have been done before because entirely new level data just could never load in that fast, but I actually could think of cases where The Medium's approach would be beneficial still to the developers. Like in this case above, the way the do that full-screen effect I believe is they have two concurrent versions of the game running simultaneously, one in the real world and one in the horror world, and you would even have two characters walking the path at the same time synced to the controller. Limits are severe, because you can only stress the memory and processor just half as much as a regular game (or less, realistically) in order to have both areas running in parallel to switch back to. So, that's bad. However, do it and the work (and sacrifice) is already done. The action is already synched, the two halves of the levels are built, and you found a way to squeeze it all in. So now, you can just go wild. The character is already on the road in both cases, running at the same speed as you hold the controller, and so the developer can flash back and forth whenever they want because the two sequences are perfectly aligned. Just put little flashes of color or smear to hide the transition and you flip between them in an instance. So long as there's a limiter to not let you flash when you're walking over a cliff or an enemy is in the way (which you can know because, again, the other world you're about to flash to does indeed exist and they can check that before it makes the flash happen,) you can mess with this sequence as much as you want.



Compare that to the Rivet sequence we see in this video. Rivet comes up on the rift crystal, hits it, and the whole game pauses. It's just the briefest of seconds, but the whole game has to stop because, well, there kind of is no game to play in between the moment where the one level goes away and the new level appears.

WLEgkn@facebook.gif


Or you can do the other thing Rift Apart does where Ratchet falls into a purple void of levels, where he flips up in the air and cartwheels through a big open void of rift shards until one pops up. Again, there is no game to play there because the level data has been thrown out and the game is streaming a new level in as fast as possible, so in the meantime, you get almost a "loading screen" of the rift shards. Unlike The Medium, R&C Rift Apart is not playing two games at once, and so the game does not have the stage that Ratchet will end up on loaded up until he gets there; until he arrives, the wheels have to spin idly. It also has difficulty seamlessly stitching momentum and character placement and anticipation of action on the other side because it doesn't have that other level yet loaded and it may not know what you'll be playing on until you get there.

Rift Apart does seem to have a variety of ways of stitching levels together (not all Purple Rifts are equal,) and in sequences that they call Pocket Dimensions, the transitions are totally seamless ala the Portal games (which you can do if the rift-entry and rift-exit points are specifically matched up and timed right ahead of tiem,) so hopefully there's a lot of those because those are super cool to watch. However, it looks like there are just times in the game where it has to pause and wait, even if it is an extremely brief wait.

(BTW, the new footage is kind of weird, because even when Rivet pulls a Yellow Rift to the same area, it still pauses, I'm not sure if that's just a player convenience or what the case is?)



Now, with the R&C approach, it's just plain cooler. What wasn't there is now there, and detail is at full glory because you don't need to keep the level you just left. And also, some clever tricks could be used to use the bridge between worlds as a benefit even if there's a level-change pause. (Like imagine if this whole pirate ship from the demo fell into a void in the middle of your battle, and when it lands, instead of the sea the ship and everybody aboard is sliding down that ramp about to fly over a cliff, and suddenly you're caring less about fighting the pirates and more about getting off this thing before it flings into an abyss? Same pirate level, same ground that Ratchet was standing on the whole time, but the physics changes from flat ocean to falling danger and also the objective changes too, all the while the visuals and lighting change all around to convey the change of location to a very dangerous predicament.) You can do more with this approach, and it's great that we have a console that is capable of doing this. But, there are drawbacks to not doing it the old-fashioned way (I'm actually surprised that Ratchet uses no parallel world loads, because Insomniac is a company that always keeps a good trick handy even if it has an even better trick to play,) and it will probably take even more experimentation with fast-SSD rift loading like this to achieve the same kinds of transitions in a R&C sequel as you would in a Medium sequel.

The I/O has nothing to do with what The Medium is doing, hence it runs on an HDD.

The I/O has everything to do with what R&C is doing, that was the point.
 
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Vick

Member
Those gifs are probably the fidelity mode. Maybe those screenshots are from performance mode?
There's RT in them, and AF looks lacking. They probably are from Performance RT.
But also look at the HUD, those screens are awful all around.

Not when they had the whole state of play a few weeks ago. 2 bad screen shots obviously tip you over. Sound logical to me. This post like a troll post instead of over reaction.
I think it is?

On R&C:
Def will determine whether or not I wait for it to be on GamePass

On Forbidden West:
Will wait until it hits GamePass
 

GHG

Member
They came from IMGUR this morning. I literally posted it at like 11 AM EST in one of these threads. It was clearly from someone with an early copy and there were many other images in that gallery. But it has since been deleted of course. The original came from reddit and here are some more images from that gallery




here are some more screenshots that were a part of the gallery

E3PKPQ_XoAIBscn

z-hkvQNM.png

E3PKO6aXEAIaVz8

E3OpdyFXoAAOPs2


One of those images you posted is 846x491 in resolution...
 

THEAP99

Banned
shittyreactions GIF


Reminds me of the first time I saw the HFW gameplay demo. It was much better once I saw the 4K YouTube version.
i think reviews are Tuesday so once the flood gates open you'll see plenty. and maybe these people with early copies will leak some more actual high def footage.

 
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elliot5

Member
Cutscenes will always look better. Even realtime cutscenes. You can really up the detail and lighting quality because the GPU is freed up from running game logic. this was true last gen. it's true this gen.

the cinematic screenshot you linked will look the same on the PS5 during a cutscene. So captured on PS5 is true there and not dishonest.

atrmH3f.gif


a02de99d663f47ae87524cc19273d3ac1f427a77.gifv
No, I get that. It's rendered in engine in real time. It looks great. Insomniac has done amazing work. It's just people think that's what is seen 1:1 when you are controlling the character. That's why they're using them for marketing, because they look great and can skirt the "captured on PS5" tagline, making it seem like that's the fidelity you're getting during gameplay. I would consider that a bullshot, even if it's in engine.

It's fine to acknowledge the amazing work Insomniac has done. It's just silly to expect cinematic level graphics when moving through the levels. There will be levels that look great, but it's still not quite the same.
 

GHG

Member
No, I get that. It's rendered in engine in real time. It looks great. Insomniac has done amazing work. It's just people think that's what is seen 1:1 when you are controlling the character. That's why they're using them for marketing, because they look great and can skirt the "captured on PS5" tagline, making it seem like that's the fidelity you're getting during gameplay. I would consider that a bullshot, even if it's in engine.

It's fine to acknowledge the amazing work Insomniac has done. It's just silly to expect cinematic level graphics when moving through the levels. There will be levels that look great, but it's still not quite the same.

How many crows do you want for dinner for the rest of the week?

You can have them all on one day or we can spread them out over a period of time if that's easier?

Hope you're hungry.
 

THEAP99

Banned
Insomniac developers have been very confident in the visuals of this game

'

I just wonder how long the game is gonna be and if we have see most of the parts with a lot of visual flair like the city
 
So someone on reddit posted the description of each performance mode.


- Fidelity: This is a 30 frames per second mode with graphical features like ray-tracing, enhanced lighting, additional VFX and increased scene density. It present a 4K-resolution picture. This is the default.

- Performance RT: This is a 60 frames per second mode which includes ray-tracing. It present a lower-resolution picture with adjusted lightning, VFX and scene density.

- Performance: This is an alternate version of the 60 frames per second "Performance RT" mode, additionally removing ray-tracing in favour of increased picture resolution.
 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
After playing Spiderman Miles in native 4k 30 fps, and in their performance RT mode at 1440p 60 fps version, I would not recommend the 60 fps version on the first playthrough.

The traffic and NPC density took a big hit in the performance RT version. the resolution didnt bother me that much, but you could tell there was a downgrade in visuals. I have no idea why things cant scale down 1:1 on the PS5 for a game that runs at native 4k 30 fps. Thats how it works on PCs. You reduce the resolution by half, you double your framerate. why do they have to reduce lighting, detail and NPCs just to hit 60 fps in RT mode? I dont know.

the regular 60 fps version is actually the version i'd recommend on NG+ or platinum playthroughs. Yes, it doesnt have RT but frankly the increased resolution and detail in Miles made it look much better than the Performance RT mode.
 
Insomniac developers have been very confident in the visuals of this game

'

I just wonder how long the game is gonna be and if we have see most of the parts with a lot of visual flair like the city


Looking at some of the respondes some are claiming there's a massive downgrade. I'm going to wait and see if that's even true.
 

Rea

Member
Photo mode lets you change lighting and post processing (in spider man especially). And the assets aren't the same as gameplay.

This was what I first could find when trying to pull up a reference regarding Spider-Man swapping in higher quality assets in photo mode.


You can see his suit is higher detail in photo mode.

Now, yes, this wasn't the PS5 version bc it was discussed in spring 2020, but I'd be highly surprised if the gameplay model in remastered is the EXACT SAME. It's a waste of processing power to use the same models when they're taking up less screen space, I don't see why Insomniac would go that route. They swap out/transition the model extremely quickly when cutting into cinematic cutscenes. All games do.

I can't find a discussion around SM:MM on PS5 gameplay vs photo mode for better reference but if anyone has that they can share I'd like to read more.
The only difference i found is lower poly model vs higher poly model, texture quality is the same.
 

Kangx

Member
Some people are posting 240p images (I kid you not) in response to him.

Internet Chinese whispers is the best.
Lol, it's not like this game doesn't have media exposure before release. They just had SOP a few weeks ago. They kept posting gameplay gifs on their Twitter feeds to the point I got tire of it. This is so bizarre. If this game look like the new screen shots post here, then good job Insomniac. We have been bamboozled, hoodwinked, deceived by Insomniac. All the showings previously were on ps6 by the way. S/
 
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Dr Bass

Member
I personally wouldn't be surprised if there was a decent "downgrade" to hit 60fps in Performance RT mode. I think what they've shown so far in the state of play looks fantastically good. If the difference was minor to where you could hardly tell the difference .. why wouldn't Performance RT just be "normal" mode?

Might be playing this one at 30fps myself, unlike what I did with Spiderman and Demon's Souls. We shall see.
 
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